minor ? - wet sanding vs color sanding - Page 2 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Body - Exterior
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 07-04-2008, 04:26 PM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Several Car Projects
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 32
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
New clear coat repair system from 3M

Quote:
Originally Posted by t66turbocobra
Here is the link to 3m for the interface pad. http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3...beQTM5DLXZ75gl
I have seen that 3M launched a new clear coat sanding system. Sand damp with a Trizact abrasive in place of the dry Finishing Film is used. Then you follow it up with the Trizact Foam disc (3,000 grit) damp. Then buff with a new Perfect-it Rubbing Compound, Then Swirl Mark Remover, and Finally Ultrafina (optional) or a Hand Glaze.


New 3M Clear Coat Repair System

    Advertisement

Last edited by edselman59; 07-04-2008 at 04:30 PM. Reason: added link to 3M website
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 07-04-2008, 10:30 PM
302 Z28's Avatar  
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2003
Location: North Texas
Posts: 10,840
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1
Thanked 86 Times in 73 Posts
[QUOTE=edselman59] Then Swirl Mark Remover, and Finally Ultrafina (optional) or a Hand Glaze.[QUOTE]

Swirl mark remover looks fantastic till you wash the car then you see all the swirl marks that the swirl mark remover filled. Best bet is to skip the swirl mark remover and just use a foam pad with ultrafine compound, and also skip the glaze. And if it's fresh paint, give it a month or so then several coats of a quality wax.

Vince
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 09:21 AM
MARTINSR's Avatar
Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San francisco bay area
Age: 55
Posts: 13,202
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1,338
Thanked 1,168 Times in 1,030 Posts
I have to tell you Dewey, for a "virgin" like yourself, I would hand wet sand the clear it is WAY safer. The ORBITAL sander (Not a "DA") is the way to go to get it done fast, but good old hand sanding is pretty hard to beat.

Now, the brand of paper can make a BIG difference. I use Meguiars paper "Unigrit" (it is made by someone else, the name escapes me now) and is the BEST, hands down, NO comparison. It makes 3M look stupid, lasts MUCH longer and cuts more even, MUCH better than every brand I have ever used and I have used just about everyone you can find out there. It is EXPENSIVE, about twice what 3M costs, but it is well worth it.
Click here for Meguiars

Get yourself a little 3m "squeegee" #05518. This will allow you quickly squeegee off a small area and see where you are at in the sanding process throughout the sanding process so you DON'T sand thru. You are in complete control.

Sand a little, squeegee off the water and see what you have, then sand a little more. It is real user friendly.

I have to say, color sanding and buffing is one of my most favorite steps, because of this total control you have. You can make a finish near flawless, you are in complete control of the finished product.
Have fun!

Brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 10:47 AM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Several Car Projects
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 32
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Swirl marks can be tricky

[QUOTE=302 Z28][QUOTE=edselman59] Then Swirl Mark Remover, and Finally Ultrafina (optional) or a Hand Glaze.
Quote:

Swirl mark remover looks fantastic till you wash the car then you see all the swirl marks that the swirl mark remover filled. Best bet is to skip the swirl mark remover and just use a foam pad with ultrafine compound, and also skip the glaze. And if it's fresh paint, give it a month or so then several coats of a quality wax.

Vince
I would say that if you are getting swirl marks after Swirl Mark Remover then you are getting some filling. Solution: Go a little longer with the Swirl Mark Remover, then Step to the Ultrafina OR get your hands on a 5" Dynabuffer (5" random orbital buffer) and use it with either Swirl Mark Remover or Ultrafina. That is typically what you see in production floors for large area repairs (busses, cars, dark colors on boats, planes). The "throw" on the tool REALLY breaks up the swirl from the straight rotary tool. Like instantly! But be ready to pay a little for an industrial tool like this.

On most manufacturing process that I have run across, the 5" Dynabuffer cuts out at least 1 buffing operation in a sequence, and in a production setting that is huge.

Last edited by edselman59; 07-05-2008 at 10:48 AM. Reason: typo
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 05:27 AM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: MO
Posts: 151
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR
I have to tell you Dewey, for a "virgin" like yourself, I would hand wet sand the clear it is WAY safer. The ORBITAL sander (Not a "DA") is the way to go to get it done fast, but good old hand sanding is pretty hard to beat.

