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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 11:00 AM
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well that's good to know about wet sanding it, especially because parts of mine did get wet sanded to an extent.

No idea why a customer would request that you use slick sand.

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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 11:45 AM
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well that's good to know about wet sanding it, especially because parts of mine did get wet sanded to an extent.

No idea why a customer would request that you use slick sand.
My sentiments exactly Lizer...It was one of those jobs where a person attempted the restoration of an old Ford himself. When he got in over his head, he was recommended to me by one of my customers. The car came to me in pieces, he had taken pictures of the disassembly, the vehicle came to me with the fenders in Epoxy primer with Slick Sand over top, the inside of the doors had been Epoxy primed with Slick Sand over top (why the outside of the doors where not primed at the same time I don't know)....and other miscellaneous parts had the same treatment done to them. When I asked how he wanted me to proceed, he insisted on using the same product that he had started with because he had already purchased the product and was...as most of us...on a budget.

At that time I did my research and was told that it could be wet sanded and went ahead. As I mentioned in a previous post, the car has been done for several years now and it still looks good...I wasn't comfortable at the time and even though it does make sense that it should be able to be wet sanded, I still didn't have that comfort zone that I like.

As we've been going through this conversation, I just remembered that I did also spray Slick Sand in I believe it was November of last year (on a vehicle owned by a friend of the owner of the old Ford I've been talking about)...I was just getting educated on SPI...did my tests with SPI, showed it to the customer and took off the Slick Sand (it was on the 2 front fenders) and have since applied SPI's Epoxy....now I have that comfort zone I need.

Ray
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 06:42 PM
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Today was an awesome education, thanks for everyone's participation!
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 06:45 PM
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A day is never wasted if something was learned.

Ray
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Old 07-21-2013, 06:47 PM
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I am looking at puchasing: PPG Deltron DBU922657 Viper Diamond Black
It is one gallon, but it says that when reduced it will produce two gallons of sprayable material. What am I reducing it with? Reducer? Thinner? What kind of ratio? I know I am a total newbie, thanks for your patience!
Thanks so much
D
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  #111 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 07:45 PM
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You are correct, the Deltron line of PPG's base coat is reduced 1 part paint, 1 part reducer....depending on temperature, the reducer number will start of with a D8.., the last two digits will determine the air temperature where you are spraying at. For example, if it's 80 degrees, the reducer I would recommend would be D885, indicating that the reducer is good for temperatures up to 85 degrees. It's always a good idea to get a reducer that will be slower than the actual air temperature...you can always wait for it to flash, you can't always paint fast enough for it to flow, lay down smooth and flat. A reducer that's to fast would result in dry spray causing a rough finish of your base coat, poor metallic control and even create extra "dust" from paint material that dried before it even hit the car you are painting.

It does feel good though to talk about the good old solvent based base coats again....it's been over 3 years since we've been able to purchase it up here in Canada.

Hope this helps.

Ray
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  #112 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 08:06 PM
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Just curious and I'm sure that we've discussed it in the past but, exactly what all are you painting Diamond Black? Have you chosen what type of clear your going to use yet?

Ray
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  #113 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 09:06 PM
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Great question! I was just going to ask you for a clear coat recommendation. Suggestions?
Also, can I go right to clear the same afternoon I shoot color?
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  #114 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2013, 09:14 PM
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For an overall complete paint job, I would recommend SPI's Universal Clear. It lays down great. polishes like a dream and it's real cost effective as well. I've sprayed almost all of the clears out there and this product competes very well with the high priced clears from the major manufacturer...in fact I prefer it.

Yes you can clear the car the same day...however, when doing a high quality paint job, the best conditions would be to base the GTO in the evening and come back in the morning and clear it. This isn't always possible for time constraints and whatever else may come into play. If it isn't possible to do this, make sure that the base is flashed completely...I like to wait about an hour after the last coat and then clear it.

Hope this helps.

Ray
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  #115 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2013, 06:53 AM
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I'm a big fan of SPI also...recently I've been spraying their black SS urathane...at a cost of around 200.00 a gal (5qts).....I gotta say, I love it and theres no clear to buy... This is good stuff, 2 coats and walk away...
Everybody thinks this is BC/CC and it can be cut and buffed as easily as the clears they make...I love it...
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  #116 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2013, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dayo5 View Post
I am looking at puchasing: PPG Deltron DBU922657 Viper Diamond Black
It is one gallon, but it says that when reduced it will produce two gallons of sprayable material. What am I reducing it with? Reducer? Thinner? What kind of ratio? I know I am a total newbie, thanks for your patience!
Thanks so much
D
Have to correct on this one as the DBU is not a 1 - 1 mix ratio as the DBC is. In fact it is a 1 part paint to 1 1/2 part reducer and does use it's own activated reducer not the DT line. So after reducing you will end up with 2 1/2 gallons sprayable base coat. And yes as others have suggested the SPI universal clear is every bit as good as they say. Sorry have to correct Ray, perhaps it was just overlooked. Hate to see this guy have a mess on his hands.
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  #117 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2013, 11:29 AM
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Thanks Dennis....You are 100% correct....since this thread started we have been talking about painting the car in Base Clear....when he posted and suggested the ratio (1 to 1), I naturally assumed we where in fact talking about base clear...not Deltrons Single Stage Urethane product. Completely my bad...I should have read the part number more closely the way you did Dennis...and yes, there would have been a mess.

