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Old 06-28-2004, 10:09 AM
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Hydraulic Valve Adjustment

Guys,

I set my valves on my 1990 GM 350 195,000 mile engine per the HAYNES book.I know that most do this with the engine running.
Since I didnt have a valve cover with the top cut off I decided to do it by the book.

The book says:

1. Set each cylinder to TDC

2. On TDC cylinder: Tighten rockers till push rod can no longer be turned with fingers.

3. Then tighten rocker 1 turn further.

Well I did this twice and each time the engine barely started with zero vacum. I assume the intakes were not shutting.

I ended up tightening the valves till the pushrod wouldnt turn and then left it there. Runs great that way.

Why wouldnt the book procedure work? I assume the book way is probably how GM assembles the engines new. The procedure set lifters operating point one thread down the lifters bore.

Are the old lifters stuck in their ways and wont accept a new operating point? Are they acting like solids?


Otherwise the engine is in great shape. No oil burning. No muck under the valve cover.

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Old 06-28-2004, 10:19 AM
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This is off the trick-flow site. i've used teh proceedure twice and it works well:

If you are using a hydraulic cam and no specs are available, turn the rocker arm adjusting nut 1/2 to 3/4 turn after zero lash. For mechanical cams, you must get the correct lash specification from the cam maker.

In either case you can use the following adjustment order. This is the easiest method since it requires only one turn of the crank. See Figure 3 for cylinder layout:

Figure 3

A. With #1 piston at TDC on the exhaust stroke, adjust the exhaust rockers of cylinders 2, 5, 6, and 7, then the intake rockers of cylinders 3, 4, 6, and 8.

B. Turn the crank 360 degrees (1 full turn) to put the #1 piston at TDC
on the compression stroke. Adjust the exhaust rockers of cylinders
1, 3, 4, and 8, then the intake rockers of cylinders 1, 2, 5, and 7.
Leave the #1 piston at TDC on the compression stroke for the rest of the reassembly.


Are you sure you didn't adjust valves taht were in the open position? Jus checkin...

K
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Old 06-28-2004, 10:34 AM
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I agree with "killer" for the initial setting. After that, I get the engine warmed up and use an old valve cover cut in half from front to back and bolt the bottom half on the head to stop the oil from running down the outside of the head. I also purchased the oil clips that clip onto the rocker arm at the pushrod side.

Once the 1/2 valve cover and clips are in place, I adjust the valves while the engine is running. Turn the rocker arm nut out until the valve train rattles on that particular valve, and then turn it down (clockwise) until the valve stops rattling. After that I give it 3/4 of a turn to seat the lifter in the right place. You may have a lot of rattle when you first start the engine, so you may have to tighten each one a little until the rattling stops so that you know which valve is rattling as you adjust each one. You can also use a piece of 1/2" hose and hold it on each rocker arm and the other end on your ear to hear the rattling valves. Regardless, the 3/4 turn after the rattle stops on each valve has never failed for me and have never required readjustment. I've probably done 10 or so cars this way.
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Old 06-28-2004, 03:47 PM
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The Haynes directions assume you set the piston @ TDC on the compression stroke when the cam is at root (smallest) diameter on both valves. It sounds like you may have set them with the piston @ TDC on the exhaust/intake stroke when both valves are in some stage of open.
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Old 06-28-2004, 05:15 PM
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I'm with Killer on the initial settings. TDC on the compression stroke when both the intake and exhaust are closed. You can cross-check this TDC setting by pulling the cap on the distributor and making sure the rotor is pointing near cylinder #1 when you have TDC on the crank.

I only do it this way for initial settings. I still like to reset them hot and running after the engine is at operating temperature. If you reset them when running, only turn the rocker nut down about 1/4 turn at a time until you get to 3/4. This gives the lifter time to pump up to the new setting. Otherwise the engine will probably die or run very rough while you are adjusting downward if you turn the rocker nut too fast.

Sorry Willys, I got confused with "killer" on another post. I agree with YOU[/B] on the initial settings.
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Old 06-28-2004, 05:22 PM
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As long as you agree with SOMEONE (preferably your wife but you are old enough to know that!)!!!!
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Old 06-28-2004, 05:25 PM
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This is how I adjust them.

Adjusting Hydraulic Lifters On Small Block Chevrolet

Install all the hydraulic lifters and pushrods.

NOTE: New lifters do not have to be pre-lubed. Assembly lube should be put on the cam and the mating face of the lifters.

