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Old 03-09-2010, 10:39 PM
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how much hp and torQ will my motor have

i have a brand new gm 350 4 bolt main
with flat top hypertech what ever lol 4 valve relief pistons on x rods that have been reconditioned !
a summit racing .510-.533 lift cam
edelbrock gear drive
.20 .20 crank
edelbrock 70 cc alum heads with 185cc Intake Ports
70cc Combustion Chambers
2.020''/1.600'' Valves
1.460'' Valve Springs, .575'' Max Lift
3/8'' Rocker Studs
Straight Plug
\roller rockers

tci flywheel
hi flow oil pump and water pump

long tube header 3 inch x pipe
header wrap
9.mm accel 300 + plug wires and accel header plugs
hei distributor with accel coil

I'm also looking 4 feed back on my build as well as info thanks 4 reading

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Old 03-09-2010, 10:47 PM
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Left out TWO major bits of info..........comp. ratio and duration and LSA on cam. Right now it would just be a dumb guess.
6sally6
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:17 PM
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Summit Racing Part Number SUM-1108

Cam Style Hydraulic flat tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range 3,500-7,000
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift 244
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift 254
Duration at 050 inch Lift 244 int./254 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration 302
Advertised Exhaust Duration 312
Advertised Duration 302 int./312 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio 0.510 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio 0.533 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio 0.510 int./0.533 exh. lift
Lobe Separation (degrees) 114
Intake Valve Lash 0.000 in.
Exhaust Valve Lash 0.000 in.
Computer-Controlled Compatible No
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:19 PM
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i also have a 3500 stall ?
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:20 PM
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Also need intake and carb/EFI
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:22 PM
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420HP would be my guess not knowing compression ratio.
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:27 PM
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I'm gonna guess the static compression ratio is about 9.5:1. The cam you're using needs 10.5:1 to 12.0:1 static compression ratio and makes power from about 3200 up to 7000. Expect the bottom end to be extremely soggy. This is a classic mis-match of parts.
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:32 PM
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u guy on here are the stuff lol

750 holly dual line
and for now a wilend intake unknow what one dual plane and gasket matched
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:36 PM
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You got the carburetor right.
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:43 PM
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what all do i have wrong ive scwed up tons with this car sold well over half of what i did own lol to build this stupid car god its been a nasty hard road

i want feedback bad is ok with me
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:51 PM
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i sold a couple cars bought a motor off eBay that was supposed to be just sick
blew tons of time not knowing what i was doing and money got it in the car was all happy drove it a block found out zero oil pressure and a knock
pulled it out ..boy was it a wore piece of crap every barring was brass all the parts were wore out junk
started selling tools and my other cars
took it to machine shop they found a big chip in the deck junked the block

took a Lean out on the last car i got other then the motor one
borrowed a 1000 to buy a brand new gm block have to pay back 1600
bought all kinds of parts brand new
paid a guy 120 bucks to put the crank and pistons in he broke a ring

found out my 58cc heads were going to give me to much compression

started selling everything i had in site from tools antique my TV whatever to buy heads ..blah blah its been hard
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Old 03-10-2010, 12:14 AM
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Jeez, I don't know if I have the strength to continue after hearing all that.

The static compression ratio is fine at 9.5:1. It'll work great on pump gas. All you need is the correct cam to make it work. Go back and research cams at Summit. Get one that has a duration of 220 to 225 degrees @ 0.050" with a LSA of 110 degrees.

Assuming you have a Gen I type block, here's an example of a cam I might use if it were my motor....
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-K00132/

Now, you know there are all kinds of problems with flat tappet camshafts because you can't buy good oil at too many places anymore. Most of the available oil has had the extreme pressure lubricants taken out, so you have to add those lubes to the engine oil that you use or the cam will go flat in a hurry.

Pay close attention to the instructions that come with the cam, as far as using the gooey grease on the lobes and lifter bottoms, pre-lubing the oiling system before you fire the motor, breaking the cam in at no less than 2500 rpms for 45 minutes, etc., etc. Read through this checklist and ask questions if you need to.

The following list of do's and don't's didn't sit well with the troops when I posted it originally, but if it helps even one person to prevent mushin' a cam, it's worth it. I even posted a disclaimer at the top to satisfy some of the members of this board.....

