I bought Dupont products to paint rusted car parts, but I feel like I'm wrong... - Page 2 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Body - Exterior
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 11:54 AM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Canada, Qc
Age: 32
Posts: 23
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Finally!
Here is my special sandwich recipe to fix paint.

Bare metal
Bondo
2K Urethane primer-filler
Basecoat
Clearcoat

Sounds good?
If it's a yes, I'll jump into my car to get all that stuff!
I am so excited to try fixing my car painting for the first time.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 12:03 PM
cyclopsblown34's Avatar
Colorsanding painter
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Russellville, Missouri
Age: 47
Posts: 976
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 98
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Looks good to me. Make certain your sanding of the filler is within the tolerance of the 2K surfacer/primer. Don't get much finer than 600 grit before the color/base coat goes on. it needs some tooth to bite to.

When you mix the filler make certain it is consistent color and not two colors. mix just enough for the task at hand. You shouldn't need more than a quart of any of the materials you're looking at. You do need lacquer thinner/gun wash for cleaning the paint gun between materials through it. A set of gun cleaning brushes doesn't hurt either.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 12:09 PM
deadbodyman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Stripping paint Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: augusta,ga.
Age: 53
Posts: 6,036
Wiki Edits: 11

Thanks: 23
Thanked 432 Times in 363 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline
Sorry but you are dead wrong! Bondo sticks very well to etch primer providing its dry and roughed with something like 80 grit. Although it is yesterday's technology it still works very well. Epoxy is really the way to go but since the poster already had the etch I saw no reason to tell him to return it. Especially considering it was a very small job.

Also, the spell check button is there for a reason (it makes your posts more easily readable), please feel free to use it.
All I got to say is it didnt stick for me and if you sand the etch primer it with 80 it'll come right off so way use it in the first place? ...the proper way to use etching primer is like a sealer transparent (thin enough to see through when wet)I know this very well you may think its sticking but when your all done and blow it off, if the air catches an edge it'll start coming off I know this as fact I've done it with dupont etching primer I did have to pull most of the thicker parts off with a putty knife but the spots where it was thin blew off ...It was 8hrs of work on a Trans Am shaker hood and I'll never forget that lesson .primers will stick,bondo WONT...Return the etching primer and get some epoxy.....SPI has the best and the best deal...bondo sticks well to it...This is what I do for a living...but like i said you really dont need it any of it for a small spot job just some 2k will be fine BUT an aftermarket fender runs 50.00 and a hood 100.00 for that car so I wouldnt waste my time doing a repair its way cheaper to replace and just repaint,an even cheaper option is to get the right color sheetmetal from a salvage yard and just bolt them on and be done with it.I sertainly hop dat were clear enough .LOL
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 12:17 PM
deadbodyman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Stripping paint Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: augusta,ga.
Age: 53
Posts: 6,036
Wiki Edits: 11

Thanks: 23
Thanked 432 Times in 363 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by klingfilm
Finally!
Here is my special sandwich recipe to fix paint.

Bare metal
Bondo
2K Urethane primer-filler
Basecoat
Clearcoat

Sounds good?
If it's a yes, I'll jump into my car to get all that stuff!
I am so excited to try fixing my car painting for the first time.
The one thing I havnt conciderd is ..If you want to learn ,this is a great way to do it.some pictures of the damage will help.painting from edge to edge might not be a good way to paint... blending is preferd and not that much harder get back with us before you sand the primer the sandpaper grits are important
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 12:46 PM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Canada, Qc
Age: 32
Posts: 23
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Ah...,
You are just making me feel more uncertain all the time But you won't get rid of me like that!
I really plan to try to paint it whether it's cheaper to buy new parts or not. The question is more about the fun and the thrill to try it for the first time. This car is my big toy. I don't care about its value. This is my first car and I try to fix everything on it. If I do worse I'll send it to the garage.
Now, I'm not gonna keep the etch primer for sure, I bought that because it's in a can and I have only 1 gun. So, wouldn't have to clean it 3 times. I didn't know what I was buying and the guy at the shop gave me this primer. When I saw primer, I felt confident because primer is what you use before painting when you have to paint a room. Well, I realize it is not so simple with car painting.

It seems that 2k primer is a bigger need, but what type should I buy? I want to stick with Dupont to ensure the compatibility of chemistry.
I'll go take a picture of my car outside to show you the damage.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 05:23 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Mopar tapered axle rear brake conversion
Last journal entry: What I'm doing now...
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,267
Wiki Edits: 49

Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Please disregard this post. The post below has answered my question.

