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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 07:59 PM
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Thanks carsavvycook......

Interesting comment you make about the torque converter. I bolt it to the ring gear and it is tight against it.
Then the motor mount holes line up and the transmission mount lines up, so I cannot see how I could have the torque converter not seated all the way. And I am sure the transmission lines are crimp free and have no blockage. I tape off the lines with a baggie and a rubber band all the time the truck sits awaiting the engine. But I will double check that. Thanks.
As I said, I have yet to pull the crank out, so I expect to see things not doing well there either. The excessive end play of the crank cannot be doing good things to all of those parts hanging on to the crank.
The knock was certainly coming from #5. The inserts are almost totally eaten away. Any idea what could have caused this?
So far, no sign of heat, blueing or anything like that at all. The crank rotates freely with no rods on it, but I suppose that means nothing........pg

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 08:00 PM
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First off i'll say that is some very impressive photography! Second, if you find the builders name, let me know please. I'd like to pay them a visit with some photos.

Mark
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmark
First off i'll say that is some very impressive photography! Second, if you find the builders name, let me know please. I'd like to pay them a visit with some photos.

Mark
Will do for sure Mark.....pg
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 08:49 PM
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I would have to agree with the rods being out of round, the crank not being balanced or the engine builder set it up with excessive clearance. If the bearings were set up at say .0045 to .005 play and a high pressure pump was used to compensate for the oil pressure drop I think you would see these patterns after some time.

It wouldn't be apparent right away but once the bearings started to wear the problem would get exponentially worse. Good thing you caught it when you did though or it would have ruined the crank eventually.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double_v23
I would have to agree with the rods being out of round, the crank not being balanced or the engine builder set it up with excessive clearance. If the bearings were set up at say .0045 to .005 play and a high pressure pump was used to compensate for the oil pressure drop I think you would see these patterns after some time.
It wouldn't be apparent right away but once the bearings started to wear the problem would get exponentially worse. Good thing you caught it when you did though or it would have ruined the crank eventually.
Yes, that makes sense. Was the crank balanced? I have no idea. The engine idled and ran smoothly at all times.
Now that I have opened it up I see holes on the counterweights of the crank in places, and in other places on the counter weights I see raw weld filling a portion of some of the holes. The result of balancing? Is that what the factory does? Somehow it seems like a raw way for a manufacturer to finish something like a crank.
One thing is for certain.....the bearings are shot after only 15K miles, and that is just not right. I have baby-ed this engine and changed the oil every 3000 miles, and always using a new filter.
I see felt tip markings on the rod and main caps denoting measurements shown in the thousandths, so somebody did some measuring. If they went to that trouble you would think they would have fit up the engine correctly. Apparently not though.
That is one more reason I have decided to try to do it myself. People are willing to take your money, but reluctant to give you what you have paid for. Oh well, it's live and learn regardless what our problems may be......pg
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 09:32 PM
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There are welds in the crank did any one see that. Is this how they balaned the crank
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 10:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n-gin
There are welds in the crank did any one see that. Is this how they balaned the crank
Yep, they welded in an existing hole to change the weight. Seems okydoky to me. But then again, i'm a cabinet maker not an engine builder.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2008, 11:48 PM
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piniongear i agree with u there are alot of people out there that will give u a shotty product and then u are *** out in long run, and would have been better off doing it urself. Its almost like then reused a crank instead of giving u a new 1 but it is hard to tell when u have 15k on it but I am really interested in seeing the crank pics. I had a rod halve up on me cuz the guy over torked the whole motor it was amzing that it lasted as long as it did........hmmmm know thinking about it my rod went about 3 months or 15k something like that cuz when i bought the motor guy said there was 5 on it so really 10k and then i put 5k on then it went and destroyed the crank and rod but saved the rest some people are just not honest to bad to here that about #5 and u do take some great photography.


I think that the rod pin got so hot that its probally not the exact same as others now.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 74chevy454
piniongear i agree with u there are alot of people out there that will give u a shotty product and then u are *** out in long run, and would have been better off doing it urself. Its almost like then reused a crank instead of giving u a new 1 but it is hard to tell when u have 15k on it but I am really interested in seeing the crank pics. I had a rod halve up on me cuz the guy over torked the whole motor it was amzing that it lasted as long as it did........hmmmm know thinking about it my rod went about 3 months or 15k something like that cuz when i bought the motor guy said there was 5 on it so really 10k and then i put 5k on then it went and destroyed the crank and rod but saved the rest some people are just not honest to bad to here that about #5 and u do take some great photography.
I think that the rod pin got so hot that its probally not the exact same as others now.
Yes, I have to wonder about that pin in hole #5. No sign of any extra heat but then I have not removed the pin yet either. The #5 big end bearing was so worn out that I am astonished that it knocked only when the rpm was up. I guess that is just a sign of how these engines can take a beating and still keep running on.
With the rods removed I can grab the harmonic balancer and give the crank a spin and it still rotates after my hands leave the balancer. In other words, it turns freely.
My next step is to remove the crank and we will see what that brings to light.
Before I took anything apart, I went over every bolt and nut to check what they were torqued at. Everything was exactly correct with the torque values stated in the factory repair manual.
More photos to come within a few days. I have to get a balance removal tool and some pullers for the cam and crank sprockets before I can make much more progress..........pg
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 09:25 AM
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The factory did not add weight by welding in plugs like that so I would say that your engine was balanced during the rebuild.

I would think that they set the clearances too loose. What oil pump was in the motor? Does it have a plug that you can change the pressure spring in it? What color is the spring if it is changeable?
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double_v23
The factory did not add weight by welding in plugs like that so I would say that your engine was balanced during the rebuild.
I would think that they set the clearances too loose. What oil pump was in the motor? Does it have a plug that you can change the pressure spring in it? What color is the spring if it is changeable?
The oil pump is a Melling High Output pump. I am uncertain if I can change the pressure on it.
In a talk with a Melling tech guy, he did not mention that feature when I called him concerned with the 55lbs when I first installed the engine 3 years back......pg
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 01:53 PM
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pistons

have you checked the roundness of the pistons one of them could possibly be a little oval before the engine heats up and the piston rings expand causing it to knock till the engine heats enough for the piston rings to fix the gap just a theory but a possibilty
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carolinarednecknc
have you checked the roundness of the pistons one of them could possibly be a little oval before the engine heats up and the piston rings expand causing it to knock till the engine heats enough for the piston rings to fix the gap just a theory but a possibilty
Well the bores look good and the piston skirts look like they just came out of the box.
I believe the knock was coming from the big end of #5 rod since the insert is all but gone. Thanks for your comment......pg
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 07:09 PM
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Back with some crank photos....

This morning I removed the camshaft and crank.
The crank bearings were worn about the same as the rod journal bearings, i.e., lots of copper showing, except for #5 at the rear. It was mostly silver colored.
Here are the 5 main journals, starting with #5 and going to #1.
I will add some more pics in the next reply......pg
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2008, 07:59 PM
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Here are the pics of the crank journals for the rods.
First pic is for #1/#2,
then #3/#4,
then #5/#6, Notice #5 (on the right side). This is the worst rod of the bunch.
#7/#8,
and last shot is of the weld put into the crank to achieve balance I assume.

Next pics will be of the crank Main journals......pg
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