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Old 09-19-2009, 10:23 AM
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hunting or non hunting gear ratio

I have a ford 9" with 3.70 gears I need to know if it is a non hunting gear set?
Took the pinion gear out to change the yoke without thinking to mark the gears.I can't see anything that looks like timing marks but don't know what I'm looking for. I know 3.00 and 4.00 are non hunting because they divide out to a finite number as opposed to say a 3.73 which divides out to 3.72727272 etc. Trying to get an answer without calling the manufacturer because you usually just get a catalog reader (someone with no expertize that just reads the catalog back to you) thanks.

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Old 09-19-2009, 10:31 AM
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the gears do not need to be timed if that is the question
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Old 09-19-2009, 12:44 PM
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Hi Crosley like the Morris.
Non hunting gear sets do have to be timed (Denver automotive and diesel collage class of 74") but that was 35 years ago and don't remember exactly how to figure that out. After writing the question the idea of the ratio being a whole number came to me. I was hoping someone could tell me a formula or rule of thumb for this.
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Old 09-19-2009, 01:13 PM
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Hunting gear sets are relatively prime. In other words, they have no factors in common.

A 3.60 gear set using a 10 tooth pinion and a 36 tooth ring gear would be non-hunting. They both have 2 as a factor in common.

A 3.70 set with a 10 tooth pinion and a 37 tooth ring would be hunting as there is no common factor between 10 and 37 (37 is prime all by itself, as a matter of fact).

Check the number of teeth on the pinion and the ring gear and see if they have at least one factor in common. If not, they are hunting and do not need to be timed.

I could be wrong, but I would think that a non-hunting r&p would be rare if not non-existent.
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Old 09-19-2009, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blownblazer
Hi Crosley like the Morris.
Non hunting gear sets do have to be timed (Denver automotive and diesel collage class of 74") but that was 35 years ago and don't remember exactly how to figure that out. After writing the question the idea of the ratio being a whole number came to me. I was hoping someone could tell me a formula or rule of thumb for this.

sorry. I have never seen a set of gears in a 9 inch Ford that need to be timed.

mayb a diesel rig, not a Ford 9 inch. I've built many in 40 years.
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Old 09-19-2009, 06:44 PM
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Don't be sorry I'm happy you responded.
back in DADC School the lesson was about a ford 3.00to1 ratio (9"?I'm not sure)gear set. ring and pinions are lapped in with lapping compound on a machine that why you can't mix them.The pinion meshes with the same teeth every revolution in a non hunting ratio so it is important to time them so they mate with the teeth they were lapped in with. My instructor said fords were known for this. That's about all I remember from my year in trade school.
I guess am going to take the pig out spin the pinion and see if meshes with the same teeth every time.HOPE I'M NOT BEATING A DEAD HORSE just trying to save my self some work.
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Old 09-19-2009, 07:21 PM
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You are beating a dead horse. Having replaced any number of 3.00 Ford gears, the new ones do not come marked for timing. Further, I have replaced many class 8 truck ring and pinions of various ratios, and never found one of them marked for timing either. I have also timed many 9,10, and 13 speed transmissions.
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Old 09-20-2009, 08:39 AM
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Thank you.
Why do they time transmissions?
Never got into the heavy truck part of the business.
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Old 09-21-2009, 02:55 AM
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The Pinion & Ring gears are lapped together but, all this means is you can't mix & match Pinion gears with other Ring gears from other sets.
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Old 09-21-2009, 06:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSedan64
The Pinion & Ring gears are lapped together but, all this means is you can't mix & match Pinion gears with other Ring gears from other sets.
When non-hunting gears are lapped, the same teeth contact every time. So using a 4.00:1 as an example, a given tooth on the pinion will contact the same 4 teeth on the ring gear every time. It will never contact any of the other teeth. On a hunting gear set, eventually that given tooth on the pinion will contact every tooth on the ring gear.
So, when you lap a hunting set, all the teeth on the pinion lap into all the teeth on the ring gear. But, when you lap a non-hunting gear set, you have only lapped the individual teeth on the pinion to certain teeth on the ring gear. If you then assemble it with a different timing, the teeth are not lapped to each other and you may get a howl and/or undesirable wear. It would be like using a hunting gear set made up of a pinion from one set and a ring gear from another.
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Old 09-21-2009, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blownblazer
Thank you.
Why do they time transmissions?
Never got into the heavy truck part of the business.
Some truck transmissions use two, or even three countershafts to make them stronger. The countershafts have to be timed to each other to prevent them from binding as the assembly rotates.
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Old 09-22-2009, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redsdad
When non-hunting gears are lapped, the same teeth contact every time. So using a 4.00:1 as an example, a given tooth on the pinion will contact the same 4 teeth on the ring gear every time. It will never contact any of the other teeth. On a hunting gear set, eventually that given tooth on the pinion will contact every tooth on the ring gear.
So, when you lap a hunting set, all the teeth on the pinion lap into all the teeth on the ring gear. But, when you lap a non-hunting gear set, you have only lapped the individual teeth on the pinion to certain teeth on the ring gear. If you then assemble it with a different timing, the teeth are not lapped to each other and you may get a howl and/or undesirable wear. It would be like using a hunting gear set made up of a pinion from one set and a ring gear from another.
Thanks, Learn something everyday on here.
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