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Old 09-03-2009, 03:40 AM
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Idea for a future big block build

Well I've been pondering some ideas for my 67' for when we get moved back east I think I may end up going with a big block. I'm thinking about building it with a somewhat resto-look (painted orange with tonowanda decals on chrome valve covers, very basic external features) and be somewhat of a sleeper (this goes the other way from another project I have sitting to the side, a turbo 6.0L EFI). I'm thinking I could pick up a good 454 truck core, rebuild it with some new pistons, set of ProTopline heads, E-Brock Performer RPM manifold and a Performer RPM camshaft (yes I know I could choose some others, but I have seen some decent results from this one and it's just an idea). To top it off I'm considering a concealed top-shot nitrous system with the 150 jets. I'm thinking the car should put down 400 or so at the tires fairly easy off the kit (thinking more around 425-430). Anyone see any problems with those figures? That should move my Biscayne to mid-low 11's, traction permitting, and should still be a good cruiser. My MPG will suck but once I'm back east, she won't be my DD anymore and really, do you buy anything pre-75 for fuel mileage? If I go this route she will be getting a 12-bolt and will probably switch over to a TH400 with around a 2600 stall. I'm thinking I could still keep the rear gears around 3.08-3.23 to aid in highway cruising and still post decent times if I take it to the strip.
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Old 09-03-2009, 05:50 AM
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For a 9:1 street friendly/strip 454 on the juice:
Try this moderate duration street/strip mechanical cam Lunati #402A2LUN
use a 11" "3000 stall converter" (th350 th400) and 3.73's
It will run very well for you in both N/A and on the juice. It has easy street manors.
The mechanical lifters will hang in there at the top end on the juice much much better than any hydraulic will.
Hydraulics give up the ghost too soon at higher rpm, expecially with the heavy BBC valvetrain.

Don't forget your neck brace.

For a lower hyway cruise rpm with the 3.73's use a tall street tire on the back of your BI Scane.
If you under gear it you won;t get the desired effect you want.
(see above warning about the brace)

The fuel mileage will be very reasonable with a proper set up distributor that includes fine tuned vacuum advance and correct carb jettiing.
This is a very street friendly no hassle cam. Much like the old factory LS-6 454-450hp cam. Its an nice improvment on that.
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Old 09-03-2009, 12:28 PM
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Gotcha! I ran a solid cam in my 87' build awhile back. Gotta love setting lash lol. I'm running 27" tall tires on the rear right now. What kind of power do you think that setup would make? I was originally thinking of running around 10:1 compression but still debating on that one.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:57 PM
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Another question for you, has anyone ran a single mechanical pump and split off it for nitrous use? I know on EFI cars you tap into the fuel rail, and I know I can run a separate fuel system for the nitrous (holley blue pump probably), but was wondering if I could use say the clay smith 6-valve fuel pump. It's 1/2" out to a regulator and run 2 lines off the regulator, one to the carb and the other to the fuel solenoid. It would help with my sleeper look I'd be going for but not sure how well it would work.
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Old 09-04-2009, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RamAirZ
Another question for you, has anyone ran a single mechanical pump and split off it for nitrous use? I know on EFI cars you tap into the fuel rail, and I know I can run a separate fuel system for the nitrous (holley blue pump probably), but was wondering if I could use say the clay smith 6-valve fuel pump. It's 1/2" out to a regulator and run 2 lines off the regulator, one to the carb and the other to the fuel solenoid. It would help with my sleeper look I'd be going for but not sure how well it would work.

I don't recomend T ing off the nitrous from a mechanical fuel pump.
Mechanical fuel pumps are great and can flow enough fuel of themselves but are effected by heat. Heat on the feed side fuel line. Exhaust, eninge block ehat etc.
These pumps will not move air bubbles thru the line. When the fuel in the feed side line from tank to pump gets hot the fuel boils. Becuase this is the suck side (lower pressure) the fuel boils in the line even easier.
When the ful pump stops moveing fuel to the carb or nitrous, ya burn up the motor. Lean vapour lock.
If you want to get into nitrous you want an electric fuel pump and a separate dedicated fuel system with electric pump for the nitrous.

You must have a bullet proof fuel delivery system. Nitrous only damages motors when you make a mistake. using a mechanical fuel pump with a T for the nitrous would be your first mistake. First time the feed side fuel line and/or the body of the pump itself gets a little too hot, good bye engine.

