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Old 10-10-2008, 01:32 PM
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I always get orange peel! I hate orange peel!

Everytime I spray clear, I get orange peel! It's really getting frustrating.
I am using an LPH-400 Iwata paint gun with 1.4 tip. It doesn't matter if the clear I am spraying is $75/gal or $300, I still get orange peel. I can spray lighter coats, I can spray heavier coats, in between. I adjust my my paint gun over and over. Nothing seems to make much of a difference!

Suggestions!??!

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Old 10-10-2008, 01:40 PM
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Use the slowesr activator and reducer, it'll help.
It's a delicate balance, putting it on wet enough to level out
and not to wet to run.
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Old 10-10-2008, 02:16 PM
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I always use the slowest reducers/activators available.

"It's a delicate balance, putting it on wet enough to level out
and not to wet to run. "

So I am probably not putting it on wet enough?

Thanks,
Shad
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Old 10-10-2008, 02:20 PM
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"A simple formula to remember is orange peel is fluid adjustment and run control is an air pressure adjustment. If youíre getting a few runs try upping the air pressure 5-10 pounds more."


You might read this:

http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com...your%20gun.htm
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Old 10-10-2008, 03:24 PM
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Give me the name of clear you are trying to spray and size of the compressor and tank along with length of air hose and I can get you very close.
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Old 10-10-2008, 06:19 PM
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the two most recent clears I've been using are SPI Universal Clear and Kirker Ultra EC300. Air compressor is 80gal. two stage 5 hp. 50' air hose, just switched to 1/2" w/ 3/8" couplers.

Thanks
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:01 PM
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Universal.
Screw fluid in all way and back out 2.75-3 turns.
Fan back-out all the way and screw in 3/4 of a turn.
Air pressure start at 25 lbs and up air as needed and most likely will be about 28lbs with your set up.
Gun with this set up needs to be held about 5 inches from car and should lay like glass.

Remember fluid adjusted in takes less air and fluid out will require higher air pressure. A fine tuning from this on fluid will be in not out past the three turns and with the set up you have I would guess 2.75 to 2.5 would be trick but gun distance is very important.

Sorry as never seen the kirker , so can't help.

Set gun up and go to bottom of fender or rocker and lay a one foot swipe, if you can touch the clear lightly in five minuets the air pressure is good, if its seven minutes or longer air pressure is to low by 2-4 lbs.

Also if you have the screen filter inside gun take out.
If using a regulater at gun make sure air adjustment on gun itself is all the way out (open)
Air at wall reg should be high as can set, you cannot adjust the air at the wall for gun and get good results.

Last edited by BarryK; 10-10-2008 at 07:14 PM.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:05 PM
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I have a couple of tips might help. I am familier with the gun you use it is one have have owned in the past( I paint every day this is what works for me no garuntee) I generally turn both top and bottom adjustments all the way in. top one then all the way open this is the fan adjustment. The second for air and paint mix I personally turn out 2-3 turns this gernerally give a nice easy to spray mix. Depend on product being applied I mix the first coat as directed while the second I add 10 to 15 % reducer( yes even if not called for) this allows the second coat to melt in to the first and will also help any areas that may be on the peely side to flow out. Becareful as once over reduced it does run easier and over reducing can lead to solvent pop. it to is fine line but with practice it gets easier
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:21 PM
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thanks for all the suggestions. I haven't tried shooting with that much air pressure. According to manf. specs for the LPH400 I should have ~16 at inlet. I usually shoot it at about 20psi, but I will try bumping it up and go from there.
A little reducer in the second coat sounds like a good idea, should flow a little better and meld in with the first coat.
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Old 10-10-2008, 09:32 PM
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The 1/2" hose is overkill. Probbly dropping your CFM as well.
I got about the same set up except a 60 gal.comp.
3/8" hose and couplers are plenty.
Universial and a LPH-400 LV should be around 22-25# WITH THE TRIGGER FULLY PULLED. Repete. TRIGGER FULLY PULLED!!!
You pull to just "air" and you'll be about 10# off or low.
Those guns drop 5-10# between air and fluid on the trigger pull.
I've used both the gun regulator and the wall reg. Which is what I use now,ditched the gun reg and opted for a tee fitting with a male hose connector-guage-female connector AT the gun to check psi AT the gun and adjust my wall reg to get what I need with the TRIGGER FULLY PULLED.
Like said,2.75-3 turns out on the fluid and wide open and back in around 3/4 turn on the fan. Around 5" off panel and "medium" speed. In other words,enough speed to cover but not slow enough to run.
Side light what your spraying and lean forward enough to SEE what you laying down.Speed up or slow down to get your coverage right.You'll SEE what I mean if the reflection is right as your painting.
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Old 10-11-2008, 06:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bee4Me
The 1/2" hose is overkill. Probbly dropping your CFM as well.
I got about the same set up except a 60 gal.comp.
3/8" hose and couplers are plenty.
Universial and a LPH-400 LV should be around 22-25# WITH THE TRIGGER FULLY PULLED. Repete. TRIGGER FULLY PULLED!!!
You pull to just "air" and you'll be about 10# off or low.
Those guns drop 5-10# between air and fluid on the trigger pull.
I've used both the gun regulator and the wall reg. Which is what I use now,ditched the gun reg and opted for a tee fitting with a male hose connector-guage-female connector AT the gun to check psi AT the gun and adjust my wall reg to get what I need with the TRIGGER FULLY PULLED.
Like said,2.75-3 turns out on the fluid and wide open and back in around 3/4 turn on the fan. Around 5" off panel and "medium" speed. In other words,enough speed to cover but not slow enough to run.
Side light what your spraying and lean forward enough to SEE what you laying down.Speed up or slow down to get your coverage right.You'll SEE what I mean if the reflection is right as your painting.
Agree with what you are saying - 3/8 id hose with hi flow couplers is more than adequate.
I take exception to your statement about the dropped cfm, that can't happen by increasing the hose size. 1 in, 1 out until such time that there is no more "room" for another 1. Increasing the id of the hose allows room for more 1's to fit in.
An analogy (poor one at best) is a hiway. 2 lane hiway (3/8 id hose), 60 mph (velocity) and 2 cars (cfm) wide. The most cars that hiway (hose) can carry are 2 cars wide, bumper to bumper at 60mph. There are only 2 ways to get more cars down the hiway in a minute, either increase the speed limit or add lanes. Since we are using a set air pressure(speed limit) we can only add lanes. We build a hiway that is 3 lanes wide (1/2 id hose) we can now run 3 cars wide at the same speed limit and pass 50% more volume(cfm) down our hiway.
(actual increase is a bit greater)
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Old 10-11-2008, 07:37 AM
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Orange peel in paint

