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Old 06-10-2011, 11:43 PM
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Just blocked my roof and it looks like a dairy cow

I just read Brians basics of large sheet panel repair. I've got my roof in epoxy primer now. I did all the metal work in the winter, put the filler on in the trouble spots, and then last week shot with epoxy.

Tonight I guide coated and blocked. I have little black spots every where, even though the roof didn't look that wavy with the shiny epoxy.

So what I'd like to do now is know the best way to address this. I'd tried bumping some of the spots up with a dolly from the bottom, or if it was a larger area, with my slapper. Since some of these are right in the middle of the roof it's hard to actually get the low spot to want to come out on the large open panel. Is skim filler on these spots (or the entire panel) kosher, or am I setting myself up for trouble?

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Old 06-11-2011, 06:01 AM
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basicly, You put the fillers on top of the epoxy and guide coat it to find the flaws. It sounds like you found them.....I like to sand any low spots in my epoxy before putting any fillers or poly putty on when I finish that then re epoxy....At this point you can use a 2k primer that sands easier and fills better or use more epoxy primer , sand and paint...
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Old 06-11-2011, 09:59 AM
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DBM, it's always great to see your name come up in the replies; you've always been there providing great advice in most of my threads up to this point, so I thank you for that.

My concern was filler getting too heavy on the middle parts of the roof, or the roof flexing and cracking filler, though this is only skim coats. As it sounds like you'd do the same thing it must not be an issue. What you've stated there in terms of everything else was exactly my plan.

This is the first time I've ever sanded this epoxy (I'm an SPI person) and it's really convenient that it doesn't sand as easy as the 2k primer so I don't sand it all off when I'm blocking.
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Old 06-12-2011, 12:07 AM
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use your epoxy as a guide coat and block in one direction //////. Then get a 2.5" tear drop mallet, shave the face so it's nearly flat, and get a shot bag.
Then beat up your low spots from underneith with your bag on top. Bang your lows down with the bag below. For stubborn areas that don't want to budge use a pic to get them moving then go to the mallet and bag, but check the hammer rebound so you know it's not a stretch. Then guide coat it in this direction \\\\\\. Repeat if neede. In the end when it's really good use a shrinking disk to tighten it up. you can also use different tools. Watch this video if you want an explanation on it. At 2:30 into the video I talk about a roof I did, a HUGE roof.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RHLqZHHdEc
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Old 06-12-2011, 09:28 AM
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Something else you can try is cutting the adheasive that connects the skin to the support,this will allow the skin to move a bit easier,I actually cut out a support to work the metal then weld it back in when I'm done...when you said little black spots all over the roof I pictured a few quarter size spots ...can you feel a dent ? I wouldnt worry too much about bondo cracking as long as you use the good stuff....You wouldnt believe some of the stuff I've seen (and done) like hail damage with no metalwork and bondo built up to incredible thicknesses ...Its always best to work the metal but that takes some time to learn and not everyone can do it no matter how much they try.But what youve decribed sounds like it can be easily fixed with some polyester putty like ez sand ,Evercoat makes a few different kinds...the roof wont flex enough to make any difference,If it does you have a more serious problem...
Basicly what I'm trying to say is dont try to master every phase of this type of work because you'll never finish,try all these methods and see what works best for you and if it helps any ,I've been doing automotive metalwork all life and can handle pretty much anything that comes my way but when I see some of these metal shaping masters I want to pack up my tools and sell insurance or something ,They just blow me away.BUT a lot of those same guys can hardly mix bondo or paint anything so no one can master everything and everyone excells at something just do your best and be happy just to get one finished ,You cant expect it to be as perfect as someone that spent a lifetime doing it...but you can get it done and be proud of it...

Dont worry so much......if you cant get the metalwork to perfection you can make up for it with bondo and primer,thats what most bodyshops would do...
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Old 06-12-2011, 01:47 PM
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I'll assume you got my PM regarding your roof, but......

What I've found to work (with my limited experience) on these (Mustang fastback) roofs with no support, is on some of my low areas I bashed them up, pretty much as tech69 did, except without the shot bag, because I found on this roof I had to account for spring back. After this, it obviously didn't look so great, so a shrinking disc seemed to have quite an effect on it.

It's still going to require multiple skim coats of filler, of course, but it looks 1000x better than it did. I think someone was boinkin' on the roof in the early 70's.

