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-   -   Mustang II spindle drawing (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/mustang-ii-spindle-drawing-95739.html)

Kraproon 08-13-2006 10:35 PM

Mustang II spindle drawing
 
I am building a mid engined V-8 Beetle here in Thailand and the current chassis design uses an unavailable Cortina or Australian Chev spindle. See
http://www.rorty-design.com/content/beetle.htm

Mustang II would be so much easier and allow readily available aftermarket spidle, brakes and steering components.

Does anyone have a suitable detailed engineering drawing of the Mustang II spindle, or can give me a link to where one can be found so that the A-arms can be redesigned to use this spindle?


Thanks
Robert

jimcar-9 08-14-2006 12:01 AM

I would also want a drawing for the mustang II spindles as I am constructing my own front suspension, and I want to use these mustang II spindles.

So the dimensions would be appreciated

Best regards Jimmy

BillyShope 08-14-2006 06:51 AM

Seems to me you guys are going at this the hard way. I wanted to use a Pinto spindle on an Austin Healey Sprite. I took the Sprite arm and the Pinto arm to the chop saw and then spliced them together with a steel plate. There's a picture at my Photo Album.

johnsongrass1 08-14-2006 09:49 AM

better yet, just ream the spindle hole for the lower ball joint taper.

Kraproon 08-14-2006 09:09 PM

Mustang II spindle drawing
 
1 Attachment(s)
The problem is getting the spindle in the first place. I am in Thailand and there are no Pintos.
My design uses a Cortina MK-III - MK-V or Holden (Australian Chev) spindle both from the 70's which are also impossible to get here. My alternative is to redesign for a Japanese spindle, or use the Mustang II.

Since I need to redesign or import what I need, it might be best to use the Mustang II as the aftermarket is full of not only standard and dropped spindles, but big brakes as well.

Thanks for the suggestion, but I do not like the safety aspects of welding a spindle or splicing spindle to lower A-arm. I have seen welded spindles fail and would prefer to do it differently. YMMV.

Here is a drawing of the chassis FYI. Note mid engine, and double A-arm suspension front and rear. Rear hubs are BMW 525, and now I need the front spindle.

Any help in getting a Mustang Ii spindle drawing would be greatly appreciated.

BillyShope 08-14-2006 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kraproon
Thanks for the suggestion, but I do not like the safety aspects of welding a spindle or splicing spindle to lower A-arm. I have seen welded spindles fail and would prefer to do it differently. YMMV.

You don't weld the spindle. You weld the arm.

Kraproon 08-14-2006 10:31 PM

Billy

I understand that and do not mean to demean your method. It is just that it is an approach that I would not take for several reasons.

In any case I need the spindle itself, so welding to the arm is a moot point.

BillyShope 08-15-2006 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kraproon
Billy

...for several reasons.

Several???

I just objected to the inference that I was posting suggestions with "safety aspects" problems. While most production control arms are stampings, virtually all aftermarket arms are weldments. These weldment arms are safely used by thousands of rodders around the world. That which I suggested is merely the conversion of a couple of stampings into a strong weldment. With a competent welder, the finished article is stronger than the original stamping.

A primary concern...when I post on any subject...is the safety of those involved. I have a son involved in motorsports and I would never suggest anything that I wouldn't consider safe for my own son.

Now, if you had stated that you didn't care for the appearance of a spliced arm, I would certainly understand. But, if you are including safety questions among your "several," I question your conclusions.

johnsongrass1 08-15-2006 07:24 AM

Now you said in the first post you wanted to use the mustang II spindle. You know the Pinto and the mustang II are the same thing right?

Read this:

http://www.randys-racemart.com/pinspinnew.html





They also have chevelle lowers, nova lowers, metric lowers, and the taper reamer. You choice of ball joints as well.

astroracer 08-15-2006 07:50 AM

One of several reasons would be geometry. Splicing two arms together can be done but the issue is what is happening to the geometry. A different spindle will definitely alter the geometry to some degree and I think this is what Robert is more concerned with. That would be my concern also, simply replacing one spindle with another does not optimize the inner control arm points to work with the new spindle upper, lower and tie rod ball stud points and this can throw bump steer, camber gain and roll center out the window.

Robert, I have measured quite a few spindles just for this reason when I am designing a suspension around off the shelf parts. I just finished measuring an aftermarket spindle for a project I am working on and it isn't all that complicated. You do have to have the parts though, so it does commit you to buying (or borrowing) them.
I will post some pics of the spindle jigs I built for this project which lets me set the spindle up at ride height (really not necessary, but handy) to measure all of the requisite points to develope a 3D CAD model of the spindle. I usually do this as a very rough model because the points are what is important and as long as the shape is the correct envelope size I can confirm clearances to other components.
Mark

BillyShope 08-15-2006 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by astroracer
One of several reasons would be geometry.

Yes, that's a given. In the case of the Pinto (aka Mustang) spindle with the Sprite, it appeared that the guys at Ford had the Sprite in mind. Everything fell right into place with the Sprite steering matching up perfectly. As I used a tubular aftermarket upper arm (the shock serves as the stock Sprite upper arm), I was able to place the roll center exactly where I wanted.

I've suggested arm splicing for those cars where dropped spindles are not available and a lower stance is desired. In this case, there could be a significant geometry change, with the roll center usually going lower. This would make the car a bit looser, but that is usually a "plus."

johnsongrass1 08-15-2006 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by astroracer
One of several reasons would be geometry. Splicing two arms together can be done but the issue is what is happening to the geometry. A different spindle will definitely alter the geometry to some degree and I think this is what Robert is more concerned with. That would be my concern also, simply replacing one spindle with another does not optimize the inner control arm points to work with the new spindle upper, lower and tie rod ball stud points and this can throw bump steer, camber gain and roll center out the window.

Robert, I have measured quite a few spindles just for this reason when I am designing a suspension around off the shelf parts. I just finished measuring an aftermarket spindle for a project I am working on and it isn't all that complicated. You do have to have the parts though, so it does commit you to buying (or borrowing) them.
I will post some pics of the spindle jigs I built for this project which lets me set the spindle up at ride height (really not necessary, but handy) to measure all of the requisite points to develope a 3D CAD model of the spindle. I usually do this as a very rough model because the points are what is important and as long as the shape is the correct envelope size I can confirm clearances to other components.
Mark

Changing ball joints to a shorter or taller one make roll center easily adjustable. Changes in ride height help too.

Kraproon 08-15-2006 09:33 PM

My concern is the propery geometry, and I can design for this and component interference given the dimensions. I would have thought that given the popularity of the Mustang II front end that a drawing would be readily available but perhaps not so.

If you could post/mail your jig to take the measurements this would be a big help to all - thanks

Another listee has indicated a desire for a drawing as well, so I am hoping that he could take the measurements and advise the group. If I end up having to import a pair of spindles to get a drawing I will do the same.

Still hoping that someone has a drawing

Robert

rotten4x4 12-13-2009 10:16 AM

spindle drawing
 
see if this will help you

http://www.wilwood.com/Start/PDF/fl193.pdf

DENCOUCH 12-13-2009 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotten4x4

Dude! ... you are da bomb!! :thumbup:


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