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Old 06-02-2005, 08:14 PM
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Iron Eagle Platinum or World 220 heads?

Which heads would be better for a street driven 383 producing at least 450 horsepower-Iron Eagle Platinum or World 220 heads?

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Old 06-02-2005, 08:31 PM
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Street driven...? You mean mostly with some track time...? Some may dissagree but seems like to much head for the street mainly...? Those type heads flow much better above 3K RPM and at high lifts... Pretty easy to make 400+ HP with a 180cc intake runner head and if its alum then 11 to 1 can be done on the street 10.5 for sure...

Dunno I play with BBC`s... DOH...!
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Old 06-02-2005, 10:25 PM
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A 220cc head is a bit large for a street 383 or even 400. I have a pretty wild 388 and I only run 215cc heads. I also ran them on another 385 and 383. You really should stay in the 190-200cc range for a street 383, there is just no need for the large runners unless you plan to spin a lot of RPM and make big power up top. With that said 383's don't really need to be spun to the moon (shoot for 6300-6500 max) to make very good power. They are a toque engine not a high winding engine by nature.

I have been running them (small block strokers) for years and I love them but, if you want to take advantage of heads that big (220cc) on a 383ci engine you will need to have big compression to support the cam needed to make the most of the heads. It's all about combination. When you say street driven that means pump gas to me, this limits your compression options.

What cam do you have planned for this engine? Converter? Gear ratio? How heavy is the car? Intake and carb?

Just trying to get an idea of what you are trying to do and see if the combo looks decent.

Royce
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Old 06-02-2005, 11:02 PM
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The iron eagle would be my choice. Very good flowing head, tons of potential. Not a problem running that head on a 383. You will want to cam it with close to if not slightly more that 240 duration and get the lift into the .550 range or better. With an auto that means a stall of 3000 and 3.73 gears. Keep compression at a REAL 9.5, meaning measure everything to insure the heads cc correctly and the piston is zero to the block deck at TDC.
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Old 06-02-2005, 11:47 PM
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anything with at least 2.02/1.60 valves and 180cc intake runners.you have to make the final choice.the heads you rferred to are probaly over kill but will work.you have to think about the possibility of you porting the heads later like many people do and if you end up 250cc runners you're getting carried away and will have no slow speed power unless its only for the strip.
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Old 06-03-2005, 04:35 AM
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heads

I would use the iron eagles.

I also think the 220's are a tick big for your set-up. If this engine is going in a heavy car say 3300 plus pounds I would stick with a 200cc head. The 220 cc heads will probably show more peak horse power on a dyno but the 200's will race better (faster) If it's a lighter car then a 210/215 cc runner would be a better choice.

Give use some more details about the engine car and use.......


Keith
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Old 06-03-2005, 04:57 AM
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Iron Eagle Platinum Or World 220 Heads?

My set up consists of the following components so far guys: 3.75 Eagle Forged Crankshaft, 5.7 Eagle Forged H Beam Connecting Rods, A Street Fighter TCI 400 Transmission and A Chevrolet Casting Number 39700010 Four Bolt Main Block that will be machined into a 383. All this is going into a 1957 Chevy Truck that will probably be used 90% on the street so I need to stay within a reasonable compression ratio in order to run on pump gas. I was thinking of taking your advice and staying within the 200-215 range for the heads and going with the Iron Eagle Platinum Series. However, what combustion size should the chamber be 64 or 72. Additionally, what size should my pistons and camshaft be? I was thinking of going with TRW pistons and A Competition cam. I do plan to stay with Cast Iron Heads by the way.
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Old 06-03-2005, 05:34 AM
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heads

Ok what i would do is zero deck the block and get a flat top piston. With a 72 cc head and a 9 cc gasket and a piston volume of 5 cc's this will be a 10.1:1 static compression engine. With iron heads this will work good on a 93 octane fuel with the correct timing and heat range spark plug.

Since it will be 90 % street driving i would strongly recommend the 200 cc heads and no bigger.... They will improve the low speed driveability of your combo.... Sounds like it what your after?????

Look into the probe or mahle pistons,, just a bit more $$$ then the trw's but a much higher quality, plus they are lighter....

Keith
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Old 06-03-2005, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
The iron eagle would be my choice. Very good flowing head, tons of potential. Not a problem running that head on a 383. You will want to cam it with close to if not slightly more that 240 duration and get the lift into the .550 range or better. With an auto that means a stall of 3000 and 3.73 gears. Keep compression at a REAL 9.5, meaning measure everything to insure the heads cc correctly and the piston is zero to the block deck at TDC.
Buy the cheaper version. The platinum series means nothing for performance.


240@.050 and 9.5:1 compression with 220 heads is a great way to make a howling short legged dog trip over it's own belly fat. Couple that with 3.73 gear and a heavy car...even worse.
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Old 06-03-2005, 07:54 AM
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cam

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsongrass1
Buy the cheaper version. The platinum series means nothing for performance.