DISCLAIMER: THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION WAS GLEANED FROM MANY DIFFERENT SOURCES. SOME OF IT MAKES SENSE TO ME AND SOME OF IT DOESN'T. USE WHAT YOU THINK IS REAL AND THROW OUT THE REST OF IT. I HAVE NOT USED ALL OF THE SUGGESTIONS LISTED HERE. THROUGH THE YEARS, I HAVE ACCOMPLISHED MANY SUCCESSFUL FLAT TAPPET CAMSHAFT BREAK-INS, BUT I HAVE ALSO ROACHED A FEW. USE THIS LIST AS A GUIDELINE SO THAT YOU REMEMBER TO CHECK ALL THESE THINGS WHEN INSTALLING A NEW FLAT TAPPET CAMSHAFT. DO NOT TAKE EVERYTHING POSTED HERE AS GOSPEL. IF THE MANUFACTURER OF THE CAMSHAFT YOU'RE USING RECOMMENDS PROCEDURES THAT DIFFER FROM WHAT IS SHOWN HERE, USE THE MANUFACTURER'S RECOMMENDATIONS AND DISREGARD THIS INFORMATION.

Mistakes that may "frag" a flat-tappet camshaft and lifters.

1. Failure to remove all rust-preventative from cam and lifters with solvent once you get them home. (This advice does not include removing coatings applied at the factory such as phosphates. It is only suggesting to remove rust-preventative grease that may or may not have been applied to the cam/lifters to prevent rust in storage. This grease will not have the extreme pressure characteristics that Molybdenum Disulphide has and should be removed so that MD can be applied properly. MD is the black, tar-like extreme-pressure grease that is recommended by some camshaft manufacturers to be applied to the lifter crowns/cam lobes for initial camshaft break-in).

2. Failure to wash the cam and lifters with hot soapy water to remove the remainder of rust-preventative not removed with solvent. CAUTION; WASH ONLY THE CROWN OF THE LIFTERS. (THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE LIFTER WHERE IT CONTACTS THE CAMSHAFT LOBE). DO NOT ALLOW WATER TO GET INTO THE INTERIOR OF THE LIFTER BODY. BE VERY CAREFUL HERE IF THE LIFTER HAS AN OILING HOLE THAT HAS BEEN EDM'D INTO THE CROWN TO PROVIDE OIL FROM THE INTERIOR OF THE LIFTER BODY TO THE CAMSHAFT LOBE. Dry the cam and lifter crowns thoroughly with hot air from a hot air gun or hair dryer to remove all traces of moisture before applying Molybdenum Disulfide.
WARNING: DO NOT USE ANY ABRASIVE MATERIALS SUCH AS SCOTCHBRITE PADS OR SANDPAPER OF ANY KIND TO ACCOMPLISH THESE SOLVENT AND SOAP CLEANING OPERATIONS. USE ONLY SOFT, CLEAN RAGS. THE WHOLE INTENT OF CLEANING THE CAMSHAFT IS SO THAT WE CAN REMOVE RUST-PREVENTATIVE OILS AND GREASES THAT MIGHT HINDER GETTING DOWN TO THE BASE METAL IN ORDER TO PERFORM OPERATION #3 SHOWN HERE.

3. Failure to properly massage an extreme pressure lubricant such as Molybdenum Disulfide into the pores of the metal on all lobes and lifter faces. Moly will actually bond with the metal and give maximum protection to the lifter crown/lobe.

4. Failure to use an extreme pressure lubricant additive in the engine oil for camshaft break-in. Each cam grinder has his own specific product to facilitate valid cam break-in.

5. Failure to use the proper valve springs for cam break-in. You can't use the 300 lb over-the-nose springs that you'll eventually use in the motor and expect the cam to live at break-in. Assemble the heads with stock or weak single springs to break in the cam, then use one of the many tools available to change the springs with the heads on the motor. Alternately, assemble the heads with the springs you will run and use reduced-ratio break-in rockers, then change out the rockers after break-in. These rockers are available from Crower in different ratios for different motors. A popular ratio for a small block Chevy would be a 1.3:1 rocker. In other words, let's say the lift at the cam is 0.350" and the theoretical lift at the valve with 1.5:1 rockers is 0.525". Using the 1.3:1 rockers would result in lift at the valve of only 0.455", thus reducing stress at the camshaft/lifter interface during the crucial break-in period.

