HOW do you guys do it?
I'm trying to get my plan together, to do a complete paint, including trunk, undersides of hood and decklid, doorjams, etc... and all this after doing repair of a number of rustouts and dings and dents.
With time restrictions/painting windows for when to spray epoxy followed by primer/filler, sealer, base coat and clear...........it's mind boggling to me an individual can get it all done per spec sheets and proper applications/methods!
Seems you'd have to be unemployed or take vacation to have a chance and let's not forget all the other things going on in one's life. :pain:
Can anyone give me a clue how to get 'er done?
getting areas on my car done, a little at a time, strip and epoxy, work around the car, then have to respray epoxy again, then primer/filler, work out defects, take days and days to get it straight, wouldn't the time be gone to properly spray the base? having 2K over the epoxy, how long would I have before shooting or is the time unlimited if I scuff the 2K later?
Sorry for being so long winded and obviously confused. :drunk:
Strip the car and then spray epoxy. Take your time doing the bondo and any other repair work and if you need to spray epoxy over some areas that have been worked again all you have to do is scuff the epoxy first. After you spray the primer/filler do all your sanding and get it straight. Then you can spray your top coat. You should have no problems with the time between the primer filler and top coats since you'll sand the primer/filler anyway. The only time problem you might run into would be if you were using a sealer over the primer. There usually is a time limit to spray the top coat if a sealer is used. If that time limit is exceeded you will normally have to scuff the sealer before top coating.
When all else fails check the "P" (product sheets) for all the info you'll need.
It is very time consuming, just look how long I have been working on my project :P . A guy once told me how to attack a project when it is at the point of overwhelming you.. He said "how do you eat an elephant?" I said WHAT? He said one bite at a time. Made sense to me.
Definately do the project in stages. Work a few panels at a time to keep it managable. Trying to work everywhere around the car at one time will just lead to major stress and sloppy work. There's no time limit when you're after good results. Work a few panels at a time and get them to the first stage of primer surfacer then set them aside and work on two other panels. Keep rotating your focus on the parts untill they are in the final stage of primer, then final sand and paint. Yes, it takes days and days- lots of days to do the job right. My last complete inside and out top to bottom body restoration took over 400 hours.
When all the parts are final sanded and ready for paint your plan has finally come together and the light can be seen at the end of the tunnel. Be persistant and progress will show.
Thanks for the replies.
One of my biggest concerns, too, has to do with how I'd manage to paint the underside of the hood and the doorjams. I'd really like all surfaces to be covered and can't see how that would be done with the doors and hood attached. The front part of the door, inside where the hinge is, seems it would be particularly difficult.
At any rate, thanks again. You've given good advice. Now to figure out which fork do I use for the elephant and which is for the salad?
Centerline said a lot of what I would of and all the guys gave you some good advice. It can seem overwhelming. When I worked on my bonny and a mustang for someone else, I was laid off from work at the time, but even still, it was very time consuming and a lot of work to get done. There are always commitments that take you away from getting work done. I pretty much work a panel or two at a time. I like to get all the bodywork on the outside done and primed and blocked and to the point of just needing a final sand before paint, then I work on prepping the jambs, and try to shoot all the parts off together if possible, but I don't really see a problem if you do only one at a time. But if there is any amount of work that has to be done inside doors or jambs, then I do that as I am working my way around the car. To do a good job, you will probably need to remove those parts to prep and paint. I like to remove the door hinges and parts like that, and sandblast them and epoxy seal and paint. Much easier to do that then trying to sand some parts. It really isn't all that much work to scuff up the epoxy primer. Much easier then if parts sitting in baremetal start rusting, and will give you the opportunity to concentrate on one area at a time and perfect it before moving on. Most basecoats have a fairly long time window. So a lot of times I will get the car all in basecoat and covered. Since I usually wetsand the base with around 1000-1500 to smooth a little an denib I'll do that after its set an hour or so, or the next day. Then I only have to spray on a coat or two of base and a few coats of clear that day. Just set a weekend aside when you get to the point of paint, or take a vacation day and make it a longer weekend so you can take your time getting it in paint. Things normally go better if you take your time and don't rush the painting and allow enough flash time. I was rushing to get a hood painted after work and had nothing but problems. When I walked away for a day, and came back and took my time, things worked out. Would have ended up being done a lot quicker if I would have not rushed the first time.
After visiting the Good Guys event in Del Mar, CA back in early April I decided that I would spruce up my '29 Highboy for my 'local' Good Guys event in Jacksonville at the end of May thinking I had tons of time! This included rebuilding/painting the front, rewiring the car and rebuilding the engine. All of this was done in my home garage completely solo.
