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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by 1971BB427 View Post
I'm just a bit confused as usual. You mentioned in an earlier post that he said your stock valves weren't good ones, and he reccommended replacing them. Then a recent post you listed what was supposed to be done, and replacing the valves was on the list?
So if he was supposed to replace them, and it was on the list to replace, then why did he reccommend replacing them, and not replace them?
Only thing I see concerning in the work that's been done is I always have mine hot tanked and magnafluxed. Doesn't appear either was done, so hopefully there's no cracks that would mean all this is done for nothing.

Re the valves.....that's pretty much what got me starting this thread
If he hasn't done that I wanted to see if everything that has been done is ok

The head hasn't been tanked or magnafluxed

I've stripped it bare tonight, just cleaning it up a little so I can post some better pictures for further comments and opinions

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Last edited by ant_8u; 12-18-2012 at 06:22 PM.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 06:24 PM
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Stripped, and starting to get a little cleaner now

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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 06:28 PM
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I just don't see how someone can give you back a product that looks like that.

Why were the guides not done if they were also on the list?
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:30 PM
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He said the guides were fine and so he didn't want to disturb them
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:40 PM
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Various inlet pictures
(apparently these heads suffer badly from core shift, hence the small lip in some of the throats)

















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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 06:52 PM
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Various exhaust
The irregularities have been removed, but still some roughness and carbon

















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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 07:12 PM
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Chambers and Short radius



Chamber 1







Chamber 2







Chamber 3







Chamber 4







Chamber 5







Chamber 6



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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 07:25 PM
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Short radius's
(ignore the little kink in at the end)




Inlet






Exhaust

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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 07:44 PM
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.. Short turn radius looks good... looks like someone was in the ports with a die grinder touching around, but I don't know why since the ports look fully bored out... unless just removing carbon... was that a crack or just a ridge in the one exhaust port? Spikes of metal sticking up from edges of valve seat area must be removed. Some of the boss around the exhaust valve guide could be removed on each side of the boss, being careful not to get anything so thin the exhaust flow will overheat it...
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Old 12-18-2012, 07:58 PM
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He did the port work with a die grinder
Doesn't look like much was done to the exhaust, but maybe there wasn't much work needed

Is the level of finish up to standard?
It obviously doesn't look pretty in there - but I know that's not what it's about
Is it as good as it can be performance-wise?

I'll ask him about removing the edges round the valve seats
What do you think about the valves?

He said he doesn't rate the ones I already had in the head.....but he didn't change them like he was supposed to

As I don't want mismatched valves I intend to do something with them

Do my current valves look a nice shape, or are they too flat?
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 08:28 PM
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. Flat tops on the valves doesn't hurt anything... maybe clean off the dirty ones...
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2012, 08:39 PM
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Excellent, thank you
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 12-19-2012, 01:27 AM
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The stem side of the valve can effect flow. The new valves are heavier because they're more tuliped than the stock valves. While being heavier, they should flow a little better. Backcutting the valves w/a 30 degree cut next to the seat could show a modest improvement.

I have sure seen better looking hand porting as far as looks go, especially the exhaust side. That said, if the guy is supposed to know these heads, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt until I knew better. Truth is, looking at your ports and chambers doesn't tell me much because I'm not familiar w/the heads and what they're supposed to look like. So for that reason I'm withholding judgement. In the end it's what the engine performs like that will tell the story. Unfortunately there's no real way around this other than using a flow bench to compare before and after- but even then I have seen less-than-stellar flow numbers that run very good, and good numbers that don't perform as expected.

At this stage, swap out the valves if you feel there's something to be gained in performance/€.