Dennis, did you say that Deltron base coats are reduced 1 part paint to 1 1/2 parts reducer? In Canada, when we had Deltron Base Coat...we reduced it 1 part paint to 1 part reducer...I don't know if there is a different formulation in the US for this product but up here it's always been 1 to 1.

To Dayo5....what are you looking at for paint....if you want Base Clear...the part number will be DB"C"922657 not DB"U"922657...DBC products are (Base Coats). DBU products are Single Stage Urethane's and have a completely different reduction ratio and require a hardner .

Thanks Again Dennis...I ASSUMED...and here is proof positive of what happens when you ASSUME...LOL.

Ray
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  #118 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2013, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by 69 widetrack View Post
Thanks Dennis....You are 100% correct....since this thread started we have been talking about painting the car in Base Clear....when he posted and suggested the ratio (1 to 1), I naturally assumed we where in fact talking about base clear...not Deltrons Single Stage Urethane product. Completely my bad...I should have read the part number more closely the way you did Dennis...and yes, there would have been a mess.

Dennis, did you say that Deltron base coats are reduced 1 part paint to 1 1/2 parts reducer? In Canada, when we had Deltron Base Coat...we reduced it 1 part paint to 1 part reducer...I don't know if there is a different formulation in the US for this product but up here it's always been 1 to 1.

To Dayo5....what are you looking at for paint....if you want Base Clear...the part number will be DB"C"922657 not DB"U"922657...DBC products are (Base Coats). DBU products are Single Stage Urethane's and have a completely different reduction ratio and require a hardner .

Thanks Again Dennis...I ASSUMED...and here is proof positive of what happens when you ASSUME...LOL.

Ray
Well Ray to be honest the DBU is also a base coat like DBC is. It may also be available in S/S, don't know. It uses a DRR activated reducer that will not wrinkle up if you have to do a repair as the DBC will wrinkle up on you. I had to use this on a car I painted because the formula was not avail in DBC base. The DBC is a 1 to 1 mix as you know but not the DBU, it is a different base coat system than the DBC. Hope this makes sence to you....
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  #119 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2013, 12:51 PM
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As I said earlier Dennis, a day that you don't learn anything could turn out to be a wasted day...In Canada, Deltron Base Coats where reduced 1 to 1. There must be different products in the US...In Canada Deltron had a Urethane Single Stage system, as you mentioned with different mix ratios...I have never used a PPG Solvent based Base Coat Product that didn't have a 1 to 1 mix ratio in Deltron, Global or Omni.

Thanks Dennis, I appreciate the information, I'm sure it will help the OP and even though I have repped PPG, a base coat system with a 1 to 1 1/2 mix ratio is new information to me. It must be a Canada - US boarder thing, because they sure didn't let us know about the product that your talking about.

Best Regards
Ray
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  #120 (permalink)  
Old 07-26-2013, 10:02 PM
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I'm also a canadian and when I started painting in the mid 80's deltron dbu was all ppg(ditzler back then) had as it was the first basecoat system for ppg,we used NCT and delglo clear on it.Then in the early to mid 90's dbc came out that had better metallics and pearls to match the newer colors(dbu today has a questionable color match for newer colors as does dbc all their research and development goes into envirobase)also around the same time 92ish? they came out with the concept line of single stage and clears like 2020.I have used a fair amount of ppg over my career but have mainly sprayed sikkens in the shops that I work at.

If you use dbc you can use a basecoat hardener(can't remember the #) to make repairability easier or use a method taught by spies and basf.If you mix up a small batch of ready to spray clear and reduce it 100% and you can then dust on a light coat on the burn thru for a barrier coat.Once this flashes you can then go right to base coat with out the hassle of wrinkling.You can also use this for a wetbed to do a blend with solvent base,once again this is taught in spies and basf certification classes incase you were wondering.

Last edited by Typical car guy; 07-26-2013 at 10:08 PM.
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