240@.050 and 9.5:1 compression with 220 heads is a great way to make a howling short legged dog trip over it's own belly fat. Couple that with 3.73 gear and a heavy car...even worse.

Never herd it described like that^^^^^^ but it sure was funny!!!!

If you make it a 10.0:1 static compression i would look for a cam in the 230@.050 range. IMO and i agree with jonsongrass if you put a 240@.050 cam in a 9.5:1 engine in a heavy car it is going to be a pig under 3500 or so,,, and once again it looks like you looking at low speed power/ driveability with you intended usage.....

keith
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Old 06-03-2005, 09:48 AM
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johnsongrass1, Now that was FUNNY (and true).

If you get the combo right you will have a real fun truck to drive. If you get it wrong (over cam and too big on the intake runners), you will have a truck that will be no fun and get blown away by old ladies on mopeds.

K-star gave you a very good baseline. If you work within that baseline you will have a fun truck. Take a look at Wiseco pistons as well. Go with the 72cc heads or you will have trouble getting your compression down to a streetable level.

I also agree a cam in the 230 @ .050 range is where you need to be. Get as much lift as you can (within reason). Keep the LSA in the 110- 112 range and you will have a nice smooth and wide power band (which is more street friendly). You will make more power where you need it. If you tighten up the LSA you will probably make more peak power but, the power band will not be as wide. Of course all of this will depend on how heavy the truck is and what gear ratio you plan to run (either way you will want a 2500- 3000 stall).
Your 383 will only move so much air in the street RPM range (1500-6500).

By choosing a head that's too large you slow down the "air flow" this reduces power/torque in that range. If you were building a 8500 RPM 383 I would say the 220's would be reasonable (with huge compression and a cam to match).

You need as much torque as you can get.

Royce
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Old 06-03-2005, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k-star
Never herd it described like that^^^^^^ but it sure was funny!!!!

If you make it a 10.0:1 static compression i would look for a cam in the 230@.050 range. IMO and i agree with jonsongrass if you put a 240@.050 cam in a 9.5:1 engine in a heavy car it is going to be a pig under 3500 or so,,, and once again it looks like you looking at low speed power/ driveability with you intended usage.....

keith
I have to admit, that shot over the bow did give me a chuckle.

But.....I'll stand my ground. The Platinum series flow better than the standard Iron Eagle, so it's everything about performance. Second, a 215 runner is not too big for a 383. Third, with a TRUE 9.5:1 compression you will make power with duration in the high 230 to 240 range. Fourth, if I were going to build the engine I'd go with the 64cc combustion chamber and a dish in the piston. This does two things, gives you a small flame front in the combustion chamber for detonation resisitance and puts the combustion pressure into the piston. Marginal or no HP gain at this level but better for pump gas reliability. Keep quench and calculate compression at .039 total (typical Fel Pro head gasket thickness.

The engine MAY work at 10:1 ACTUAL compression but it gets dicey at that level.

As a side note, you will NEVER EVER in your wildest dreams port a 215 or 220 dart or World head to 250 CC runners. Not enough meat.
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Old 06-03-2005, 10:05 AM
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64cc heads and a dish piston will work fine and is not a bad way to go. Just be sure you get a "D" dish and not a dog bowl. Wiseco makes a "D" dish piston for this application. I am actually running them in my engine.

Royce
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Old 06-03-2005, 02:08 PM
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Go buy a dyno and start putting motors on. You wil be amazed where short cam 383 motors STOP making power. It is apples and footballs to say that my engine revs to 6500 and think it is still making (read building) power.

You will like the iron eagles and they will make power for you. We have lots of experience with this head, in stock and modified form. You will not make AT LEAST 450 HP without this type of head and a stout camshaft.

If you go to a hyd Roller than I would say step the duration down a bit, get the lift into the .570 range and you will be close as well.

I know for a fact you can run 210-215 runner heads on 383's and you will have more off the line torque than your truck can handle. It will breath on the top as well and make power to 6000. Yes, 6000, that's about it. Your intake will restrict you on the top end. It will rev to 7000, it just won't be makeing anymore power and will be falling off. Geez, 215 is not a big head. 350's spinning 8500 are running 265 to 280 cc runners with raised intakes and 13 degree valve angles.
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Old 06-03-2005, 03:23 PM
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A 220 head will work, and well, but not as well as slightly smaller head. You give up good torque and fuel efficency if it important.

You give a bit too much credit to the Dart Iron eagles in my opinion. As far as 280 head on a 350, these engine are squeezing 15:1 out of 35 cc chambers to make up that torque loss at the bottom of a cam that long.

That I like everyone here, just has an opinion. Just discussing stuff.
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