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bullheimer 09-08-2004 03:18 PM

just passed the 1000 dead mark
another 'nam i think. why? cause a) we're not at war, terrorists or not and b) by now, nobody there wants to be there. almost everyone is nat'l guard or reserves and joined on the "one weekend a month" promise, now they've been there over a year. this is called the "back-door draft" bout c) cant tell friend from foe. yeah, i was glad we went there to kill Saddam (oops) cause we blew it in the first one (i served thru '92). but now it's like we are there for no reason other than to atone for blowing them up in the first place. no WMD, no terrorist "hotbed", nothing was there. anyway. lots of our guys getting waxed and i'm starting to wonder why we are there. as in, what good is it doing? over 100 have died in afghanistan as well. still no osama. i know a guy who says Bush already caught him and is waiting for the day before the election to "catch" him. interesting idea. this has been debated over and over and just turns into a *****fight so i dont want to debate the rightness or the wrongness of it, just saying 1000 american lives are worth more than the whole f'ing country of iraq. they're worth more than the whole middle east. most of us want to turn iraq into glass, i say add isreal, syria, saudi arabia, iran, etc etc and then we'll be making some progress. since we can't we should just turn our backs on all of them, make our cars run on corn and/or water and FK 'em. let them drink their oil. we've had since 1973 to wean ourselves of gasoline and the only thing detroit has done is build more and more 12mpg suv's. this is BulSht! have you seen Bush's nat'l guard record? who in hell ever voted for that peckerhead four years ago? how could he have ever been a candidate with a record like that? and Kerry's senate voting record? they both need to be shot. where do they find these guys and why do stupid f'ers vote for them? why arn't their records put onto the front pages of the amerikan (monopoly owned) papers? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

coldknock 09-08-2004 03:31 PM

Thanks Bull, I needed that release.


Huckster 09-08-2004 03:53 PM

Hope you're on blood pressure medication otherwise your head's gonna explode...even after venting like that.

Definitely sounds like your fed up with all the BS Bull. Being a neighbor from the north I can appreciate your frustration to a limited degree.

We sit waiting to see what is going to happen this election in your country. Whether we want to admit it or not as Canadians; the leadership, policies and direction of your country drastically influences what goes on here. We have a great deal of people here that don't support what is, has, and will continue in the middle east. In addition there are great concerns over who is going to be the President after the election...most are hoping for the "lesser of two evils". Determining this is however not the easiest thing to do.

Bush has clearly shown his faults not only to the American people but also to the world, and Kerry has demonstrated with his own record that he has his priorities in need of straightening (ergo his senate voting record).

You the American voting public get to determine who's going to park their ***** in the oval office...I wish all of you the best of luck during this time of decision and pray that God watches over your country.

bullheimer 09-08-2004 04:10 PM

SORRY, i almost gave myself an anurism. i did say most didnt want to be there, i think i'm wrong. most want to be there, 3/4TH's of the dead were active military, not reservists, and can see they are helping. we cant just turn our back after we sent 1000 men and women to die, i guess. even tho we did in nam and that was a good thing, just 10 years too late.
i would have to be there to see how the people felt towards us to really know. most of the quotes from our troops i've seen were really positive. i just want to kill somebody and you can't frikken find them. they don't fight like men they are a bunch of pu$$ys. it all boils down to not being able to do anything. i can't help them over there and sure as hell don't feel like i can help them in the voting booths here either. our govt. is corrupt, their govt is corrupt. hindsight's 2020 doesnt help nothin either. maybe calling them pu$$ies is the wrong word. i cant think of anything braver than giving you life for your country. they are just so gdamned CRAZY! doing it for religion and running into a mosque we can't bomb doesnt make any sense to me. nobody here gives a crap about what religion somebody is, let alone dieing for it. and you can't even hate all moslems cause killing is against their religion as well. it all boils down to sane people vs. LUNATICS

cboy 09-08-2004 04:46 PM


I may not agree with 100% of what you are saying but I'm with you on one thing for sure. We will not have an opportunity to vote for the sound and practical alternatives you point out in relation to the middle east and the oil crisis. The federal government needs to provide adequate funding for viable alternative fuels pronto and we need to exit the middle east (including our support for Israel) even quicker. Unfortunately there is no candidate with a plan to do either on the scale that is required.


trees 09-08-2004 06:07 PM

Bull, as a Vet, with a couple of tours in "Nam" and many years in the Reserve, I can't agree with some that you have said. First, I have correspondence from many people that have been there, on leave from there , and volunteering to return. They paint a much different picture than you and the every day liberal press that sees nothing but bad and report nothing of the good. As for as the Reserve/Guard, they did sign on knowing that they must drill one week end per month and two weeks active duty, but they also knew that they were subject to a recall at any time. Our tax payers dollars have been invested and now that investment is paying off. Also, the numbers of Guard/Reserve in the two countries are below 50%. In fact the percentage there is about the same percentage as the Active/ Reserve Forces structure in peace time. One of the reasons there are so many Reserve Forces at this time is because the Active Force reduced their numbers of security, engineering, and medical troops and put them into the Reserve Forces when William Jefferson Clinton dismantled our Active Force in the 90s. Now is the time they have need these skills the most. Also, many of the Air Force flying units are made up of Reserve Forces and even some of the equipment needed is only found there as per the above mentioned cuts.
Many of my friends and colleagues have been supporting the no fly zones since Desert Storm, the first War with Saddam, as well as Bosnia. As a whole their morale and unit strength remains high and proud.

