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Old 02-09-2008, 04:48 PM
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Material for door panels & headliner

I am experimenting with some samples that we have chosen for our door panels and headliner. We don't want vinyl but rather a smooth cloth formed over foam flames. We purchased some samples from a auto upholstery supplier. I am using Wildwood contact cement - quart and rattle can spray. On the plain cloth the contact cement soaks through. We also have some with a 1/4" of foam on the back. Getting lumpy results. The flames show up nice but the flat parts are not smooth. I think the contact cement is soaking into the foam and giving the lumpy results.

Should I ask for cloth with a closed cell foam on the back? Is there such a thing? What type of cloth should I ask for?

Dan thanks for all the help - would not even attempt this if it wasn't for this forum.

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Old 02-09-2008, 05:59 PM
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Glue

I think you are right on with your thinking on the lumps. You may want to try using a spray adhesive. 3M makes some. If you can't find it locally you can get it at Eastwood. Good luck.
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Old 02-09-2008, 09:27 PM
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If the cloth you purchased is actual auto-grade material, it shouldn't soak through if the glue is sprayed correctly. The Weldwood works great even on very thin. It has to be a nice even light web pattern, about an 80% coverage on the material. Also, when doing cloth, do not attempt to lay it until the glue is actually dry to the touch. If it's damp or tacky, then there's the risk of soak through when pushing it down. Let it dry. If it doesn't feel like it's wanting to stick down at that point (remember, both surfaces have to be sprayed with a contact adhesive) use a heat gun and warm the surfaces. This makes it stick like iron.

Probably the same issue with the laminated cloth. If that's factory supplied laminate, it's very strong and wouldn't lift up from the cloth. More than likely you're putting it down with the glue too wet, and as the gas is escaping, it's creating bubbles under the covering.
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Old 02-10-2008, 03:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stitcher_guy
If the cloth you purchased is actual auto-grade material, it shouldn't soak through if the glue is sprayed correctly. The Weldwood works great even on very thin. It has to be a nice even light web pattern, about an 80% coverage on the material. ....
I think you may have hit the nail on the head. I went back over my research were I read that 3 coats of glue were needed. Seems they were talking of placing finish panel over a sub panel - not the fabric on the finish panel. Will experiment some more today using your suggestions.

Thanks for all the help.
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Old 02-10-2008, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heyjude076
I am experimenting with some samples that we have chosen for our door panels and headliner. We don't want vinyl but rather a smooth cloth formed over foam flames. We purchased some samples from a auto upholstery supplier. I am using Wildwood contact cement - quart and rattle can spray. On the plain cloth the contact cement soaks through. We also have some with a 1/4" of foam on the back. Getting lumpy results. The flames show up nice but the flat parts are not smooth. I think the contact cement is soaking into the foam and giving the lumpy results.

Should I ask for cloth with a closed cell foam on the back? Is there such a thing? What type of cloth should I ask for?

Dan thanks for all the help - would not even attempt this if it wasn't for this forum.
I assume you mean DAP Weldwood contact adhesive, not Wildwood. What you may have is something to glue laminates to counter tops. You need to use the automotive spray grade of another product by DAP, DAP Weldwood Landau Top and Trim adhesive. You would need the right spray equipment also, and not try to brush it on from the can for this particular job.

They make cloth with open cell foam on the back,(the soft spongy kind) but I've never heard of cloth with closed cell foam on the back. Anything in between the cloth and the closed cell foam on the door panel will only blur the final result and not give you the crisp lines you are looking for. The thicker the fabric you use, the less sharp the lines will be.

Your problems are probably more to do with the application of the glue than the cloth itself. If you apply too much glue too fast to almost any cloth it will bleed through. What type of foam are you using under the flames? It should be closed cell foam, which is very firm and will hold whatever shape you make. The contact adhesive has to be completely dry before you mate the two surfaces. Do not use 3-M #74 or #77 which come in aerosol cans. These are not contact adhesives and are not rated for high temperature applications and will fail in time, even if it looks perfect right after you finish. If you want to use an aerosol can, try this stuff: http://www.yourautotrim.com/perhittrimad.html it works very well and has an adjustable nozzle that gives you three different application rates: light, medium, and heavy. If you apply the glue to the cloth with the light setting from far enough away from the cloth, it should work fine. Naturally, this is a perfect time to put on three light coats, not one heavy one. Keep trying and you'll get it. Good luck.
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Old 02-10-2008, 11:59 AM
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Thanks Guys. You have diagnosed this correctly. I stand corrected - I am using DAP Weldwood High Temperature/High Strength spray and quart. I am using PVC sheets and closed cell foam for my flames. The material that the wife wants is only available with a open cell foam on the back. I just tried another test panel and this time I sprayed only light coats on the material. The panel - I brushed the contact on.

Everything came out just fine. The edges of the flames are not as crisp as I have seen but the wife actually likes this look. It is her truck so she is happy then I am happy.

Guess more (glue) is not always better.

Dan - Thanks for the link to the glue. Will order some when I do the real thing.

Thanks a lot. Probably will be bothering everyone again as I progress past the panels and the headliner.
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Old 02-10-2008, 12:05 PM
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Show us some pics.
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Old 02-10-2008, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEW INTERIORS
Show us some pics.
Here are some pics of my test panel. This is just a small panel and only a portion of the actual flames as I was more concerned about getting the flat part to lay smooth
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Old 02-10-2008, 04:37 PM
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Look's very good.
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Old 02-16-2008, 05:14 PM
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That does look very nice. Good job, man!

The reason the edges of your flames aren't as sharp as you've seen on other panels is because of the foam backing on your fabric. I've seen that fabric referred to as Headliner Material, because that's what most headliners are made of now. I plan on using it on the headliner and package tray of the wife's Dart. I never thought about using it on door panels.

By the way, I agree with your wife - they do look good like that.
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Old 02-17-2008, 08:33 PM
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Looks nice. Just be careful with the material, as headliner material isn't nearly as strong as other cloths. It's made to cover only and not be touched when up on the ceiling. It snags very easily and traps dirt. But if you're careful, it should be ok.

There are factory seat cloths with laminated foam backings. Dodge uses them in their minivan seating. A pain to work with, but w hen having to redo a seat back to factory, you use what the factory used.
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Old 02-18-2008, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stitcher_guy
Looks nice. Just be careful with the material, as headliner material isn't nearly as strong as other cloths. It's made to cover only and not be touched when up on the ceiling. It snags very easily and traps dirt. But if you're careful, it should be ok.

Thanks for the advise. Always learning something new here. The wife really likes the color, material and match with chosen seat material. Our long range plans are to redo the entire truck in two years so we are using this reuphostlery as a learning experience. Even if the door panels don't hold up that long - they are easy and cheap enough to redo if needed.
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