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Old 10-25-2008, 05:55 AM
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lifter cam rocker problem

I had allot of noise coming from the motor so I re lashed my hydraulic flat cam. turning it over I noticed a rocker not moving much. I took the roller rocker off and noticed it was gouged on both sided tuner ware it sits on the stud. I took all of them off and this was the only one. I looked at the push rod and it was sitting lower than the others but not bent. I am going to turn it over later to see if it goes up and down without the rocker. Do you think my lifter went bad? Do you think I hurt the cam and if I got a new lifter do I need to brake it in like a new cam. Man I don't wont to replace the cam or the lifter for that matter.

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Old 10-25-2008, 09:00 AM
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Sounds to me like your cam went flat. Turn the engine over and measure the movement of the pushrod. It should be the same as the rest. If not, your cam went flat.
If this is the case, you will need to tear the engine down as material from the cam has gone through the oil system and will contaminate your bearings, score the crank and all kinds of bad stuff.
Hope this isn't the case.
GOOD LUCK!
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Old 10-25-2008, 09:33 AM
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it moves

it moves but not much. do you think I hurt the valves or piston?
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Old 10-25-2008, 09:48 AM
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Is it a Flat Tappet Cam or roller?

If it's a flat tappet cam I'll bet the lifter is fish bowled and the lobe is wiped off.
The Motor Oil companys have been taking out the additives that help keep the flat tappet cams alive. There's a TON of failures going on out there.

If you need to replace it use the ZZDP Additive and you'll keep it alive just

like the old oil formulations would have.

Do a google search on oil additives or ZZDP additives/roller lifters zink in oil.

Good luck,
Scott~
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Old 10-25-2008, 12:48 PM
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yep

I just took out the lifter and it looks like a dish and is about 1/4 in shorter. So you think the cam is gone? Crap
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Old 10-25-2008, 01:13 PM
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Sorry to say the cam is gone.

You have also put some metal through your engine. I tear down would be prudent. Sorry to break it to you
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Old 10-25-2008, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomthecomic
I just took out the lifter and it looks like a dish and is about 1/4 in shorter. So you think the cam is gone? Crap
Yep, the cam is toast. The lifter goes first, then takes the cam out.

While there are many sources for ZDDP, here's the additive I use and it works well. It was researched by a PhD chemist on another board....
http://www.sfrcorp.com/product/9
One quart delivered to my front door is US$32.00. Use 1 1/2 ounces for each quart of oil for initial cam break-in and 1 ounce per quart of oil on subsequent oil changes.

If you have aftermarket springs in the heads, change them out for some old, worn-out stockers to break your new cam in, then change them out for your aftermarket units after break-in.

I have contacted all the cam companies and asked if they make reduced ratio stamped (inexpensive) rockers for cam break-in. Nobody does. They make the high-buck rollers in 1.3 ratio, but that's not cost effective for the average guy who bolts together one or two motors a year. If any of you have connections with an offshore manufacturer, I'm pretty sure you could make some money stamping these things out. I know I'd put a set in my toolbox.
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Old 10-25-2008, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by techinspector1
Yep, the cam is toast. The lifter goes first, then takes the cam out.

While there are many sources for ZDDP, here's the additive I use and it works well. It was researched by a PhD chemist on another board....
http://www.sfrcorp.com/product/9
One quart delivered to my front door is US$32.00. Use 1 1/2 ounces for each quart of oil for initial cam break-in and 1 ounce per quart of oil on subsequent oil changes.

If you have aftermarket springs in the heads, change them out for some old, worn-out stockers to break your new cam in, then change them out for your aftermarket units after break-in.

I have contacted all the cam companies and asked if they make reduced ratio stamped (inexpensive) rockers for cam break-in. Nobody does. They make the high-buck rollers in 1.3 ratio, but that's not cost effective for the average guy who bolts together one or two motors a year. If any of you have connections with an offshore manufacturer, I'm pretty sure you could make some money stamping these things out. I know I'd put a set in my toolbox.
Same here, I agree!
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Old 10-26-2008, 09:38 AM
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If your NOT going to replace the camshaft with a roller cam. (Which I'd spend the extra $$ to do at this point) Since your tearing it down anyway.

The Roller cam's don't require any additives.

If you plan on going with a flat tappet cam again... spend the extra money on a good GM lifter. They have a different hardend metal on the bottom of the lifter as like a "Pad" It'll defintaly keep the camshaft alive much longer and won't "Fish Bowl" like the aftermarket's do.
Our Buick 3.8L's are very bad at doing this so we've found the GM lifters to be a effective way to take care of the problem..and they are quieter.

Sorry about your luck...
~Scott
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