Install all the rockers and the adjusting nuts leaving them loose. Do not tighten the adjusting nuts before adjusting the valves. Make sure the pushrod is in the lifter and the rocker arm seat when making the adjustments.

Adjust one valve at a time.

Rotate the engine in the normal direction of rotation (clockwise looking from the front of the engine) until the exhaust lifter on the cylinder that you are adjusting just begins to move up. At this point adjust the intake valve on that cylinder to ‘0’ lash with no pre-load. Then tighten the adjusting nut ¼ to ½ additional turns.

Rotate the engine over again until the intake lifter has come to the full lift and then is almost all the way back down. At this point adjust the exhaust valve to ‘0’ lash and then tighten an additional ¼ to ½ turns.

Continue the above for each cylinder until all the valves have been adjusted.

NOTE: Rather than spinning the pushrod and attempting to get the correct ‘feel’, I suggest holding the pushrod between two fingers and lifting the pushrod up and down while slowly tightening the adjusting nut. When you reach the point where there is no up and down movement you will be at ‘0’ lash.

The problem with spinning the pushrod and attempting to get the correct ‘feel’ is that you can and will still be able to spin the pushrod even if you bottom out the lifter. This can cause you to over tighten the adjustment and can lead to bent and / or broken pushrods and valves.

Priming the oil system before starting the engine will fill the hydraulic lifters.
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Old 06-28-2004, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by killerformula
This is off the trick-flow site. i've used teh proceedure twice and it works well:

If you are using a hydraulic cam and no specs are available, turn the rocker arm adjusting nut 1/2 to 3/4 turn after zero lash. For mechanical cams, you must get the correct lash specification from the cam maker.

In either case you can use the following adjustment order. This is the easiest method since it requires only one turn of the crank. See Figure 3 for cylinder layout:

Figure 3

A. With #1 piston at TDC on the exhaust stroke, adjust the exhaust rockers of cylinders 2, 5, 6, and 7, then the intake rockers of cylinders 3, 4, 6, and 8.

B. Turn the crank 360 degrees (1 full turn) to put the #1 piston at TDC
on the compression stroke. Adjust the exhaust rockers of cylinders
1, 3, 4, and 8, then the intake rockers of cylinders 1, 2, 5, and 7.
Leave the #1 piston at TDC on the compression stroke for the rest of the reassembly.


Are you sure you didn't adjust valves taht were in the open position? Jus checkin...

K
Hey Killer.. Where is this method on the Trick Flow site? I looked all over and couldn't find it.
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Old 06-28-2004, 09:28 PM
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Bandar, I also agree with Frisco, I think you went way too tight. I can turn my pushrods with racing springs and 1.6 rockers fully adjusted pretty easy. You shouldn't go untill you can't turn them any more. If you must turn your pushrods with your fingers, stop tighting as soon as you feel any drag then tighten 1/2 of a turn.

I also really like adjusting valves Chev283's way but I don't have any of them fancy valve covers or oil clips. I just put on some really old cloths a pair of goggles and spred some newspaper on the floor...
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Old 06-28-2004, 09:54 PM
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For the 1/2 valve covers, I just got some out of a junkyard or swapmeet, and cut them in half with a sabre saw. About a buck's worth of investment. Come to think of it, you could duct tape some aluminum foil around the lower part of where the valve cover goes, bend the foil a little bit, and accomplish the same thing.

I bought the oil clips over 30 years ago, but I don't think they would cost over $5.00 - $10.00 for 8 of them now. Rags and newspaper works good too. The oil washes off pretty easy but I didn't want a messy engine. Goggles are a great idea without the clips to save your eyes from hot oil. We need to invent some battery powered wipers for those goggles.
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Old 06-30-2004, 11:30 PM
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I took an Edelbrock aluminum cover that I over tightened on something once cracking it , the one with kind of a square look, and after storming around the garage ticked off I used a grinder and removed enough of the top to get the socket through. Turns out that stupid valve cover worked better broke.


I like adjusting them hot and running. Just helps me sleep better at night!
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Old 07-01-2004, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frisco
This is how I adjust them.

Adjusting Hydraulic Lifters On Small Block Chevrolet

Install all the hydraulic lifters and pushrods.

NOTE: New lifters do not have to be pre-lubed. Assembly lube should be put on the cam and the mating face of the lifters.

Install all the rockers and the adjusting nuts leaving them loose. Do not tighten the adjusting nuts before adjusting the valves. Make sure the pushrod is in the lifter and the rocker arm seat when making the adjustments.

Adjust one valve at a time.