This combo is well capable of 10sec Quarter mile ets on 150hp used right at launch thru the whole quarter mile. Do not use a low stall converter. "3000 stall" minimum (11" converter) A 10" 3500 stall is not too much. A low stall torque converter on nitrous just adds to the potential of engine damage (overstress connecting rods) That would be your second mistake. You will need a drive shaft safety loop, slicks or ET streets and rear airlift airbags for traction. Do not use anythng but the best available fuel on nitrous.
Low octane gas would be your third mistake. 92-94 octane is ok with 150 hp.
Do not be afraid to add (unleaded) racing gas even at the 150hp level.
If you want to run more shot use 110 octane racing gas.
Race gas is cheaper than engine rebuilds.

l've found the holley blue pump to be unreliable in every day steet use.
They always start to leak or quit on ya. If you ever take on apart you'd see why Lucky if you get a year out of one.
These pumps pump a lot of fuel but do not last. They were never designed for daily street use. They are fine for a drag car. (until they start leaking)
On my car I use two two separate 3/8" fuel lines with in tank pickups, two 3/8" in line paper elemement fuel filters and two Carter P4594 fuel pumps. 7psi. No regulator is required for the carb. A holley regulator is used on the nitrous side. Its simple, One for the engine , one for the nitrous system.
Its bullet proof, its affordable and easy to install and to get replacement parts. (common 3/8" fuel line stuff) The combined system is capable of supporting a combined 900hp. It works. When you properly rubber mount the fuel pumps on a proper mounting bracket they are quiet. The engine/exhaust will be much louder. For normal street driving and for N/A drag runs you only switch on the engine system.

This is one good way to do it.

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 09-04-2009 at 02:02 AM.
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Old 09-04-2009, 05:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88
I don't recomend T ing off the nitrous from a mechanical fuel pump.
Mechanical fuel pumps are great and can flow enough fuel of themselves but are effected by heat. Heat on the feed side fuel line. Exhaust, eninge block ehat etc.
These pumps will not move air bubbles thru the line. When the fuel in the feed side line from tank to pump gets hot the fuel boils. Becuase this is the suck side (lower pressure) the fuel boils in the line even easier.
When the ful pump stops moveing fuel to the carb or nitrous, ya burn up the motor. Lean vapour lock.
If you want to get into nitrous you want an electric fuel pump and a separate dedicated fuel system with electric pump for the nitrous.

You must have a bullet proof fuel delivery system. Nitrous only damages motors when you make a mistake. using a mechanical fuel pump with a T for the nitrous would be your first mistake. First time the feed side fuel line and/or the body of the pump itself gets a little too hot, good bye engine.

This combo is well capable of 10sec Quarter mile ets on 150hp used right at launch thru the whole quarter mile. Do not use a low stall converter. "3000 stall" minimum (11" converter) A 10" 3500 stall is not too much. A low stall torque converter on nitrous just adds to the potential of engine damage (overstress connecting rods) That would be your second mistake. You will need a drive shaft safety loop, slicks or ET streets and rear airlift airbags for traction. Do not use anythng but the best available fuel on nitrous.
Low octane gas would be your third mistake. 92-94 octane is ok with 150 hp.
Do not be afraid to add (unleaded) racing gas even at the 150hp level.
If you want to run more shot use 110 octane racing gas.
Race gas is cheaper than engine rebuilds.

l've found the holley blue pump to be unreliable in every day steet use.
They always start to leak or quit on ya. If you ever take on apart you'd see why Lucky if you get a year out of one.
These pumps pump a lot of fuel but do not last. They were never designed for daily street use. They are fine for a drag car. (until they start leaking)
On my car I use two two separate 3/8" fuel lines with in tank pickups, two 3/8" in line paper elemement fuel filters and two Carter P4594 fuel pumps. 7psi. No regulator is required for the carb. A holley regulator is used on the nitrous side. Its simple, One for the engine , one for the nitrous system.
Its bullet proof, its affordable and easy to install and to get replacement parts. (common 3/8" fuel line stuff) The combined system is capable of supporting a combined 900hp. It works. When you properly rubber mount the fuel pumps on a proper mounting bracket they are quiet. The engine/exhaust will be much louder. For normal street driving and for N/A drag runs you only switch on the engine system.

This is one good way to do it.
Thanks for the info. I didn't think it was a good idea but thought I would pose the question as I'm sure someone else has wondered. I've played with nitrous for awhile so I'm familiar with the setup/usage and making sure everything is right (timing, plugs, fuel, etc). I don't plan on using the nitrous on the street but I have access to 110 octane airplane fuel which I used to run in my 87'. Only difference is it has some antifreeze in it but on a carb'd application with no O2 sensor it worked great. I ran a seperate Holley blue for just my nitrous on my 87', didn't use it all that often so never had any leakage problems. I might end up just putting a sump in the rear and running the lines off of it. dual 3/8's like your setup. It's still awhile down the road so I have plenty of time to put the pieces together. My last nitrous motor was in my 98' GMC Was running a 150 through it and a 100 + 7psi from a blower for awhile. That truck is STILL running strong today with well over 180K on the short block, and man did it move lol. My 87' was a solid Lunati cam, Vic JR, Dart II heads, 360ci, Holley 830cfm, non-lockup 700R-4 with 4000rpm stall, 4.10's with BFG Drag Radials. Now that car hauled the mail(11.90's on motor at 119, was setup for a 250 but never used it at the track).
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