I could be the least experienced painter to respond, but I know a (very) little.
Most everything above is good advise, but it boils down to one thing. If you have orange peel, the paint is going on too dry and is not flowing out.
There are many variables in spraying paint, and they all affect it, and most of then interact with each other.
Being able to see what you are doing is critical. If you are not an experienced painter, being able to see is an absolute necessity.
Clears are hard to see. Practice gun technique with other materials. Look for flow out. If you cannot lay down a primer without orange peel, you probably will not be able to lay down a clear.
I take notes of everything. Temperature, time of day, weather conditions, materials used, gun settings used, everything! Change only one thing at a time.
Gun technique is very important, and if you change something else, you could very easily cause an larger and opposite change if your gun technique changes.
Example: opening up the fluid control on the gun, and then compensating by moving the gun faster, or holding it farther away.
In short, you must be able to see very well, take notes of every thing, and try to be consistant with your gun technique.
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Old 10-11-2008, 08:13 AM
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From forty years of custom painting, this is what I know. Orange peal comes from ALL of the coats you are putting on. Sealer, base, every thing. It shows up in clear, and that may be the only place you are getting it--but I doubt it.
Orange peal comes from the paint being to thick or going on to dry. It comes out as tiny balls of snot. As suggested, try more air pressure, slower reducer, better gun control. All of the have to be adjusted on a daily basis as weather and jobs change.
Good luck
Dave Tallant
Daves Hot Rod Shop
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Old 10-12-2008, 04:42 AM
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What really helped me establish a way to stay at a consistent
speed and distance from the panel was to actually to count out loud (not too loud) each pass at 1 second per foot and 8 to 10 inches from the surface..

Here's a link to a couple real short clips (not long and boring) that show a couple passes that you can count the 4 seconds to cross a 4 foot hood and see the gun distance staying consistent too.

As mentioned already to change your style one thing at a time and you'll dial it in.

http://www.a2zautoforums.com/showpos...3&postcount=12

The slower passes call for having the right temp reducer for the temperature of the booth/clean-room.. 70 degrees being ideal, You don't want the reducer to hang wet to long either..



In this picture you can make out the cloud/fog of overspray being "pushed" by the guns air and drawn off and away from the panel towards the exhaust side of the room..

Keep in mind to start on the "upwind" end of the car/panel closest to the intake filters if in a cross flow booth/clean-room set up so over spray isn't dragged/splashed into wet clear finishing up near the exhaust fan(s) side.


**This thread is one of the best I've read on pursuing orange peel and sure has excellent input from all..

Last edited by milo; 10-12-2008 at 05:45 AM. Reason: link
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Old 10-12-2008, 09:11 AM
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LOL!

Milo, I thought I was the only wacko that painted in cadence, hell I would have never admitted I talk to myself when painting.
Will now!
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