Rotate the engine in the normal direction of rotation (clockwise looking from the front of the engine) until the exhaust lifter on the cylinder that you are adjusting just begins to move up. At this point adjust the intake valve on that cylinder to ‘0’ lash with no pre-load. Then tighten the adjusting nut ¼ to ½ additional turns.

Rotate the engine over again until the intake lifter has come to the full lift and then is almost all the way back down. At this point adjust the exhaust valve to ‘0’ lash and then tighten an additional ¼ to ½ turns.

Continue the above for each cylinder until all the valves have been adjusted.

NOTE: Rather than spinning the pushrod and attempting to get the correct ‘feel’, I suggest holding the pushrod between two fingers and lifting the pushrod up and down while slowly tightening the adjusting nut. When you reach the point where there is no up and down movement you will be at ‘0’ lash.

The problem with spinning the pushrod and attempting to get the correct ‘feel’ is that you can and will still be able to spin the pushrod even if you bottom out the lifter. This can cause you to over tighten the adjustment and can lead to bent and / or broken pushrods and valves.

Priming the oil system before starting the engine will fill the hydraulic lifters.
Think EO-IC
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Old 07-01-2004, 04:32 PM
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I was told by an old retired bus mechanic that what he does is to get an old dist. cap and drill out the center so you can see the the rotor turning and he will start at #1 tdc and adjust both intake and exhaust as mentioned for no play and 1/2 turn more. Then he looks down the dist cap and when the rotor points to the next cyl in the firing order set that one for no play and add 1/2 turn. and so on. What the thought on this method he say works on all motors. Ed ke6bnl
Do need to know the firing order and the cylinder arrangement.
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Old 07-01-2004, 05:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ed ke6bnl
I was told by an old retired bus mechanic that what he does is to get an old dist. cap and drill out the center so you can see the the rotor turning and he will start at #1 tdc and adjust both intake and exhaust as mentioned for no play and 1/2 turn more. Then he looks down the dist cap and when the rotor points to the next cyl in the firing order set that one for no play and add 1/2 turn. and so on. What the thought on this method he say works on all motors. Ed ke6bnl
Do need to know the firing order and the cylinder arrangement.
There are usually more than one 'correct' method to accomplish any task. Try several and use the one that seems to work best for you.

As to the above method, I believe it would work, but would not be very accurate. The method that I posted works best for me when adjusting the valves while the engine is cold and not running. I have also done the adjusting with the engine at operating temperature and running. I use an old valve cover that has an opening cut in the top to keep the mess to a minimum.
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:02 PM
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adjustin them valves

Man, I guess I do everything te hard way. I took and old distributor, ground the teeth off the bottom. Drove the pin out of the gear, slid the gear off, pulled the shaft out the top. I cut the top off the dis. housing just above the hold down ring. Cut the shaft off just below the advance works. ground the ruff off the shaft where I'd sawed it, put the gear back on and replaced the pin( make sure you don't put the gear on up side down) slide the shaft back in the housing, all way in, then use a center punch to punch the shaft just above the top of the housing. Remove the shaft and drill a hole with a 1/8 drill bit. Put it back together and drive a 1/8 roll pin in the hole, and it'll all stay together. It'll work without the pin, but it will keep coming apart. Now we got all that done. When I build the engine, I leave it on #1 TDC, after installing the heads, lifters, push rods, and rockers., I adjust the valves acording to the book for 0 slack plus 3/4 turn. Then I turn the engine over 1 rev, to TDC again and do the same with the rest of the valves, Now install the intake. Now for the fun part. Drop in the remanufactored dist. and top it off with a slow speed 1/2 drill motor. Fill her with oil, now is when I check the dip stick to see where the oil level is with the right amount of oil. Don't matter where it is now just remember. With the oil in it, turn on the drill, hopefully its a varispeed, but hang on, it going to try to turn. I ty mind off so it can't . I run the drill until oil comes out on every rocker. Some people use a screw driver to turn the pump, but I found without the dist. housing in the hole, it won't pu oil to all the rockers. Needless to say, this pushes oil through the engine. If you're feeling wirey, put and oil pressure gage in the hole on the back of the engine and see if buildup, you'll need to plug it if you don't, cause ita goin leak. O yes, back to the dip stick. Check to see where the oil level is, if its not on the mark, I use a file to make a notch at the full level. If you want a qt. low mark, next time you change it, stop a qt. from full, check it and file it again. Oh yea, forgot, you did put the oil filter on didn't you.
I don't like getting dirty anmore, just sure like watching younger folks, answering questions, and drinking coffee. Makes a body feal good. Sorry this was so lonnng.
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