Mustang II Kit Failure - Page 3 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Suspension - Brakes - Steering
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #31 (permalink)  
Old 06-30-2003, 09:23 PM
willys36@aol.com's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: How to rebuild a Rochester Quadrajet 4MV carbureto...
Last journal entry: How to change auto shift timing on 200R4
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Bakersfield
Posts: 8,393
Wiki Edits: 21

Thanks: 1
Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts
Trees; second thoughts on your broken bolt - was it corroded where it broke? Corrosion does funny (and bad) stuff to fatigue strength of steel. This time when you assemble (grade 8 hopefully) you should pay special attention to keeping the bolts lubed and away from water.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #32 (permalink)  
Old 06-30-2003, 09:30 PM
horvath's Avatar
Acoustic Rock ... for real.
 

Last journal entry: About Fusible Links
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Central New Jersey
Age: 63
Posts: 1,983
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Willys36 : WHY?

And what do you do when you have to put new ones in? Add more pipe, right?

Alan
54 Chevy Pickup
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 06-30-2003, 09:33 PM
WoodsEdge's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Hoot Owl Ridge in S. Mtns. N.C.
Posts: 407
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Talked to the fat man(Brent) at the Charlotte Auto Fair in April of this year. I had read the thread about M11 failures and also had seen a report on another forum about a failure of his dropped spindles. When I asked about failures he became very upset. Told me he had never heard of one of his suspension parts failing. Accused me of starting rumors about his products. I walked away thinking he just lost another customer.
Jack
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #34 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2003, 12:49 PM
Jon's Avatar
Jon Jon is offline
Hotrodders.com Administrator
 
Last wiki edit: Removing stuck fasteners Last photo:
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Colorado
Age: 37
Posts: 3,206
Wiki Edits: 7314

Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts
Just got off the phone with Kevin at Fatman Fabrications. I extended an invitation for someone from Fatman to join us in this conversation. He declined, citing previous negative experiences discussing their products on the net.

Hotrodders Company Reviews on Fatman Fabrications are here.

There was an excellent related discussion on the Hokey *** Message Board a while back. I can't find it on their site. Does anyone have a link to it?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #35 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2003, 02:41 PM
troy-curt's Avatar
Shop Owner And Troll Hunter
 

Last journal entry: Detailing Eng. Compartment
Last photo:
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Prairie Grove Ar.
Age: 76
Posts: 2,646
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
In 97 I got a set of tubebuler a arms from Fatman at cost,in exchange for advertisment on my showcar. It took 3 days to get the alighnment right,so far they work ok and look good.

At the same time I asked him about changing to a rack and pinion set up. even sent him some drawings.He said he had tried a few on early camaros and they had to much bump steer.
That he had been to every engineering school there was on automobile geometery and metel fabrication,and it would not work.

Six months later he was selling the same setup as my drawing.
Now thats a business man!

So I have tried to stay away from his products. Just my opinion.

Troy;
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #36 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2003, 05:58 PM
Deuce's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Choosing a trailer
Last journal entry: Jan 13 2013
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Deuceland USA
Age: 66
Posts: 5,657
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Quote:
Originally posted by WoodsEdge
Talked to the fat man(Brent) at the Charlotte Auto Fair in April of this year. I had read the thread about M11 failures and also had seen a report on another forum about a failure of his dropped spindles. When I asked about failures he became very upset. Told me he had never heard of one of his suspension parts failing. Accused me of starting rumors about his products. I walked away thinking he just lost another customer.
Jack




I have a neighbor who worked for the CHUBBY ONE.......at his place just outside of Charlotte. I KNOW for a fact that he had to replace some 53-54 Chevrolet front sheet metal because of a welded dropped spindle failing. There is a lady on SRS (StreetRodStuff..another forum similar to this one) whose Lincoln also broke a welded dropped spindle. There has been numerous MustangII failures.

The MustangII/Pinto front end is NOT the answer for all cars. They are cheap, 25 year old, light cars with 4 lug wheels. They DO NOT WEIGH what Fatman and Heidts say they do........3000lbs MAX. Ford engineered these front ends for small, short wheelbase, light vechicles and sized the components accordingly.

The MustangII/Pinto is a good swap for vechicles that are 3000lbs or less and have a width of 56" for the front wheels and the 'Kit Manufacturer' did not alter the factory designed geometery.

35-40 Fords
33-34 Fords
others

NO TRUCKS that are going to be driven like a truck..........1500-2000 lbs in the back or towing big loads.



