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Old 05-18-2004, 02:26 PM
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minor port matching AFTER the valve job

IS IT a definite nono to grind on a finished product or can i safely stuff rags/paper towels down the ports to keep all metal filings out so i can do a minor port match job on my cast iron heads. they are all done. i just got them back. 16 new valves, 16 new springs, 16 new guides and seals and 8 new exhaust seats. $400! i would hate to mess them up or put metal into my new pistons/rings. seems if i stuff rags in the ports tight enuf, filings wont be able to make it down there. think greasy rags would be better? sorry i was in too big a hurry to do it before i took them in. that's one of the ways i get so screwed up. well, think about it. there had to be a reason!

Last edited by bullheimer; 05-18-2004 at 02:32 PM.
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Old 05-18-2004, 02:50 PM
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NOPE ...It's not too late. BUT as you have pointed out it would have been alot better to have done this port matching up front. Again, as you have noted, use rags to plug the ports, just don't do one at a time (plugging the ports). Do the whole bank before you start grinding. When you finish turn the head so when you pull the rags out the filings will fall out, NOT IN! ALSO tape off or use a valve cover to protect the valve stem area. You don't need to get metal filings in there either ...ie they just end up it the oil ...ie bearings.
Bigger lesson here is to PLAN out what you are going to do to a new engine BEFORE you start putting bolts & nuts together. One of the more import lesson to learn, but seems to be over looked alot. GOOD LUCK! And have FUN!! ...Mark
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Old 05-18-2004, 04:20 PM
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They recommend doing port work AFTER all the machine work is done, but I like to do the work while the heads are still fresh and greasy. Makes it much easier to clean.

But Sometimes you have to wait for the shop to install new guides or seats, before you can begin bowl work. Just give them a nice soapy bath, or kerosine bath.

All is not lost.
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Old 05-18-2004, 05:31 PM
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87442lover ...I respectfully disagree! Say you had the machine work done and you were doing the bowl work you had mention. What happens if you slip with a grinder and hit the valve seat? Now reverse that scenario, it would be no problem because the vlv. seat have yet to be ground. And if you had the Teflon vlv. seals installed, you could even remove the valves to do any of the bowl work, because removing the valve once the seals were on would scr*w them up.
This is a part of the term everybody likes to use ..."BLUEPRINTING" ...means to plan ALL work out PRIOR to construction to get everything done and in the right order. My $0.02 anyway. ...Mark
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Old 05-18-2004, 05:37 PM
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im not taking sides but i've seen some article (havent i always) where they duct taped over the seat and ground around it for that. thanks for the tip on protecting the rest of it. im on my way to getta stone or a grinding doo-dad
i'm not messing with my chamber so i'm not worried about seats

as for planning ahead. sheeesh! dont get me started, seems like my f'in motto for the entire last year, if i could only go back in time!

Last edited by bullheimer; 05-19-2004 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 05-18-2004, 06:57 PM
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Personally, I'd take a few minutes to number the valves and then get one of those cheepo valve spring compressors at AZ and strip the heads before doing any grinding. Remember, one little sliver can do massive damage to the cyl wall and ring/rings. I port matched mine after they were done, but I removed all the valves before hand, then worked em, and then did a super scrub before putting them back together.

Mark
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Old 05-18-2004, 08:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by 11echo
87442lover ...I respectfully disagree! Say you had the machine work done and you were doing the bowl work you had mention. What happens if you slip with a grinder and hit the valve seat? Now reverse that scenario, it would be no problem because the vlv. seat have yet to be ground. And if you had the Teflon vlv. seals installed, you could even remove the valves to do any of the bowl work, because removing the valve once the seals were on would scr*w them up.
This is a part of the term everybody likes to use ..."BLUEPRINTING" ...means to plan ALL work out PRIOR to construction to get everything done and in the right order. My $0.02 anyway. ...Mark
Just saying what was told to me. The reason isnt because of valve seats, you need to cover those with duct tape or other materials to avoid nicking them.

The reason is when the shop goes to install the valave guides. Say you just have cut down that valve guide with your grinder before you take it to the shop. They have to drill out the old guide and install a new one, now you have to cut the guide down again! Or tear drop it. Thats the reason.

And "Blueprinting" does not mean you plan everything out... it means that you catalog everything that has been done to the engine. Ie clearances, type of material, work that has been done, etc. So the next person that gets the engine knows what exactly has been done.
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Old 05-18-2004, 11:39 PM
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Blueprinting explained a tad better.
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Old 05-19-2004, 08:06 AM
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87442lover ...Hmmm I had an old timer tell me my definition of "blueprinting was wrong too. But his definition was that you take the parts ..ie rods, crank, & etc, and check how it was constructed again the original "blue prints" to make sure everything was right. This was more for racing during his time. Now I'm sure this "blue printing" term has changed over the years, and it may have changed again when I wasn't looking!*G*
But "planing" your work out IS a smart move, what ever you want to call it. ...Mark
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Old 05-19-2004, 08:19 AM
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I find it's best to clean the head and check it for cracks, porosities, and other defects before spending any time porting or doing any other work. As far as shortening and/or teardropping the guides, the gain from doing these things is minimal, and shortening the guide tends to increase guide and seat wear.

tom
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Old 05-19-2004, 11:12 AM
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Tom ...I have to show my ignorance here, what is "teardropping" the guides mean? ...Mark
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Old 05-20-2004, 12:25 AM
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Oh yeah, planning out what your going to do and use is a must. But I have never heard it called "Blueprinting"?! Lol, I think that would be closer in words to drafting or just plain planning.

Tear dropping is the poor mans way of cutting the side of the valve guide down a bit. It is what is sounds, you "teardrop" the edges of all the valve guides. However if you tear drop them before they go to the shop and you cut really close to the guide. The new guides will stick out and you'll have to do it again.
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Old 05-20-2004, 07:10 AM
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Blueprinting an engine means, highly detailing the inside of it ,
all clearances are the same, You make each rod journal have the same end play, rods are polished, inside of block is polished, no burrs to restrict oil flow, oil holes chamfered. Everything balanced and line bored, cam degreed etc. etc. . In other words every thing is perfected.

Very time consuming.

Troy

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Old 05-20-2004, 04:54 PM
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FROM J-MARKS LINK: "Always keep in mind that dirt is the greatest enemy of engine life. Perform your engine build under the most antiseptic conditions possible"

haha, bet they'd just love me grinding on a clean head.
WELL I'M DONE! i have these 8x8 squares of cloth rag that i soaked in oil and stuffed into each port with a phillips screwdriver. about 6 each. then i did my gasket match job. not the greatest by opening the port all the way in, but just beveling the edges all around the port. hell its only a 470 lift cam, bfd, i didnt really even have to do this anyway. then i used a pen magnet to remove all the filings, then pointed the ports downward and sprayed soapy water all inside, wiped it down, pulled out a rag, spray and wiped, pulled out another rag, wiped it out, etc etc till all the rags were gone. i dont think i left a single spec of metal in there. i'm not going to mess with the exhausts, my friend who did the valve job pretty much hogged them out all the way already. i'm pretty confident that i done good. i'll post pics in my journal by tomorrow. i
i did the intake last night. now i have 10,000 little aluminum slivers all over the underside of it stuck to the old oil. jesus, forget the grindings from the heads. these little suckers are everywhere. i just hope i get everyone of them. blah

'll let you know when my motor blows up too and i'm wondering why why! WHY!???

Last edited by bullheimer; 05-21-2004 at 11:06 AM.
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