Now, the brand of paper can make a BIG difference. I use Meguiars paper "Unigrit" (it is made by someone else, the name escapes me now) and is the BEST, hands down, NO comparison. It makes 3M look stupid, lasts MUCH longer and cuts more even, MUCH better than every brand I have ever used and I have used just about everyone you can find out there. It is EXPENSIVE, about twice what 3M costs, but it is well worth it.
Click here for Meguiars

Get yourself a little 3m "squeegee" #05518. This will allow you quickly squeegee off a small area and see where you are at in the sanding process throughout the sanding process so you DON'T sand thru. You are in complete control.

Sand a little, squeegee off the water and see what you have, then sand a little more. It is real user friendly.

I have to say, color sanding and buffing is one of my most favorite steps, because of this total control you have. You can make a finish near flawless, you are in complete control of the finished product.
Have fun!

Brian
Could it be Nikkens (Japanese) who makes the Unigrit?

I wonder if it's the same product Eagle Abrasives is selling?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 07:55 AM
shine's Avatar
SPI Thug
 

Last journal entry: some progress
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: bluff dale texas
Posts: 2,727
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 207 Times in 166 Posts
cboy , the most important thing for you is blue painters tape. it will save your butt . dont sand anything you cant buff and tape off all your edges and peaks until your last buff.
and i wet sand everything. when i'm done it is clean and rinsed ready for the next step. plus i hate the dust mess it creates when dry sanding.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 08:49 AM
deadbodyman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Last wiki edit: Stripping paint Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: augusta,ga.
Age: 54
Posts: 6,239
Wiki Edits: 11

Thanks: 28
Thanked 472 Times in 400 Posts
Heres another tip for ya Dew...after your done painting ,leave the paper on untill your done buffing makes cleanup a breeze,and if you have any louvers ,paper them off too..Its not just the compound being slung around ,its the wet sanding residue (clear) that is hard to get off after the water evaporates and it always seeks out the most noticable spots that are the hardest to get at...As your trying different wet sanding pads try a scuff pad folded in half with the half sheet of paper wraped around it,one of my favorite sanding pads for wet sanding

Last edited by deadbodyman; 03-03-2012 at 09:05 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 09:01 AM
MARTINSR's Avatar
Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San francisco bay area
Age: 55
Posts: 13,202
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1,338
Thanked 1,168 Times in 1,030 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by deadbodyman
Heres another tip for ya Dew...after your done painting ,leave the paper on untill your done buffing makes cleanup a breeze,and if you have any louvers ,paper them off too..Its not just the compound being slung around ,its the wet sanding residue (clear) that is hard to get at and it always seeks out the most noticable spots that are the hardest to get at...
Here, Here, that clear sanding residue when dry is on of the hardest stuff you will every try to get off your.

I forgot about leaving the car masked up, I use to do that myself. I haven't seen it in years because the shop I work at doesn't do it, and I forgot all about that. It does save you some clean up that's for sure.

Brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 09:18 AM
MARTINSR's Avatar
Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San francisco bay area
Age: 55
Posts: 13,202
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1,338
Thanked 1,168 Times in 1,030 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by shine
cboy , the most important thing for you is blue painters tape. it will save your butt . dont sand anything you cant buff and tape off all your edges and peaks until your last buff.
and i wet sand everything. when i'm done it is clean and rinsed ready for the next step. plus i hate the dust mess it creates when dry sanding.
You can wet sand with the Orbital sander, our detail guys do at the shop sometimes (I don't know why they would "sometimes" but they do). But I just can't wrap my head around using a sander for this final oh so important step on a special car.

First off, I LOVE wet sanding and buffing a car, to me it's the final step of hands on connection with the down to earth passionate work you have done from the rusty metal. It's an emotional thing to me, to "rub" that finish that you have worked so hard to obtain, you have put so many hours of your life into it, I want to "rub" it to perfection with a piece of sand paper in my hand and work one on one with that finish until it is done. First off you have so much more control, sure you CAN get damn good with the orbital sander when it comes to detail, but the learning curve is damn steep. Plus, like I say, you loose that relationship with the finish that you have spent so much of your life making.

I honestly don't believe you can get the perfection we are after on a show quality job without hand sanding it. Though I have never tried, as I don't do this every day. I just stick with hand sanding if for nothing else, that "personal" connection with the finish.

Brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 09:24 AM
shine's Avatar
SPI Thug
 

Last journal entry: some progress
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: bluff dale texas
Posts: 2,727
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 207 Times in 166 Posts
i tear the car down. i want the tape off as soon as possible. if you are wet sanding there should be no problem with residue anywhere. i use the orbital up to 1500 then hand sand 2000-2500 then go back to the orbital for the 3000 .
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 09:32 AM
MARTINSR's Avatar
Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San francisco bay area
Age: 55
Posts: 13,202
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1,338
Thanked 1,168 Times in 1,030 Posts
I'm sorry, I am missing your point "if you are wet sanding there should be no problem with residue anywhere." Isn't that exactly when you DO have residue, when you are wet sanding? Now, if you have JUST a body doing a complete restoration where the body is painted and then you assemble it, I can see that you could use a lot of water and rinse it off and that sort of thing where you have no residue, is that what you mean? Me personally, I always have some residue to clean up in the jambs and, inner fenders, if the body parts are assembled on the car.

But this is all personal preference for each of us as we all do it a little different. Certainly no right or wrong in masking or unmasking or wet sanding or orbital sanding, just personal preference that's all. If we toss out these ideas of our personal preferences someone doing it for the first time or once in a while can pick up some different ideas on how THEY may want to do it.

Brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 09:36 AM
shine's Avatar
SPI Thug
 

Last journal entry: some progress
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: bluff dale texas
Posts: 2,727
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 207 Times in 166 Posts
i stopped bucket sanding over 20 years ago. i have a 1/4 inch hose with a bug sprayer end on it in my booth. there is no residue or sanding mud to deal with. yes with a bucket you will make a god awful mess of it and need to do a lot of clean up. that is why i stopped using the bucket, that and the scratches you can get from stuff in the bucket.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 09:56 AM
MARTINSR's Avatar
Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San francisco bay area
Age: 55
Posts: 13,202
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1,338
Thanked 1,168 Times in 1,030 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by shine
i stopped bucket sanding over 20 years ago. i have a 1/4 inch hose with a bug sprayer end on it in my booth. there is no residue or sanding mud to deal with. yes with a bucket you will make a god awful mess of it and need to do a lot of clean up. that is why i stopped using the bucket, that and the scratches you can get from stuff in the bucket.
Ahhhh, ok I'm with you. I have never wet sanded that way. I can say that I NEVER get any scratches from something in the bucket because I keep it as lean as I would a drinking glass, literally. I keep the surface of the finish as clean as a drinking glass and I keep the sand paper and squeegee, yep, as clean as a drinking glass. But that takes a bunch of work so the sprayer seems like a great way to go. I may try that next time but like I say I don't do it all the time so between cut and buffs for me I'll probably just stick to the bucket.

Brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 10:04 AM
shine's Avatar
SPI Thug
 

Last journal entry: some progress
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: bluff dale texas
Posts: 2,727
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 207 Times in 166 Posts
i have a clear fuel filter on the hose. you would not believe what comes out of the water line. it's nice , i can use as little or as much water as i want . but i can keep it rinsed so it is ready for the next step. works great for a second round of clear. car is clean and ready. but then i do not do any collision work so there is little masking on my jobs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 03-03-2012, 10:13 AM
MARTINSR's Avatar
Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San francisco bay area
Age: 55
Posts: 13,202
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1,338
Thanked 1,168 Times in 1,030 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by shine
i have a clear fuel filter on the hose. you would not believe what comes out of the water line. it's nice , i can use as little or as much water as i want . but i can keep it rinsed so it is ready for the next step. works great for a second round of clear. car is clean and ready. but then i do not do any collision work so there is little masking on my jobs.

LOL, Shine, a fuel filter on the hose, that is BRILLIANT! LOL, you sound as anal as me. What a great idea! Yeah, I may just give that a try. Of course I am a LONG way from that step on my next project. And like I say, honestly, blocking the primer and cutting the clear and polishing are my two favorite parts of the project, I'm anal like that. I love that fine tuning, it's what makes the difference between a nice car and a super nice car.

Brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Body - Exterior posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Interesting test on sanding base coat paint (against the data sheets recommendation) MARTINSR Body - Exterior 208 03-22-2007 10:52 PM
Sanding is the art pepi Body - Exterior 3 08-02-2006 10:40 PM
Sanding Help rcm800 Body - Exterior 2 04-06-2006 08:35 PM
Color sanding and Buffing questions. Z-Money Pit Body - Exterior 1 05-30-2005 09:41 PM
wet sanding and saving my finger tips.... onebadmerc Body - Exterior 14 12-30-2003 05:41 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.