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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-22-2010, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenmoonshine
Break these welders down, part by part, and tell me what the differences are.
Diode's, capacitor's, transformer's, rectifiers, potentiometer's, fan, switches.... etc.
Wonder where they all source there parts from
tons of diffrences. even IF the components are the same, that does not mean the quality or construction is the same. several factors, circuitry, design of many parts ect..., .. if your expecting your blue HF box to be a Lincoln ( or any name brand ) in a diffrent box and painted a diffrent color then you will be dissapointed.. it might work just fine for you and provide years of trouble free service.. but even so, it is not, and will never be comparable to any brand name welder

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt167
it is not, and will never be comparable to any brand name welder
Well said

Last edited by greenmoonshine; 01-22-2010 at 10:20 PM.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 01-23-2010, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt167
tons of diffrences. even IF the components are the same, that does not mean the quality or construction is the same. several factors, circuitry, design of many parts ect..., .. if your expecting your blue HF box to be a Lincoln ( or any name brand ) in a diffrent box and painted a diffrent color then you will be dissapointed.. it might work just fine for you and provide years of trouble free service.. but even so, it is not, and will never be comparable to any brand name welder


Absolutely! There is no comparison between the HF welder and a "Name brand"!


Quote:
Originally Posted by greenmoonshine
Break these welders down, part by part, and tell me what the differences are.
Diode's, capacitor's, transformer's, rectifiers, potentiometer's, fan, switches.... etc.


Sure they may share similar types of parts but if you open one up no one will have to show you the differences between the cheap welders and quality welders. The difference is the size and quality of these components, for example they will both contain transformers but look at the difference in size of the darn things! Take a look at how they are built, plastic where metal should be used, etc, big differences!

I had a couple of positive things to say about that welder based on having seen one do OK and hold up for a long time BUT that in no way means they are even close to the quality or capability of a "real" welder. If a person is willing to accept the limitations of these things and take a chance on the durability then they can work for light duty welding but make no mistake they are NOT going to come even close to performing like a Miller, Lincoln or Hobart!
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Old 01-23-2010, 01:30 PM
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I have had mine for a couple of years. It has done what I have asked it to do. I have welded up a few exhaust systems and motor mounts. I have done some frame work with it and it has served me well. Don't expect to weld for an hour because on 1/8 steel its going to weld about 6 inches then you will need to let it cool off. A fan would probably help but it wasn't that bad of a wait. It didn't help that I live in Florida and its 90 out side

If you want to do more than just hobby welding then you need to follow the rule right tool for the right job.
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Old 01-23-2010, 06:05 PM
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Although, if you stared at a weld........... could you tell what brand welder made it?
You dont really need to answer this as it is a rhetorical Question.
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Old 01-24-2010, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenmoonshine
Although, if you stared at a weld........... could you tell what brand welder made it?
You dont really need to answer this as it is a rhetorical Question.
while you may call it a retorical question, there really is an answer and it would be yes.. or at least if it was a quality welder or not.. duty cycle would be the biggest culprit

Last edited by matt167; 01-24-2010 at 02:37 PM.
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Old 01-27-2010, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt167
while you may call it a retorical question, there really is an answer and it would be yes.. or at least if it was a quality welder or not.. duty cycle would be the biggest culprit
You are correct on one thing, These welders we speak of do have duty cycles ........ but still wouldnt be able to tell which brand welder made the weld,this budget welder or this quality(Lincoln) one(its all in the skilled hands of the weldor ), besides I just brought up the Lincoln as a comparison in price as to number of function's, I would almost bet its duty cycle is about(or is) the same of this HF model...........
SO...... Like I said,
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenmoonshine
rhetorical

Last edited by greenmoonshine; 01-27-2010 at 09:27 PM.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2010, 09:42 PM
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Well go grab it and haul it home, I personally would not own a HF welder on a bet, or could not be given one for that matter .