6. Failure to check for valve spring coil bind at max lift. If you cannot tell by eye, verify by inserting a .010- inch feeler gauge between the coils. A .010 space between five coils would give a total of .050 safety margin before stacking solid. If you cannot pass the feeler gauge between the coils, the spring is either coil bound or dangerously close to this condition, and you have probably overshimmed the spring (the fitted dimension is too short).

7. Failure to check for retainer to valve guide/seal clearance. 1/16"-1/8" clearance at full valve lift is considered sufficient.

8. Failure to check for binding at the rocker/stud interface with stamped steel rockers. Long slot rockers are made specifically to cure this problem.

9. Failure to check for piston/valve clearance..... 0.080" on the intake and 0.100" on the exhaust is considered by many to be the minimum clearance acceptable. You will probably find the closest near-miss at the exhaust valve on overlap, when the piston is chasing the exhaust valve back onto its seat.

10. Failure to run the motor at high rpms (2500 or higher, alternating 500/1000 rpm's up and/or down to allow the crank to throw oil in different places at different revs) for the first 40-45 minutes of its life. NO IDLING. NO IDLING. NO IDLING. The motor should not be run at less than 2500 rpm's for a minimum of 40 minutes. If a problem develops, shut the motor down and fix it, then resume break-in. The main source of camshaft lubrication is oil thrown off the crankshaft at speed, drainback from the oil rings and oil vapors circulating in the crankcase. At idle, the crank isn't spinning fast enough to provide sufficient oil splash to the camshaft/lifters for proper break-in protection.

11. Failure to clearance lifters in their bores so that they spin freely. Lifter clearance should be 0.0012" to 0.002", with 0.0015" (one and one/half thousandths) considered close to ideal. Too loose is as bad as too tight.

12. Failure to initially adjust the valves properly. Using the "spin the pushrod until it feels tight" method will normally result in valves too tight. Holding the rocker arm tip down against the valve stem tip with one hand, jiggle the pushrod up and down with your thumb/forefinger of your other hand until all play is removed, then turn the rocker nut 1/2 to 3/4 turn to set the preload. Builders who have done hundreds of engine builds may have the "feel" to do the "twist" method, but those fellows who are doing their first few builds lack the experience to do this and will have better results with the "jiggle" method.

13. Failure to inspect the distributor drive gear for wear. Too much wear can allow the cam to walk in its cam bore and contact an adjacent lifter.

14. Failure to have everything ready for the motor to fire on the first few turns. Fully charged battery, good starter, known-good carburetor with full fuel bowl, source of fuel to the carburetor to allow minimum 40 minutes of uninterrupted running. Ignition timing set. NO GRINDING ON THE STARTER. NO GRINDING ON THE STARTER. NO GRINDING ON THE STARTER.

15. Failure to prime the oiling system prior to firing the motor. Prime until you get oil out of the top of each and every pushrod. Observe the oil pressure gauge to be sure pressure is registering. Priming will aid lubing the valvetrain at initial startup. It's the last area of the motor to get lubed on dry start.

16. Failure to use new lifters on a used cam. Used lifters should only be used on the very same cam, in the very same block and in the very same positions they were removed from. Chances that the lifter bores will be machined on the very same angles on a different block as the block the lifters came out of are about equal to you hitting the lottery.

Now, this last bit of advice comes from Racer Brown, world-renowned camshaft manufacturer/engineer who ground the hot cams for Chrysler Corporation during the horsepower wars of the 60's.
"Overfill the crankcase by at least 4 or 5 quarts of oil so that the oil level comes to within an inch of the top of the oil pan. Install a set of fairly hot spark plugs with a gap of 0.050" to 0.060" to prevent oil-fouling of the plugs, which is otherwise inevitable under no-load conditions with all the extra oil aboard. During this operation, we want near-maximum oil flow, together with a maximum of oil vapors and liquid oil thrashing about in the crankcase so that the cam lobe and lifter interface lubrication is considerably better than marginal."

This advice from the Racer is too scary for me, but I included it so that you know someone, somewhere has done it.

Just a note to make you aware of the loading between the camshaft lobe and lifter crown. That pencil-point of contact, if carried out to a square inch, would be somewhere between 250,000 and 300,000 POUNDS PER SQUARE INCH.

If this is a roller cam block, then we are way ahead of the game and I will suggest another cam.
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