I still have those low areas right at the rear that you were complaining about though.
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Old 06-12-2011, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadbodyman
Something else you can try is cutting the adheasive that connects the skin to the support,this will allow the skin to move a bit easier,I actually cut out a support to work the metal then weld it back in when I'm done...when you said little black spots all over the roof I pictured a few quarter size spots ...can you feel a dent ? I wouldnt worry too much about bondo cracking as long as you use the good stuff....You wouldnt believe some of the stuff I've seen (and done) like hail damage with no metalwork and bondo built up to incredible thicknesses ...Its always best to work the metal but that takes some time to learn and not everyone can do it no matter how much they try.But what youve decribed sounds like it can be easily fixed with some polyester putty like ez sand ,Evercoat makes a few different kinds...the roof wont flex enough to make any difference,If it does you have a more serious problem...
Basicly what I'm trying to say is dont try to master every phase of this type of work because you'll never finish,try all these methods and see what works best for you and if it helps any ,I've been doing automotive metalwork all life and can handle pretty much anything that comes my way but when I see some of these metal shaping masters I want to pack up my tools and sell insurance or something ,They just blow me away.BUT a lot of those same guys can hardly mix bondo or paint anything so no one can master everything and everyone excells at something just do your best and be happy just to get one finished ,You cant expect it to be as perfect as someone that spent a lifetime doing it...but you can get it done and be proud of it...

Dont worry so much......if you cant get the metalwork to perfection you can make up for it with bondo and primer,thats what most bodyshops would do...
I've received lots of excellent advice on this forum, but this probably takes the cake because it really speaks to me, a novice who's not great at working metal, and not some seasoned pro.

I took a couple classes at my local tech college on body work. It was enough to teach the basics and fundamentals of dent removal and metal work, or just enough to be dangerous. I'll work a dent or low spot out to minimize the filler that goes on it, but I've learned when to stop instead of trying to perfect it. When that happens I only end up with a worse problem than what I started.

This Mustang roof only has one support going right through the middle so that isn't so much a hamper for me. I'd say 90% of the low spots I cannot feel with my hand. Maybe 2k filler will take care of these and if not then spot fill with putty? There are a few low spots on the edges I can feel with my hand. I'd try to work them out more but problem is I had some filler on the bare metal before epoxy and now I don't know where all the filler is anymore.

I've attached some pics. As you can see there are very many. Some of the big black spots near the back are where I have a large swath of filler to level the roof after working out a bunch of dents.

For fillers I use 3M lightweight filler and Evercoat EZ sand putty.

I know it's not going to be perfect, but I'd like it to be damn good. Given what the roof looked like before, I'm pretty proud of my work even up to now. And I'm in a weird situation where I need to be getting this thing painted in July or August, so the last two months have really been 'go time' for me trying to make my goals and stay on schedule.

Tech--Your videos have been immensely helpful to me thus far and I can appreciate what you're saying. Like I said above I'm afraid (I can say this based on experience) if I try what you suggest I'll only end up making it worse. In many of these spots it doesn't even feel like there's anything to move up. If I had all summer to work this roof I'd probably mess around with some of your described techniques.

As a final note, the car is going to be 97 Dodge Viper blue, which is a brighter metallic blue, but it will have white stripes. I know white is forgiving anyways, but I'm hoping that the contrast of the two white stripes with the blue on the roof is enough to trick your eyes and detract from any flaws I missed. Here's to hoping, anyways.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizer
.This Mustang roof only has one support going right through the middle so that isn't so much a hamper for me..
What support is this that goes through the middle? What year are you working on?

edit: Noticed you have a couple. Maybe they do have a support, but the fastbacks definitely do not.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:42 PM
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it's a 67 coupe.
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Old 06-12-2011, 09:48 PM
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Got a pic of the support? I'm curious. I sure could use one in the paper-roofed fastback.
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Old 06-25-2011, 07:01 PM
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Just wanted to give everyone and update...

I had a 3' bullseye pick I picked up from eastwood some time ago and never really used it much. For me, I just discovered it's priceless when I'm blocking because it gently taps all the quarter sized dark spots out so they sand right off. I rarely end up with a high spot and if I do, a few gentle taps with my slapper puts them back in their place.

ANYWHO, I took to my roof with the bullseye pick and it was just what the doctor ordered. I cut the welds on the single roof brace going across the middle of the roof so I could work the spots over that too, and was probably able to remove 90% of all the dark low spots. For the big low spots the size of my had, I applied a lot more force to restore the crown and the roof is so much better now. It worked great on my fender and quarter panel too.
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