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Old 02-27-2013, 10:40 AM
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My good old friend: Rust

Hey guys!

I picked up a 1973 Dart Swinger V8 just on Sunday, and theres one issue. Rust. The previous owner tore off the vinyl top and found a bunch of rust which he wire wheeled and sprayed rust preventer on, yet I can still stick my fingers through the holes. There is also some bondo cracks in the paint on the Quarter panel. First off, since I dont have access to a mig welder, or money to get it done, which type of bondo works the best for a rust spot I have on a panel? I plan to dig out the old Bondo with heat. I am debating between Evercoat Rage, Evercoat Rage Gold, Evercoat Rage Extreme, and Evercoat Quantum 1. Which one will not crack over time and will not break down with new paint? I obviously prefer the regular Rage one since its cheaper..How should I apply the bondo? In layers? Or all at once? Any additives? Do I need glazing putty for this job? What are some tricks to prevent any cracks or discoloration? Links posted below!

P.S.- I will grind off all of the rust prior to bondo work.


QUANTUM 1 Large Repair 1/2 Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive QUANTUM 1 Large Repair 1/2 Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive

Fibreglass Evercoat 105 Rage Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Quart : Amazon.com : Automotive Fibreglass Evercoat 105 Rage Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Quart : Amazon.com : Automotive

Fibreglass Evercoat 112 Rage Gold Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive Fibreglass Evercoat 112 Rage Gold Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive

Fibreglass Evercoat 120 Rage Xtreme High Performance Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive Fibreglass Evercoat 120 Rage Xtreme High Performance Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive

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Old 02-27-2013, 10:49 AM
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If you have holes you can stick your fingers through then it is time for metal replacement. All of those bondo products need solid metal under then to hold up..

Sam
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:42 PM
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If you have holes you can stick your fingers through then it is time for metal replacement. All of those bondo products need solid metal under then to hold up..

Sam
100% right. If you buy any of the products you mentioned to fill rust holes you may as well by a green garbage bag and put your money in there. OneMoreTime is right, filler sticks to metal, not rust. Without metal you would bridge the holes and the rust keeps on growing until the metal that is left is so weak it falls out. Just look at the cracks you mentioned in the quarter panel, gently try grinding the filler away and I'm sure you'll have rust in that area. IT is time to replace metal.

Ray
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by OneMoreTime View Post
If you have holes you can stick your fingers through then it is time for metal replacement. All of those bondo products need solid metal under then to hold up..

Sam
Even if its just a piece of sheet metal pop riveted in place....better than just bondo
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:51 PM
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Even if its just a piece of sheet metal pop riveted in place....better than just bondo
I agree that it's better but just so the OP knows...it's like having an abscess tooth and trying to cure it with penicillin, eventually that tooth needs to have a root canal or it has to come out...The sooner you do the root canal on your roof the more readily you won't need to replace the entire roof.

Ray
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Old 02-27-2013, 02:27 PM
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Thanks guys,

So if I was to place/ rivet metal behind it, which would you recommend? And also, when I apply bondo, do I need a finishing putty? What is the finishing putty for? I believe that's what it's called..... And lastly? How on earth should I get metal behind it if its jot accessible? The piece and area I want to bondo does have a metal backing to it. So I am ok there. Which bondo works the best? And should I apply the bondo in layers? Or all at once.
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Old 02-27-2013, 02:32 PM
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I'm sorry, in all good conscience, I don't want to be the guy that is going to teach anybody how to butcher a car...no offence but...if somebody else wants to...feel free.

Ray
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Old 02-27-2013, 02:44 PM
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I'm sorry, in all good conscience, I don't want to be the guy that is going to teach anybody how to butcher a car...no offence but...if somebody else wants to...feel free.

Ray
I hear you Ray - and agree.

To the original poster: The guys here do their best to do repairs the right way, which in this case would be cutting out the rusted sections and welding in replacement panels, then probably followed with a thin (1/8" max) layer of body filler (bondo). There are lots of threads on here and other sites that show how to go about it the right way (youtube even has some videos). I know you are tempted to just slap gallons of bondo on there, but resist the urge. It won't last and you will just be doing it again. MIG welders are pretty simple to use, especially for this kind of work which ends up being a whole bunch of spot welds, and a small one for sheetmetal is not that expensive. If you are trying to do this the right way, lots of guys on here will be happy to advise along the way.
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:06 PM
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I hear you Ray - and agree.

