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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bygddy View Post
I keep forgetting the "500hp AFR Exclusivity" clause in engine building.....I'm an idiot and will call them today......thanks
Dave
noits not that, a brodix or other higher end head could get you there too, its just all about flow.
we've built 383s with the listed heads, pump gas, and hit that magic number on a real dyno, not a simulator. there is nothing wrong with dart heads, we sell and like them too, but they just won't get the job done in this case. if its about posing, fine, throw a thumper cam in there too and have fun. if its a 500hp goal, the combo osnt quite there yet.

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Plaintoast View Post
noits not that, a brodix or other higher end head could get you there too, its just all about flow.
we've built 383s with the listed heads, pump gas, and hit that magic number on a real dyno, not a simulator. there is nothing wrong with dart heads, we sell and like them too, but they just won't get the job done in this case. if its about posing, fine, throw a thumper cam in there too and have fun. if its a 500hp goal, the combo osnt quite there yet.
Then dart heads were going to get some work done, but I was quoted 1140 for the Brodix IK200's today so that's likely where I will go......no, not about posing at all....I get that 12's on a 18.5 tire is a little poserish lol.....but there's only so much I can do....
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 View Post
That price is from your Canadian source? Thats not bad.
Yah, assuming he is legit. Will find out in a few weeks...
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 View Post
I have a recommendation for you that people often overlook on assembled heads.
When you get them take them apart and clean them. blow out all passages with compressed air. Scrub them, in hot soapy water especially the valve guides.
When you reassemble, oil the now clean valve stems/guides generously with motor oil.

This is for all new aftermarket cylinder heads.
That's fairly straightfowrd advice and I will for sure...thnks
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 04:07 PM
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Before I order rockers is there enough, or any gain to warrant a 1.6 over a 1.5 rocker?
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 View Post
With the brodix heads ya go for it.
I use and like the Summit house brand (Scorpion)
eg sum-G6905 /6 (3/8" rocker stud)

Howards are the same as far as I can tell..

Welcome to Scorpion Performance

They make a lot of stuff, for a lot of companies.

If you want the ones that say Scorpion or Howards on them they are just a few bucks more.
I like the purple Howards ones.

I like these roller rockers cause the run quiet and last and last and last.

be sure you order the right chamber volume and spring package on your heads.

If using a 64cc head on a 383 use a -12cc dished 383 piston
(based on a 0 deck height and .041" gasket.)

many people get this wrong when building a 383.
Pistons are 5cc, deck height will be. 010 in, with a felpro 1003....I have a unmolested 010 block if it turns out mine has been machined previously....with proper tune and 94 I hope to be OK....if you run the math that tech laid out previously it should be 10.7 static and 8.82 dcr and I trust his math. I never looked further into the eagle stroker kit so I'm not sure if a piston option is avail or not. I assumed it was a standard budget kit and having piston choice wasn't avail. Quench is a little large at 0.051 but with efficient heads, and 94 and the right timing and tune I suspect it will be fine. And hopefully turn my stupid expensive overly large tires into stupid expensive little tiny chunks of rubber at will!
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 View Post
If you want it to get up and haul the mail when you rug it, put some friggin gear in that tank.
(just messing with ya)

read this.... when you get done, read it again.
Daytona Sensors LLC - Tech FAQ Engine Tuning
I call BS. While the article covers static compression ratio and fuel octane, spark timing and air-fuel ratio, it does nothing to address dynamic compression ratio. If you were to go solely on the information presented, it would seem not to matter the closing point of the intake valve, so that a cam that closed the intake at 20 degrees ABDC would return the same results as a cam that closed the intake valve at 60 degrees ABDC. Again, I call double BS.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 View Post
You are going on faith based on unsound advise and inaccurate data.

If you are using a 64cc head build it with a dished piston.
If you want a flat top 383 piston use a 70cc head on it.

You do not want to run it right on the edge. Don;t get all nuts on the cr.
An it don't matter what cam you stuff in it.