After stripping the front end to the bare rails and removing the firewall, floor and drivetrain I realized the job was bigger than I had ever imagined.
So, I focused on completely finishing one thing at a time; rails, engine, trans, wiring, floor, firewall etc.
It is 90% back together and I am on track for the show in 3 weeks but there were times when I thought I would never do it.
Considering I ONLY attacked the front of the car I can't believe how much work it was. Now that it will be back on the road soon I will do the rest of the bodywork one panel at a time once the temperature drops again in the winter.
I am VERY glad I did it but and I learnt a hell of a lot doing it.
I know what I did is not the pure bodywork project you are undertaking but the effort required just even to get the firewall to the condition you see was incredible. The masking for the checkerboard pattern alone took almost 2 hours! I have a new understanding as to why bodyshops charge what they do for GOOD work!
I think you need to estimate how long it takes, double it and then ensure you have a TON of patience to do it right and not rush it. There can be a temption, at least with me, to say "oh, that should be fine" knowing there are still blemishes that will show once it is finished. Self discipline in making sure each step was completed prior to moving on was critical to the final finish.
I am a complete beginner who never held a spray gun until 3 weeks ago and I am pretty pleased with the outcome. The main things that I see that impacted the final outcome are:
- use the right tools. if you don't have them borrow/buy them
- use the right grit! really important
- the old credo of 90% prep, 10% paint application is right.
- follow the tech sheets for paint, the only time I had a problem and had to redo a part was when I rushed the times
- you need a spotless envrionment which to be fair I didnt have but I was pretty lucky.
- patience, patience, patience!!! getting a good finish takes a long time!
- Dont panic. even if you get a seemingly bad finish (orange peel etc) it can usually be rectified, get input from others who know.
- Use the internet: forums like this provided me with TONS of info from people who know, I also used it to research paint specs/flash times etc.
Good luck and let us see your results!
The 'marks' you see on the firewall below are reflections from the engine. The finish is pretty much flawless thanks to the guys on this forum and at autobody101.com
Lots of good advice given.
Even though I travel a lot if your efficient and organized you can still do a complete frame off in a years time.
The biggest thing is do one thing at a time so you don't get overwhelmed.
When the body work starts I will work on the one panel that night until i have that panel in epoxy over any filler.
Where people make a mistake is running to his fender to fix something and back to this door etc. Next thing you know in the four hours of work that night you have nothing done.
The next night I will do a door until done.
If you think about it in a two week period with 2-4 hours a night you can have the whole body done and sealed with epoxy and ready for primmer.
Only time I work on multiple panels is when painting the undersides and I will do the doors, hood, deck lid all at once so can paint at the same time.
Being new to this I too thought it was overwhelming. But like the guys said just take on one section, door, fender at a time and see it thru completion. You will be amazed at how fast it goes if you are diligent in staying on your project. Good luck and let us know how it goes. (One of my fenders had 9 rust out places I had to make patch panels for..but it is so much fun and fulfilling.)
Barry, as you said above, 2 weeks later, you've got the whole body done and sealed with epoxy, ready for primer....wouldn't you have to spray epoxy again before the primer? That's what I've read and it confuses me that I couldn't just scuff and prime.
Not sure of the question.
After sandblasting I epoxy, the whole car, two coats.
Then say the next night I'm doing the quarter after all body work is done I spray a coat of epoxy and it stays like that until the whole car is ready for 2K primer.
I scuff the epoxy with 180 by hand and apply the primer, block and re-prime as many times as necessary.
When done with primer I do spray another coat of epoxy as my final sealer coat before basing.
Perhaps overkill but that is how I do it and I hope I clarified for your question?
I do understand your technique. Just recently I read a post or two where someone had sprayed their car with epoxy and the car sat a long while before they got back to it. Person had wondered if they could just scuff and shoot their primer/filler and was told no, that the epoxy had to have been covered within a day or two or else another epoxy coat had to be sprayed.
I'm not planning on leaving the car sit for ages after I strip and epoxy, just that I'm not sure how long I'll have to get it done. Could very well become an epoxy and sit till the fall season project.
Oh well, thanks to all again. Really admire the hard work you people put in and the results you share with the rest of us.
On a different topic, hope you don't mind. I bought a few Durablock sanding blocks at a swapmeet this past weekend. One of the blocks is a pretty decent length, like 24". What paper can I/should I use on this and where can I buy it?
You can buy rolls of 3" wide stick-it sandpaper in grits from 50-400 that will fit your 24" sanding block. Just tear off the amount you need and stick it to the block. Carborundum gets my vote for quality and price, 3M, Mirka, and Norton are also options.
If your epoxied parts set over the summer just sand it some and apply a fresh coat when you start on the project again.
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