To the original poster: The guys here do their best to do repairs the right way, which in this case would be cutting out the rusted sections and welding in replacement panels, then probably followed with a thin (1/8" max) layer of body filler (bondo). There are lots of threads on here and other sites that show how to go about it the right way (youtube even has some videos). I know you are tempted to just slap gallons of bondo on there, but resist the urge. It won't last and you will just be doing it again. MIG welders are pretty simple to use, especially for this kind of work which ends up being a whole bunch of spot welds, and a small one for sheetmetal is not that expensive. If you are trying to do this the right way, lots of guys on here will be happy to advise along the way.
Thanks Bob, well put and very eloquently as well. Ray
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:21 PM
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I decided to do the proper welding and metal replacement. I will post pictures of the spots and maybe you guys can help me out with it. In looking forward to it. Now that I think about it, I'm glad I'm doing it right!!
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:24 PM
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I would be more than happy to help you as would many other people on this site...thank you very much...I feel much better...how about you.

My sincere best wishes 79bird.

Ray
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 79bird View Post
Hey guys!

I picked up a 1973 Dart Swinger V8 just on Sunday, and theres one issue. Rust. The previous owner tore off the vinyl top and found a bunch of rust which he wire wheeled and sprayed rust preventer on, yet I can still stick my fingers through the holes. There is also some bondo cracks in the paint on the Quarter panel. First off, since I dont have access to a mig welder, or money to get it done, which type of bondo works the best for a rust spot I have on a panel? I plan to dig out the old Bondo with heat. I am debating between Evercoat Rage, Evercoat Rage Gold, Evercoat Rage Extreme, and Evercoat Quantum 1. Which one will not crack over time and will not break down with new paint? I obviously prefer the regular Rage one since its cheaper..How should I apply the bondo? In layers? Or all at once? Any additives? Do I need glazing putty for this job? What are some tricks to prevent any cracks or discoloration? Links posted below!

P.S.- I will grind off all of the rust prior to bondo work.


QUANTUM 1 Large Repair 1/2 Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive

Fibreglass Evercoat 105 Rage Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Quart : Amazon.com : Automotive

Fibreglass Evercoat 112 Rage Gold Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive

Fibreglass Evercoat 120 Rage Xtreme High Performance Premium Lightweight Body Filler - Gallon : Amazon.com : Automotive
Hey man-

I would add an additional word of caution: it sounds like this car needs a lot of body work. You may want to decide how much you're willing to do. It could be very time consuming and really expensive. At the end of the day a '73 swinger isn't going to be worth a whole lot of money even if you do get it into perfect condition.

I would assess how much this thing needs and decide really early on if you want to spend many thousands of dollars and several years working on a car that is almost certainly not going to be worth what you put into it. Many times for a little bit more money up front you can get a lot more car to work with. The difference between the amount of dollars you have to put into a 2000 dollar car and a 5000 dollar car to get to a finished product is probably 3-4 times that difference in price.

hate to be negative, but been there done that and wouldn't go back!
K
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:24 PM
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Also, what is the proper tool to use to remove a piece to replace? Is it called an angle grinder?
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Old 02-27-2013, 04:06 PM
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An angle grinder can work, so can a fine tooth saw, or shears - whatever allows you to cut cleanly without bending up the good metal. Since you mentioned a lot of the rust is in the roof, you are going to have to take down the headliner. You don't want to set it on fire with sparks and hot metal, and you will need access to the inside anyhow. Remember that as you start replacing sections, your patch doesn't have to be one piece with all the bends and compound curves - you can make them in sections making each section easier to make.
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Old 02-27-2013, 04:25 PM
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Killerformula also has some good advice...do you have a budget that your anticipating on spending? Other factors to consider when doing a car of this vintage would be is it a 2 door or a 4 door? What V* engine is in it? What does it have for an interior, buckets vs bench, column shift vs floor or console shift? What condition is the drive train in?

Rebuilding a car will be an expensive proposition...doing it yourself or not, it will cost a considerable amount of cash.

An angle grinder can work, however they do generate a fair amount of heat, a cut off wheel will work as well and do less damage regarding heat, plus they can make smaller patches than an angle grinder. The best thing to do before you spend any money on tools or filler or metal would be to post the pictures of your Swinger. We can offer more conclusive advice when we can see what we are working with.

Ray
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