The trouble is you are only shopping price on the 383 kits.
The flat top piston kit is cheaper for a reason.
Its a bad choice for a 383 with 64cc heads on pump gas.

if you want a 64cc head get the kit with the -12cc dished pistons

tech math and advice is always wrong.

There is no benefit to trying to ride the edge of the compression limit.
Do not get all nuts on compression or try to max it out.
10.5:1 is MORE THAN ENOUGH.
Not to start an interweb pssing contest but that article essentially backs up tech, math is math, and assuming the numbers given are accurate, it shows 10.7 static....the article repeatedly states ABOUT 10.5 as the practical limit, and on 93 as opposed to the readily avail 94 around here. And agreed that it comes down to dcr which at 8.82 isn't extremely aggressive with a good tune and 94. It doesnt seem to take into consideration alum vs iron heads either which seems significant. I would agree at 11+ comp that its diminishing returns.....high risk, little to gain, but at ABOUT 10.7 it doesn't sound like a ragged edge deal.....keep the timing right, run good readily avail fuel, keep it cool, and don't be retarted with it in 35 weather.....or 90+ I should say for you American lads......
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 10:55 PM
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My engine is 10.75:1 and I use the same kind of gas you buy.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by vinniekq2 View Post
My engine is 10.75:1 and I use the same kind of gas you buy.
Which I assume given the nature of your bullet your dcr and tune is what makes that possible. Which is exactly what tech was saying.....agreed....
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 11:19 PM
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Im not getting into the arguments,Im stating that I have high compression,I use aluminum heads,I only use a 3.5 gear with a stout solid roller,a 950 holley,6k rev limiter chip,single plane intake,and a lot of things that a lot of people say wont work,,,and the car works! It goes like hell,Im scared of it!
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by vinniekq2 View Post
Im not getting into the arguments,Im stating that I have high compression,I use aluminum heads,I only use a 3.5 gear with a stout solid roller,a 950 holley,6k rev limiter chip,single plane intake,and a lot of things that a lot of people say wont work,,,and the car works! It goes like hell,Im scared of it!
Lmao.....its nice when you do what everyone says shouldn't work...and it does....and well! You think your scared of the vette....I'm terrified of actually hitting close to 500hp and trying to use it with the barn door that is my van.....with 165's up front and 18.5's rear with leaf springs.....should be very entertaining.....I suspect I'm going to miss the big stupid slideways fun of my vette.....
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2012, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by techinspector1 View Post
I call BS. While the article covers static compression ratio and fuel octane, spark timing and air-fuel ratio, it does nothing to address dynamic compression ratio. If you were to go solely on the information presented, it would seem not to matter the closing point of the intake valve, so that a cam that closed the intake at 20 degrees ABDC would return the same results as a cam that closed the intake valve at 60 degrees ABDC. Again, I call double BS.
X2
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2012, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 View Post
Does that car really weight that much?

My 70 1/2 Firebird was a piggy.

3860 w 454BBC and driver

3680 w SBC and driver.
Previous owner had it on a scale and says #3647, now that was with a huge stereo, 2 15" subs and amps and sht, he said it had some crap in the back as well, so figure maybe #100 less cause I don't have any of that, so maybe #3500, but then stick my giant *** in it and were right at #3800 .......what's the math to get 3800 pounds into the 11's? Guess I can Google that lol....
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2012, 09:07 AM
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550 horses would squeak 3800 pounds into the 11s if all things are perfect.I would aim for 580 hp and make sure the driveline is strong.
If you want the cat to be street able and not totally race oriented,I would build a 540-588 will a roller (hydraulic) and use dart 335s as a base to work with. If you want to stay away from rats,then My next choice would be a twin turbo LS-3.
If you dont want efi,then use your gen 1 with a blow through.Turbos have a very "cool factor" to them.If you use a blower,then make sure its fast or people laugh at you.

example here,350 rat rod/dual AFBs on a 671 best time ever 12.01. Good thing its a rat rod
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