We all have our own preferences on welding equipment . Miller happens to be my choice if you are asking ..
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2010, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepi
Well go grab it and haul it home..
Apparently you didnt read all the thread but I did haul it home and it seems to be welding fine, I have MAG welded with it so far and strikes an ark every time without a nitch
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepi
We all have our own preferences on welding equipment . Miller happens to be my choice if you are asking ..
I'm sure there are thousand of Miller, Lincoln, Hobart(etc.) fans alike......everybody has there preferences as you stated and on some days I prefer to drink a Natural light over a Bud light, doesnt make me any less of an alcoholic Lol. but in the end there still made out of the same things, one will get you to from point A to point B just the same no matter what its wrapped in.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenmoonshine
You are correct on one thing, These welders we speak of do have duty cycles ........ but still wouldnt be able to tell which brand welder made the weld,this budget welder or this quality(Lincoln) one(its all in the skilled hands of the weldor ), besides I just brought up the Lincoln as a comparison in price as to number of function's, I would almost bet its duty cycle is about(or is) the same of this HF model...........
SO...... Like I said,
well, if you actually do the comparing Lincoln doesn't really make a welder that compares to the HF dual Mig 151, because it pretty much has 110v specs for a 220v welder.. the closest Lincoln in spec is actully the Lincoln Easy Mig 140 which is a 110v unit but carries 20% duty cycle at 90 amps instead of 115 that the 220v HF machine has. making the the Lincoln a much more efficent machine using 1/2 the current to do the same thing.. Lincoln's Easy Mig 180 is there smallest 220v machine, and can do 30% at 130 amps.. and Lincoln is the cheapest on the price spectrum of 'brand name' welders... not saying the HF won't do what you want, but you would be able to tell the welders apart because if your comparing 220v to 220v the Lincoln will outweld the HF with it's duty cycle, so the HF welder would show more stops in the weld.. if you compare your 220v HF to the 120V Lincoln, it would be closer.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2010, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt167
the closest Lincoln in spec is actully the Easy Mig 140 which is a 110v unit but carries 20% duty cycle at 90 amps instead of 115 that the 220v HF machine has making the the Lincoln a much more efficent machine using 1/2 the current to do the same thing.
As I stated I was comparing the price ("$") to # of functions, not what the input power rating was but since you are bringing up there duty cycle's again to disprove my point about staring at a weld and not being able to tell what machine made it.
The HF 151 specs are as follows
20% @ 105 amps
40% @ 75 amps
90% @ 50 amps
100% @ 30 amps
sure if you keep looking threw all of the different welders/models you will always find one that will out perform another but at a much higher cost.
which was my original point(OP), I got a Dual MIG welder, a welder cart and a welding mask(its not a helmet) all for $200 which all of this is just about 1/3 the cost for that lincoln model and will still do the same welds.
Quote:
Originally Posted by matt167
but you would be able to tell the welders apart because if your comparing 220v to 220v the Lincoln will outweld the HF with it's duty cycle, so the HF welder would show more stops in the weld.. if you compare your 220v HF to the 120V Lincoln, it would be closer.
Yes you would be able to tell the welders apart because they are made by 2 different companies and carry different badges/boxes,as for the stops in the weld, well thats just a part of welding, again its all about the "weldor" but with a duty cycle of 100% for 30 amps, you can weld thin sheet metal all day long and woul only have to stop for bathroom breaks.
besides if you were planning on welding that much steel on 90 amps you wouldnt even be looking at a welder that carried a 20% duty cycle for that application in the first place. especially if you just wanted one continues seem.
Just curious......... How much was the lincoln 220v? OH yea,
Only $739.99 !!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for taking the time to look up those links. made it quicker.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2010, 12:46 PM
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First I do agree that the Duel MIG has it's place and if budget constraints mean the difference between owning a welder or not then it's limitations may be worth living with. However you keep saying a person can not tell the difference between a weld made with this welder and a "quality" welder but don't kid yourself there IS a difference! I have used "quality" welders for over 40 years now and I am also quite well familiar with the "duel MIG" (the one I mentioned earlier) and I can definitely tell a difference in the way they weld, a big difference! Does this mean the HF welder makes an inferior weld? Not likely but it does indeed mean there is a difference in the way the weld goes on, this can be most noticeable when doing difficult positions such as overhead welding where the excess spatter can cause feeding problems. The arc stability is not as good and wire feed is not as steady and while these may be hardly noticeable for most welding chores it can make a difference when doing something like body panels. Can't tell the difference between a weld made by the duel MIG and, for instance, a Miller? I bet if you compared them side by side on a body panel you could tell a difference, less spatter to clean up and most likely more problems with burn through. Again, the HF MIG may have it's place and it certainly can be usable but you seem to want to compare it to the "big three" but there simply is no comparison! If you ever get the chance to use a "quality" welder for delicate work then you will immediately see what we are talking about.




BTW, I noticed you very correctly used the term MAG welder which it most certainly is. The term MIG (Metal INERT Gas) has become synonymous with shielded wire welding even within most industry but it is sort of misleading because MIG welding would be using an Inert gas such as pure Argon or Helium while using C25 or CO2 is using an active gas, hence the acronym "MAG" (Metal ACTIVE Gas). Because this is so common and pretty much accepted industry wide it is not much of a problem but the common error of calling a flux core welder a MIG is. MIG and MAG are two nearly identical processes except for use of a different shielding while Flux core is a totally different process sharing only the method by which the filler metal is supplied. I guess this has nothing to do with HF welders but I thought I would mention it anyway.
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