Installing a pushbutton start - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Electrical
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 12:43 AM
Muscle car fan
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 864
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Installing a pushbutton start

Here is what i'd like to do, have my normal keyed ignition in order to charge the ignition system (so you need the keys in the ignition to start the car, like normal) but instead of twisting the key forward to engage the starter (i want that to do nothing), i would like to use a pushbutton switch such as those from painless wiring

how would i go about doing this? car is a 74 Gran Torino if that helps anyone get more specific

thanks a bunch

    Advertisement
__________________
'74 Gran Torino Project
351W, c6 trans, 9"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 12:48 AM
FASTCHEVY's Avatar
RatRod B4 RatRods were Cool
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas Texas
Age: 32
Posts: 800
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Just run keyed/ing power to the button, then from the button to
the starter sillynoid.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 04:08 AM
club327's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: australia
Age: 50
Posts: 334
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
fastchevy I was'nt sure what u meant with what u wrote (typos!) so if what I'm about to say is what u meant then I apologize - sheez! Anyway, with a push button starter switch you have the choice of;
a/ have it wired so that the starter motor can be activated regardless of whether or not the key's in the ignition.
b/ have it wired so the starter motor can only be activated when the ignition is ON.
The disadvantages of setup A are - reduced levels of theft protection and also safety issues when kids are in the car or when you're working on the engine, like doing a belt and someone finds that red button on the dash intriguing. The advantages are the convenience of being able to crank the engine without the ignition sparking for when you're doing a compression test, or trying to build up oil pressure prior to IGNITION ON.
The advantages and disadvantages of set up B are the opposites of the above with the added bonus of the whole thing being a little more professional in the way it operates.

To wire it up so that the starter can only be activated when the ignition is ON is to - find the wire at the ignition switch that powers up when the key is in the ON position. Connect this wire to the new switch and from the switch to the starter. Now the wiring should be at least the same gage/amp rating as the existing wiring. The other thing is that the ignition switch would now have to feed current to the starter motor as well as the other items all through the one contact which may eventually lead to switch failure. If that bothers you then fit a relay to do the heavy current switching for the starter motor .
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 06:02 AM
Wrencher's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: cincinnati
Age: 56
Posts: 607
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 5
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
As both said, take either a constant 12v from fusebox, or 12v from ign switch on, and go to pushbutton, from button to small terminal on solenoid, remove old wire.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 01:11 PM
Muscle car fan
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 864
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
k cool, didn't think it would be quite that easy

knowing me, it probably won't be once i start at it....but in theory everything works
__________________
'74 Gran Torino Project
351W, c6 trans, 9"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 01:41 PM
club327's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: australia
Age: 50
Posts: 334
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I would'nt be taking the power from the fuse box......as it's not adequate for the starter motor current draw. And why would you want to, the power going to the ignition switch is supplied via a fusible link, so the same protective theory would still apply to your new wiring system
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 02:04 PM
Wrencher's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: cincinnati
Age: 56
Posts: 607
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 5
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
327

He could use either option, all he's doing is energizing the starter relay, not the starter itself!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 02:14 PM
club327's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: australia
Age: 50
Posts: 334
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
well the solenoid still draws about 25 to 30 amps of current which can be a reliability issue going through the fuse box. Plus you'd have an extra unsightly wire from the fuse box which can be difficult to connect to. Which fuse do you pick? Hopefully the one that would be at idle and just waiting for your starter wire. You won't wanna pick a fuse that's already feeding another load. But yes, it will work either way.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 02:25 PM
Muscle car fan
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 864
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
are there 2 wires running up the column to the starter switch, or is there only one and then a common power or ground that the line will be connected to to energize?

if it's 2 wires it should be pretty simple, just a matter of routing new wires connected to those ones down to the switch

i don't see you'd need a fuse as there is probably allready a fuse in the normal starter engagement switch line, and i don't think it would be AT the switch.
__________________
'74 Gran Torino Project
351W, c6 trans, 9"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 03:26 PM
malc's Avatar
Living At The Speed Of Life
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Espaņa Right Coast
Posts: 3,259
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 90
Thanked 92 Times in 78 Posts
Iīve always fancied doing this and putting the start button
in a concealed place.That new high powered Mercedes Coupe has itīs starter button in the top of the shift lever, hidden by a swing out cap.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 02-25-2004, 07:10 PM
Member
 

Last journal entry: JB's 37 Pickup
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Smoky Mountains
Age: 76
Posts: 2,358
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Ok, 74 Gran Torino. Assuming original wiring and an auto tranny. There would be a neutral safety switch involved and you would want to preserve this. The cleanest package you could do would be to remove the wire from the starter position on the ignition switch and run it to your push button switch. Then splice in to the hot lead to the ignition switch (biggest red wire going into the steering column) and attach to the other pole on the push button. Now you have a switch in the original wiring circuit that is protected and you have your neutral safety switch in line as well. When the starter button is depressed you are powering the solenoid under the hood and this should not be more than a few amps, but you have the fused link to protect the circuit. You can make this keyed power to the button, which is not my preference ( I have both set ups), by splicing into the the wire going to accessories from the run position on the ignition switch. This will work fine, but will interrupt your accessories when the starter button is depressed.

Trees
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 02-27-2004, 07:46 AM
dollybud's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Trenton, On. Canada
Age: 65
Posts: 182
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Arrow

Trees has the correct and safest method. One thing I would personally do is add a "kill switch"(ordinary toggle switch). You can hide it, and it will help to act as a anti theft method, and also to shut down your engine in an emergency. Use the key strictly to run accessories.Turn the kill switch on, hit the starter button, and away you go, Flip the kill switch to shut off. To wire one in go to the knowledge section, very easily done.
__________________
Tom
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 03-02-2004, 09:16 AM
allancl's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 7
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
You can go one step further, as I did, and remove the metal key all together. I went to all rocker switches to power accessories, coil, fuel pump and then the start button.

In order to add security I installed the KE-1601 Keyless entry keypad, the same one found on the driver door of new cars, in line with the starter button, via a 30amp relay.

When the key pad access coded is entered, the starter button is charged and can be used to start the car. When the lockout code is entered, the start circuit is broken.

No more key! and it looks cool. $250 for the keypad and relay is a bit steep. But it works the crowd at the auto shows.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2004, 06:21 PM
Rubberman2003's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Ohio
Age: 29
Posts: 806
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I want to do this on my camaro. The selenoid is on the starter itself right. A small cylinder looking thing, where the wires goto
?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 03-08-2004, 09:59 AM
allancl's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 7
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rubberman - That is were it was on my 78 Firebird. In fact, when the thing went out on me I used to use a screwdriver and start the car by crossing the terminals on the silinoid.

This is basicaly the same thing.

I am working with an electrical engineer to design a very simple "smart" keypad that will trigger a latching relay connected to the solenoid.

I will post the details when I have it all tested.
- Lee

Sorry for the errors in my last post. Didn't have my coffee yet!

Solenoid - I mis-spelled it the first time.

The latching relay will be connected to the start switch not directly to the solenoid. Boy would that be fun to watch!!!??

Anyway, more details to follow for those interested.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Electrical posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.