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Old 10-03-2002, 06:05 PM
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Post Hot Rod Diesel Water Injection

This is an interesting thing to think about. About 10 years ago, when I worked in a small race shop, the engine assembler there helped a local guy with his SuperStock Diesel tractor engine.
I was asking Ray about the use of water injection on these multi-turboed diesel engines. I asked him why this was used, was it just to cool the intake charge? He answered and said yes, but injecting water into the combustion chamber took up space and created more compression. I've often thought about this, and wondered if it had any merit to it.
What do you guys think? I don't build hotrod diesels, so I can't speak from experience.

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Old 10-04-2002, 02:18 AM
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Water when it turns to steam expands 100 times and adsorbs a lot of heat when it does so, this adds a lot of free power to a diesel and allows higher boost pressure and reduces timing requirements. The higher compression of the diesel causes very high stresses during ignition and water helps moderate and stabilize the ignition phase which eases the load on the rotating assy somewhat, this allows you to make more power before the laws of physics take over. I have always wanted to build one up specifically for this kind of power, I imagine building a late model diesel V8 Mercedes pumped up to 400HP and 1000ft/pds of torque...at 2500 RPM! Would tow the trailer pretty good!
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Old 10-04-2002, 03:22 AM
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Whats the deal with the propane spray kits for the smaller Diesels that thay are selling? claiming 25%up more HP you think this is the real deal? i guess its just used under a load ? NOS for your Diesel! And why are Superchargers Load Sensitive?
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:39 AM
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From what I understand, the propane systems are like nitrous for diesels.

Jason
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:45 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by roys63:
<strong>Whats the deal with the propane spray kits for the smaller Diesels that thay are selling? claiming 25%up more HP you think this is the real deal? i guess its just used under a load ? NOS for your Diesel! And why are Superchargers Load Sensitive?</strong><hr></blockquote>

I was watching my favorite Sunday morning show Horsepower TV and they did this to a cummins. It made 413 HP at the wheels. My understanding is that as stated earlier, it can be compared to no2 as it allows the engine to burn more fuel and greatly increase cylinder pressure.
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:49 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by 4 Jaw Chuck:
<strong>Water when it turns to steam expands 100 times and adsorbs a lot of heat when it does so, this adds a lot of free power to a diesel and allows higher boost pressure and reduces timing requirements. The higher compression of the diesel causes very high stresses during ignition and water helps moderate and stabilize the ignition phase which eases the load on the rotating assy somewhat, this allows you to make more power before the laws of physics take over. I have always wanted to build one up specifically for this kind of power, I imagine building a late model diesel V8 Mercedes pumped up to 400HP and 1000ft/pds of torque...at 2500 RPM! Would tow the trailer pretty good!</strong><hr></blockquote>

This is correct, but water injection is usually considered a bandaid. It however works very well on the tractors. One thing to conscider is that those tractors are making 200-300psi of boost. This is calculated ov course since it really cant be measured in a sequential turbo setup. I dont know that water will do much on a regular low boost desiel. The charge temp may not be high enough to benefit.

Chris
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Old 10-04-2002, 07:30 AM
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A little off the subjuct, but they used water injection in WW2 on 32cyl radial four stroke engines that had centrifugal superchargers. The supercharger impellar had small holes in it for the water injection. But, water injection could only be used for a short period of time to cool the air/fuel charge. They use it on bombers to climb quickly in order to avoid fighters. These engines also had PRT's or power recovery turbines in the exhaust that helped to drive the crank through a fluid coupling. Crazy man crazy.

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Old 10-04-2002, 11:55 AM
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Propane only increase the percentage of fuel burned by a diesel, there is much unburned fuel left in a chamber when running under full power/rich (hence the black smoke) and adding propane will increase the amount of fuel converted to energy. BTW propanes octane rating is 104.
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Old 10-04-2002, 04:49 PM
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So, I am going to assume that since the water's volume increases 100 times when it turns to steam, then technically it would have to increase cylinder pressure. Yes/No
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Old 10-04-2002, 05:07 PM
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Yes and also cools it.
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Old 10-04-2002, 05:13 PM
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COOL, NOW FOR THOSE HEAVY DUTY COIL SPRINGS IN THE FRONT OF MY MONTE CARLO SO I CAN SHOEHORN A B SERIES CUMMINS DIESEL WITH 3 TURBOS IN SERIES AND WATER INJECTION. HO HO HO HO AS TIM TAYLOR WOULD SAY.
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