If you could, post a photo of a piston. I'm wondering how much of a quench effect they'll give w/your chambers. Even when it looks like there's not that much flat area, tightening the piston to chamber clearance (within safe limits) can induce turbulence that'll help reduce the tendency to detonate. Your heads do look to have useable quench areas, though. This is if you have a selection of head gasket thickness to choose from. If not, you're basically left w/whatever the clearance is.
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:37 AM
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Cool
I think we'll just have to run this one and see what happens

I haven't got the block and pistons handy to take any pictures, but they're the same as the TR6 engine in the link you posted earlier


Restoration of a 1970 Triumph TR6 by Edwin Treffers/Rebuilding the engine/TR6 - engine ready for head


The pistons are flat, and level with the block

I've been told by various people to take 0.010" off the block deck

The head gasket is apparently 0.035" compressed
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old 12-19-2012, 08:50 AM
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I'm not familiar with the insides of a tr6 engine, but if i were you I would do as these fine gentlemen have suggested. if you are worried about the valves, try installing them in the appropriate locations according to the felt marker numbers. (your guy has marked them like this because he has matched each valve to each guide for fitment, also each valve to each seat for fitment and then finished by setting the installed height for each one). then lap each one quickly. then do an installed height check. if they are good, just go with it. don't think too much into it, you're not going racing right? just cruising the back roads on the weekend? i assume that if you were going to do some high rpm stuff then you would have taken your parts to somebody reputable for that application. the parts would have come back with all new stuff and look like they are new. those guys have to warranty their work, to a point, so they don't want to use any marginal stuff, and they want to fully assemble it so they know what the heights are, the spring tension specs etc. since yours didn't come back clean, or even assembled, we have to assume the machinist was giving you what you asked/paid for. sound correct?
if you are still worried,
if you lap the valves, check to see that there is a lapped ring all the way around the valve seating area and also on the head seating area. that way you know they are touching the seats all the way around. the ring should be roughly the same for all the intakes and also the exhausts. the intakes and exhausts will be different widths though.
take a look at the actual valves. check them against engine specs to see if they have enough margin.
then check for stem wear, galling marks or other defects. compare the stem measurement at an unworn spot compared to the worst worn spot. use a micrometer, not a vernier caliper.then compare that against engine specs sheet.
then check the area where the keepers ride to make sure that area is in good shape. you don't want to drop a valve because of a failure there. if there are burrs in that area then you may want to replace the valve and check the keepers closely, or just install new ones.
then check the keepers for wear.
then check the spring retainers for wear.
then check the valve springs for tension at installed height. or have it done. you can get away with shims to bring old springs back to within specs, but if parts are so cheap, why not replace them?
then check the valve guides for wear. make sure they are clean when you do this step. carbon in the guide will give you a false reading. that is why shops hot tank engines before they do any measurements.
then check the installed height against the spec sheet.hastings used to make a tool for this. it is like a piece of tubing threaded into another piece of tubing. it had a little set screw for locking it once set. it could be placed where the spring seat is and then a small straight edge could be used accorss the top of it against the end of the valve stem. you simply unscrew the tubing to expand or collapse the tubing untill it is the same height as the valve stem. then lock it and remove it and measure the length of the tube. that is the installed height of that valve. all the valves should be the same, intakes may be different than exhausts but all intakes should be the same as well as all exhausts. your guy probably already did this, or you could check with him at least.
then check the rockers and shafts or rockers and balls/pivots or whatever configuration you have there. check the rocker area where they contact the valve stem tips. make sure there isn't a divet there. check the pivot areas on the rockers for wear. check the end where the pushrod contacts for wear. check the pushrods for wear and straightness (roll them accross a clean sheet of glass or a "for sure" straight piece of steel). if the pushrods are hollow and are an oil gallery for the rockers, then make sure they are clean and clear inside. check the shafts, if applicable, for wear and proper oiling. if they are hollow make sure they are clean inside.
check the lifters for wear and/or pitting/cracking on the contact surfaces.
check the cam for wear and pitting/cracking on the contact surfaces
I could go on, but it should all be outlined in the engine manual. this is starting to look like a small novel, so I will stop now.
have fun.
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