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Old 10-19-2013, 09:54 AM
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leaving bare metal while still sanding filler

Hello Folks,

I am slowing working through a restoration on a 1968 MGBGT. I stripped the paint to bare metal and sprayed it with PPG epoxy primer. I now am slowly working my way through the body filler process. Cool weather is hitting Michigan and I am most likely done with painting for the year.

My question is this: I have sanded through the primer in several areas while working on the filler. What is the best way to cover this metal until I'm ready to paint in the Spring? Should I just hit the bare metal with some rattlecan enamel and plan on sanding it off when it comes time for the sealer and topcoats?

Mark Bates

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Old 10-19-2013, 10:08 AM
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NO...rattle can enamel is not the answer...if you have some DP Epoxy left, mix up a small amount, let it sit for the 30 minute induction time and apply it to the areas that you have burnt through to bare metal. It's also a real good idea to apply Epoxy over any areas that have had filler applied.

If you are out of DP Epoxy Primer, consider SPI's Epoxy, it's less than 1/2 the price, applies easier and has excellent sanding characteristics compared to PPG's DP Epoxy....I used to be a PPG Rep and had used the DP line of Epoxies for over 20 years...I now use only SPI's Epoxy...shipping is free as well.,,,just make sure that the ambient air and metal temperature is around 70 degrees.
Here is the web site for more information.

Home

Excellent product, properly priced, great service.

Hope this helps.

Ray
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Old 10-19-2013, 12:19 PM
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Mark, where in Michigan do you live?

You're running out of time to get epoxy on those bare spots as it's going to start getting cold. Back when I was in the phase of work, I sometimes put some rustoleum on the bare spots and sanded off when I was ready to respray, but if it was too cold to spray I've also just let the bare spot sit through the winter until I could get back to it in the spring. If it had any flash rust, which was usually minimal, I'd just sand it down with 220, and then sand away a bit of the filler at the edge to make sure there was no creep.

By the way, on those bare spots you can just brush the epoxy on. I've also done that too.
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Old 10-19-2013, 12:24 PM
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True Josh...I'm as or more concerned about raw filler left exposed over the Winter...condensation, frost, condensation again...filler is a sponge and if there is moisture it will suck it up...Rustoleum won't seal filler...even wait for a fairly warm day and as you mentioned...brush some Epoxy on...just to seal it...in spring, knock of the Epoxy and you've got dry filler underneath.

Ray
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Old 10-19-2013, 12:34 PM
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No, I wouldn't want to try to seal filler with rustoleum. I only used it on small bare metal spots.

Speaking of, one of the dumbest things I ever did was use red oxide primer as a guide coat on a panel. Do you know how many times I sanded off that top primer layer thinking it was rusting through! Rogue red oxide primer spots will really age you.
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Old 10-19-2013, 12:43 PM
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For guide coat...Lacquer primer is fine...LOL...but...looks like fake patina got you Josh...LOL

Ray
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Old 10-19-2013, 01:44 PM
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Thanks to all for your thoughts. I'm here in Grand Rapids, MI and the temp will probably not pass 55F until next April. The garage is unheated but it is at least dry. I like the idea of brushing on the primer as I had to take down my spray booth for the winter.

Mark
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Old 10-19-2013, 01:49 PM
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Excellent...I live near Kalamazoo as you can probably see, so you're not too far from me. I have a few coworkers who live in GR.
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Old 10-19-2013, 05:12 PM
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That's a good tip for brushing on epoxy primer.
Pick up a pack of small disposable brushes and
toss them after use. A small trim roller works well
for this too, if the areas are larger. Use a fine nap
roller.

After block sanding the primer, it comes out as smooth
as if it had been sprayed.
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Old 10-19-2013, 05:25 PM
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Brushing or rolling on primer is fine for a temporary seal or to just cover up something to prevent a problem before you get back to it....but, if a product isn't designed to be be rolled or brushed and it is rolled or brushed, it's best to totally remove it before apply any more top coat or primer. The reason being that if a product is rolled or brushed the consistency of mil thickness can't be determined...some areas will have significantly more primer than others which in turn would be the same as not allowing proper flash times...and...trapping solvents. If a brushed or rolled non catalyzed primer is merely sanded smooth and then more primer applied, sinking, swelling and whatever sand scratches are underneath it can come back...even 6 months to a year down the road.

So, just a word of caution, to be sure this doesn't occur, remove the rolled or brushed primer (preferably by block sanding) and then properly apply more primer with a paint gun. Some company's have designed primers that can be rolled on (PPG had a product like this...but I think it's been discontinued), if the product that is being used in this case is not recommended to be applied this way, take it all off before applying more.

Ray
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Old 10-19-2013, 05:35 PM
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SPI's epoxy will not do any of what you have described, and it is ok to brush on for touch up, which is why I recommended it. Barry does it all the time. It will not come out with a smooth finish of course, and then when you try to sand it smooth two things happen--you either sand back through (happens to me more often than not) or you've sanded away too much of the mil thickness so it's protective properties have been compromised. But if I've brushed it on, I usually have the intention of spraying over it eventually so I don't care if when I sand it smooth any of the above happens.
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Old 10-19-2013, 05:42 PM
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Over top of filler? Metal is totally different...it's a more solid substrate than filler. I'm talking about brushing or rolling over top of filler...and large areas like the OP is talking about...not burn through's the size of a dime.

Ray
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Old 10-19-2013, 05:48 PM
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What the OP is talking about is sanding through primer to bare metal. That's what I was referring to as well.
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:05 PM
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Maybe I'm wrong Josh, but when somebody says:

"My question is this: I have sanded through the primer in several areas while working on the filler. What is the best way to cover this metal until I'm ready to paint in the Spring? Should I just hit the bare metal with some rattlecan enamel and plan on sanding it off when it comes time for the sealer and topcoats?"

I would assume that there is bare filler as well (I can't see a person leaving all their filler work low and only burning through to metal), we don't know how large the spots are and I would sooner err on the side of caution and tell him to remove what was brushed, rolled or put on with a cue tip instead of making it sound like all is well no matter how big, how small or what your putting it over top of...like filler. We just don't know how big and over what. If I had a bare spot on filler bigger than a dime (even a dime size) I think I'd spray primer....I just know, that's the spot that's going to bite me...metal spot that size, totally different.

If brushing or rolling primer was fine, no matter the size, why spend money on a primer gun, just roll it on....it gets sanded smooth anyway....see what I mean.

Ray
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:10 PM
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I see what you're saying. What I'm guessing is the OP probably didn't see anything wrong with having bare filler but did see something wrong with bare metal, so they only wanted to address the bare metal. You saw something wrong with bare filler as well and are addressing that.

I don't think you want to know how long I had bare filler on my car at times...
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