Last edited by Centerline; 10-07-2009 at 10:00 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 09:26 PM
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Green Bay, WI
Age: 44
Posts: 2,073
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
dp 90 is not etch primer, it is ppg's epoxy, before it went lead free. Can't remember the colors, 90=black? but ppg used dp and the number after it was different for different colors. Was a very good epoxy. Not its dplf, and I haven't used it since the old dp days, but in past threads it has been discussed how the quality has declined since it was reformulated and went lead free.
I'd personally would use epoxy, and return the etch, and let the bang em out collision shops use the etch. I have to agree with deadbodyman here. To many risks (now or in the future) and potential compatability problems with the acid components for the quality of the product IMO. It also is a 1k product that stays soluable and can be softened by solvents in materials applied over it. The Etch primers I have used were not meant to be applied heavy like dbm meantioned, and they would easily enough run all over the place if applied heavily, and another primer must be used over them before paint (again watch compatability). I haven't used etch often, but when I did, probably used variprime the most.

Many manufacturers have strict warnings in there product data sheets about not using bodyfiller over etch or etch over body filler, as the acid etch and polyester fillers don't get along, and the filler could never cure properly. You better make sure it has cured plenty enough time so that the acid component won't cause a problem with you filler or other products.

The safest way with least risks of problems and incompatabilitys, that will give a strong foundation for a long lasting durable paint job, IMO is physically removing all rust, sand any baremetal with 80 if not media blasted for something for the epoxy to hang onto, and start with an epoxy foundation over baremetal and under filler areas, apply filler over epoxy and seal up bodywork areas with epoxy.

I have no problems with a high build urethane primer (and I've used them often enough) over the epoxy if needed, but urethane primers do shrink somewhat, and are somewhat porous, and will not give the best corrosion protection applied over metal, so epoxy is prefered first under the urethane. But if you have a straight vehicle, and spend a little extra time finishing off your bodywork and getting it straight, epoxy may be all you need for a primer.

Most epoxys don't have the amount of build of a urethane or sand as easy. But I used only epoxy on a dent repair this weekend. I used southern polyurethanes epoxy, and it has a bit more build then other epoxys I've used, and could be dry blocked the next day. Choose the best color for coverage of your base color, finish off your bodywork well, and epoxy may be all you need.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 09:49 PM
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Mopar tapered axle rear brake conversion
Last journal entry: What I'm doing now...
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,267
Wiki Edits: 49

Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenseth17
dp 90 is not etch primer, it is ppg's epoxy, before it went lead free.
Good information to know. For some reason I always thought of it as a self etching primer and not epoxy.

Last edited by Centerline; 10-07-2009 at 10:01 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 05:33 AM
deadbodyman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Stripping paint Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: augusta,ga.
Age: 53
Posts: 6,036
Wiki Edits: 11

Thanks: 23
Thanked 432 Times in 363 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by klingfilm
Ah...,
You are just making me feel more uncertain all the time But you won't get rid of me like that!
I really plan to try to paint it whether it's cheaper to buy new parts or not. The question is more about the fun and the thrill to try it for the first time. This car is my big toy. I don't care about its value. This is my first car and I try to fix everything on it. If I do worse I'll send it to the garage.
Now, I'm not gonna keep the etch primer for sure, I bought that because it's in a can and I have only 1 gun. So, wouldn't have to clean it 3 times. I didn't know what I was buying and the guy at the shop gave me this primer. When I saw primer, I felt confident because primer is what you use before painting when you have to paint a room. Well, I realize it is not so simple with car painting.

It seems that 2k primer is a bigger need, but what type should I buy? I want to stick with Dupont to ensure the compatibility of chemistry.
I'll go take a picture of my car outside to show you the damage.
Now your talking,Nason (dupont's cheaper line)has a 2k thats fairly good sands easy and is fairly inexpensive...a quart should do ya.....dont forget the hardner.... If that deer damaged the center of the hood at all you might not be able to fix it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 05:50 AM
deadbodyman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Stripping paint Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: augusta,ga.
Age: 53
Posts: 6,036
Wiki Edits: 11

Thanks: 23
Thanked 432 Times in 363 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Centerline
Good information to know. For some reason I always thought of it as a self etching primer and not epoxy.
DP was good it could be applied over bare metal aluminum and galvinized from what I remember but it was an epoxy....Variprime was what I was tring to think of, it washed right of with laquer thinner and wax & grease remover if I remember correctly(its been over twenty years since I used it)..after stripping it was used to help the old laquer primers stick to metal...Yup ,I remember when the 2k's came out.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 10:32 AM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Canada, Qc
Age: 32
Posts: 23
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Ok,
Let me resume again everything. Whatever I do, I'll have to make a compromise if I don't want to buy the whole range of Dupont products.