Just my opinion


.
__________________


"I won't be wronged . I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. "






Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #37 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2003, 06:13 PM
willys36@aol.com's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: How to rebuild a Rochester Quadrajet 4MV carbureto...
Last journal entry: How to change auto shift timing on 200R4
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Bakersfield
Posts: 8,393
Wiki Edits: 21

Thanks: 1
Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts
I wasn't aware that his dropped spindles were WELDED!!!!! Forget that nonsense.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #38 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2003, 08:07 PM
Member
 

Last journal entry: JB's 37 Pickup
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Smoky Mountains
Age: 76
Posts: 2,358
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
As soon as I get my new Carrera Coilover, Ill be back on the road again. The other bolt came out after about an hour of tough persuasion. We placed a propane torch under the crossmember for about 30 mins while getting braced for another drilling /reaming job. We cranked the old impact gun up to 150 PSI and I used the 8# hammer to jolt the bolt, while Bud hit the trigger, first foreward then reverse. After a few minutes of this, it finally moved slightly. We stayed after it until we finally got it to turn 360 degrees and finally, it would turn continously. Resorted to a punch and drove it out while the impact was spinning. The hole is reamed and now all new bolts and bushings are in with a liberal coating of Never Seize. The second bolt, which is intact (well maybe a little shorter) is going back to Fatmans for analysis. Even though it is intact, there is a visible radial crack flush with the front side of the crossmember, where you would suspect a shear fracture to ocurr. I am ordering grad 8 bolts that are going to be 2" longer and am going to fabricate a 7/16 plate, drill and tap a hole for the bolt and mount it 2" in front of the foreward edge of the lower control arm flange. This will drastically reduce the no strut rod shear load on the bigger/stronger bolt. This is a spin off from the web site Willys 36 posted. When this is done, I will try to post some Pics, but may be a month or so. Got to revisit my PU first!!!

Again, thanks to all of you for sharing your thoughts and ideals. I feel much more confidant now than I did last Fri AM when I tore into this mess.

Trees
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #39 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2003, 10:01 PM
TurboS10's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Auto Terms and Definitions Used in Modern Engine T... Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Texas
Age: 37
Posts: 3,463
Wiki Edits: 2

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Man, I missed this post along the way. I read through it all, and I think you are on the right track with the grade 8 bolts. Like 4 jaw and others stated, I cant imagine anything else in a shear type load situation on suspension parts.

I am sorry to hear it happened, and ouch on that paint. That is a real *****. If I were you I would be pushing for the big guy to pay for that also. Maybe you said that already, but it not, I would definately push it. I think he would give quiet easily, and it is fair.

Good luck.

Chris
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #40 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2003, 06:14 PM
Member
 

Last journal entry: JB's 37 Pickup
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Smoky Mountains
Age: 76
Posts: 2,358
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Turbo, I'm sure he would, but I do my own painting, have the right mix and will have it completed in about 30 min time. It is on the inside of the curled lip and probably never be noticed except by me!!

Trees
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #41 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2003, 07:13 PM
adtkart@aol.com
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 3,220
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Trees..... I'm too am glad you are getting it straight. I agree that it seems like a good move to the grade 8 bolts and larger size. It really surprised me to find that they are using that small of bolts on something like that. Please post some photos of it when you are done. Always interested in a way to make these things safer.

Also Willy's.... I don't think the good drop spindles are welded. I haven't seen any that were. Atleast the ones that I have seen advertised say they aren't welded.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #42 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2003, 09:07 PM
Deuce's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Choosing a trailer
Last journal entry: Jan 13 2013
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Deuceland USA
Age: 66
Posts: 5,657
Wiki Edits: 6

Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts




The dropped spindles for "unusual" cars...........are welded.......not talking MustangII here......... 56 Lincoln and others.




.
__________________


"I won't be wronged . I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. "






Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #43 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2003, 09:24 PM
32vicky's Avatar
Tomorrow Will Be a Better Day
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 135
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
trees, will you be getting the data back on what happened to the bolt that failed? I'm assuming that it will be going to a metallurgist for a failure analysis. We have been talking a shear failure or possibly over torqueing that would add an element of a tensile failure. I'm just curious if it may have seized first which could have had it acting like a torsional spring. Torsional failure? Did you take any pictures of the bolt failure?

Your situation has a lot of us interested. Please share any info you may get your hands on. A professional lab would prepare a written report on the failure.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #44 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2003, 03:53 PM
bigbird's Avatar
Member
 

Last journal entry: Blasting Cabinet
Last photo:
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Tomah, Wisconsin
Age: 66
Posts: 215
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
under/over torque?

O.K. so I just bought a Fatman's front clip for my 39 chrysler coupe, but I haven't installed it yet.

How much torque should be placed on the arm bolts?

I read earlier in one of the links, "always torque dry bolts" since lubrication changes things. How then can I lube the tubes through which those bolts pass?

Believe me, from what I've read, I'm going to replace ANY and ALL 5's with 8's.

Do you think it's necessary to ream the tubes and go larger right away like Trees doing? or will the 1/2 in be o.k.?

Thanks for the help guys. I'm a real newby here.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #45 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2003, 04:12 PM
willys36@aol.com's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: How to rebuild a Rochester Quadrajet 4MV carbureto...
Last journal entry: How to change auto shift timing on 200R4
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Bakersfield
Posts: 8,393
Wiki Edits: 21

Thanks: 1
Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts
Re: under/over torque?

Quote:
Originally posted by bigbird
O.K. How then can I lube the tubes through which those bolts pass?

Do you think it's necessary to ream the tubes and go larger right away like Trees doing? or will the 1/2 in be o.k.?

Weld a 1/8" pipe collar over a hole drilled in the tube and install a zerk fitting so you can lube at your leisure.

By all means, drill out the tube for larger bolts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Suspension - Brakes - Steering posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:10 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.