I am personally impressed with how few troops have lost their lives. In fact, any intelligent thinking person should know that the masses of Iraqi people are glade we are there, or the 60,000 to 1 ratio would wipe our troops out in a heart beat!!!! But our talking and writing media can't "see the forest for the trees" because they only want to believe what they want to sell to the uninformed public.

Ben Laden may well be dead, but even if alive, he has been rendered useless as far as we here at home are concerned. The terrorist activity in Russia needs to be watched closely. Russia is right now reconsidering their stand on our going into Iraq. France and Spain will follow soon and I predict Germany will also within a year. You see, the terrorist wins when any one gives in, but for us, that stopped when our President put the safety of Americans above his own career in the White House. It is refreshing to me to see that because we have had so many "Party First, Me Second, and America some where well down the totem pole in Washington for so long.I can only say "Lord help us if John Kerry gets elected!!!

Speaking of oil, I read just this morning about the Billions of barrels of oil our Northern Neighbors are sitting on because of the difficulties of getting it out. Well, that little old company called Hailburton Tool Co has or can build the equipment to do the job when the Canadian government decides to go after it. It's obvious that most of the American public does not know that Haliburton is not in the oil business. They just develop, build and distribute the equipment and tools for the oil companies to go after it.

CrashFarmer2 09-08-2004 07:12 PM

Well put Trees, I agree.

68Velle 09-08-2004 11:02 PM

what is the kill ratio between iraquis and americans, does anyone know?

Just think how bad the mid east would be kissing our ***** if we just up and pulled out, 'no thanks, we dont' need any more oil, talk to you later'. 09-08-2004 11:29 PM

Dutchman 09-08-2004 11:58 PM


Wow, that was a tough one. I've been in the Navy a while and don't see many people on my ship having any problems with going to the scene (I'm out to sea somewhere). The morale is high and ready. I have seen my 'Commander in Chief' change many times and have seen the effect in the services. Its nice to have a good one right now.

What other President has ever handled an attack on the United Sates? I would have liked to see what the States would be like without 9/11. Then we could look back at the campain promises. The world changed and a different direction took place for all of us. I know, I see a different world than others. I still see troops in Japan, Bosnia, Korea, Germany, Italy and so many other places. How many years ago did we secure a place for those folks and now we are doing it for Iraq.

As for jobs, global economics has been outsourcing jobs for more than a decade. This didn't happen just in the last couple of years.

I agree with Trees, there is so much more the news is not saying. Good news is not worth any $.

Did you know that electric availibility in Iraq is 12 times that of pre-war?
There are so many good things happening over there and the general American public dosen't know about it.


crazy larry 09-08-2004 11:59 PM

how easy we forget.

dinger 09-09-2004 12:27 AM

Some good points by Trees. We made the decision to go over there, we can't leave the job half done or all is for naught. Restructuring is a must, we just can't pack up and say the job is done. I think the majority of this country was in support of this war at the start, now, impatiently, we want things done overnight. Regardless of where this action was to take place, telling the enemy from the innocent is not going to be easy. Willy's pics tell the reasons for me, how soon we forget. Dan

Gr8 '48 bow tie 09-09-2004 01:12 AM

Trees, I could not have said it any more clearly than you. Most of the talk is from brainwashed people that do not understand the ramifications they are causing by the way they talk. WE WERE ATTACKED ON OUR GOOD OLD USA SOIL AND LOST THOUSANDS OF LIVES. Are we to just turn our backs and not retaliate? NO!!! We have a President now that has a will to TAKE THE WAR TO THE TERRORIST and we should be grateful for his stand. I am a retired disabled Vet and it just chaps my butt to hear supposedly intelligent people say we have no right to be there. We have OVER THREE THOUSAND REASONS to be there. If we would have gone to war during the last administration to retaliate for the Embassy that was bombed, The WTC that was bombed in '93, The USS COLE that was bombed, I believe with all my heart that the WTC would still be standing. It is just like a bully on a school campus when he finds a student that is weaker than he or one that will not stand up to him, he will be on the attack constantly until the weaker is totally subserviant to him or someone steps up to aide him in the clash.

Willys36, Thanks for the pictures, for therein is the three thousand plus reasons for being in the Middle East. Now let us take it a little farther, the three thousand is only the dead, what about the ones that survived but suffered injury. What about the families of the dead and injured. If you still think we should not be there, perhaps you rather they be here killing our wives and children or raping our women and destroying our way of life.


k-star 09-09-2004 06:19 AM


Thanks for the reminder.. It actually brought a tear to my eye....

I said it before even if they didn't find any WMD's that picture is enough for me.....


killerformula 09-09-2004 07:52 AM

over 7,000 wounded. Why do we keep insisting Iraq and 9-11 were related? There's still not a shred of evidence to that end...


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