Plan A sandwich with epoxy primer
-Bare metal
-Epoxy-primer -->Sticks well on metal and protects against corrosion, I am in Qu頡nd corrosion is a problem here.
-Bondo
-Epoxy-primer --> Which needs a 80 grid finish to let the base coat sticks to it
-Base coat
-Clear coat
Pros: Good protection against rush, no need to buy 2k primer
Cons: Finish may be rough between epoxy and base coat and the final result may reflect this. Sanding could be long because the epoxy is hard.

Plan B sandwich with 2k primer
-Bare metal
-Bondo -->no real barrier for rust
-2k primer filler ---> easy to sand for a smooth finish
-Base coat
-Clear coat
Pros:No need to buy an epoxy primer, easier to sand to get a smooth finish
Cons: No real protection for rush in between.

Plan C sandwich "gourmet"
Stop looking at your wallet and go buy epoxy and 2k primer

Which menu would you suggest?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 10:59 AM
deadbodyman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Stripping paint Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: augusta,ga.
Age: 53
Posts: 6,036
Wiki Edits: 11

Thanks: 23
Thanked 432 Times in 363 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by klingfilm
Ok,
Let me resume again everything. Whatever I do, I'll have to make a compromise if I don't want to buy the whole range of Dupont products.

Plan A sandwich with epoxy primer
-Bare metal
-Epoxy-primer -->Sticks well on metal and protects against corrosion, I am in Qu頡nd corrosion is a problem here.
-Bondo
-Epoxy-primer --> Which needs a 80 grid finish to let the base coat sticks to it
-Base coat
-Clear coat
Pros: Good protection against rush, no need to buy 2k primer
Cons: Finish may be rough between epoxy and base coat and the final result may reflect this. Sanding could be long because the epoxy is hard.

Plan B sandwich with 2k primer
-Bare metal
-Bondo -->no real barrier for rust
-2k primer filler ---> easy to sand for a smooth finish
-Base coat
-Clear coat
Pros:No need to buy an epoxy primer, easier to sand to get a smooth finish
Cons: No real protection for rush in between.

Plan C sandwich "gourmet"
Stop looking at your wallet and go buy epoxy and 2k primer

Which menu would you suggest?
I'd go with plan B and save a little cash it'll bodyshop quality,its not a resto,anything else would be overkill,its the experiance you really want,save the epoxy for your next project.because after this you'll be looking,trust me..its a very addictive hobby.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 11:09 AM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Canada, Qc
Age: 32
Posts: 23
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Wow,
Now ready to go!
I'll just switch etch for 2k primer at the NAPA shop.
Thanks a lot for the information and tips, it is very interesting and useful.

We'll meet on another thread soon I think. I need a paint gun now!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 01:21 PM
88_mopar's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Stuck in ohio
Age: 24
Posts: 29
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Just to make sure you understand, body filler needs a 36-40 grit scratch to hold on to. So sand rust off with 36 grit, apply filler, sand that with 80 grit to form it, then 220-320 to remove the 80 grit scratches. After its sanded with 220-320, spray your epoxy primer. Once its dry, block sand it out with 400-600 grit. Now your ready for base and clear.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 01:28 PM
cyclopsblown34's Avatar
Colorsanding painter
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Russellville, Missouri
Age: 47
Posts: 976
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 98
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
The epoxy won't stick to those fine of scratches finer than 80 grit. As for sanding the epoxy prior to paint, you can sand the epoxy as fine as you wish but I don't get any finer than 600 grit before applying paint.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Body - Exterior posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
what is the fastest (factory) car you have ever driven? badknuckles Hotrodders' Lounge 320 12-09-2011 01:32 AM
Accidentally bought another beetle.......... zbhover Hotrodding Basics 7 04-07-2009 06:17 PM
what color to paint? jum Body - Exterior 14 07-30-2006 12:29 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.