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Old 02-06-2014, 06:09 PM
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Are my lifters rotating

Does anyone know if I would be able to witness the rotation of a mechanical flat tappet lifter simply by removing the inlet manifold and spark plugs, setting the lash on the valves, indexing the lifter/s with a sharpie and then turning the engine over at cranking speed?
Or does the spin effect only come into play at higher RPM?

Cam is broken in.. Three lifters were clearly not spinning according to the wear marks on the lifters prior to me assuming that I have fixed the problem by honing the bores slightly.

Thanks


Duke

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Old 02-06-2014, 06:34 PM
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You can see them rotate at cranking speed. What is your lifter bore clearance? 0.0015" is considered to be just right.
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Old 02-06-2014, 06:56 PM
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Not sure if I can measure that accurately with the crude tools that I possess (dial callipers) , I'll give it a go. Just honed the three by hand with an appropriate sized piece of wooden dowel with some 400 then 800grit paper wrapped around, then a length of rag wrapped around and spun it in a drill to finish up. Pretty back yard, I know, but I feel they spin free now like the others. Just want to make sure that all is good before I close the valley up.

I'll set the valve lash and check for rotation before I set the inlet manifold.

Thanks for your help.

Duke
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Old 02-07-2014, 08:08 AM
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IF... the lifters did not rotate on startup [initial break - in] & IF ... the lifters have a pattern already established... then PROBABLY... you've already damaged the ramps on the cam & whether they'll spin again is "IFFY", at best...
dave
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Old 02-07-2014, 08:23 AM
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It's not "iffy". You simply can't. If there's a pattern it'll follow that- I'm sure he's aware he needs a new cam though.
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Old 02-07-2014, 09:32 PM
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Here is a tip. On a fresh build. After lash is set. Mark all pushrods with a black permanent marker. Same place, in a visable spot, on each one. Start engine and run up to operating temp. Check positions of black marks. Rotating lifters will rotate the pushrods..
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Old 02-09-2014, 01:58 AM
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Thanks for your replies..

Yup! ...That's what happened .. I have the all lifters dropping in their respective bores without assistance and now freely spinning in their bores, including the three that were clearly not spinning in operation. Lashed all the rocker gear up and spun the engine over at cranking speed with the inlet manifold still off. All are spinning except those three - still!
They spin a bit but then stop when they get to the point that they were running at for 4000 miles and stay there - won't rotate any further.
I realise I'm up for new cam and lifters, but don't want the same thing to happen again.
Just for giggles, I tried a 'rotating lifter' on a lobe where the lifter 'wasn't spinning' and cranked the engine. The lifter spun a bit then stopped also.
Is it possible that the grinding angle on the camshaft lobe (purposely ground IN to cause the lifter to spin) has now been lost on those three because of the fact they have done so many miles without lifter rotation?
Can I perform this same test (turn engine at cranking speed to check for rotation) for a minimal amount of time , maybe 45 seconds, just enough to get a check on full rotation of the lifters? Or would that be compromising the fresh cam lobe/lifter interface to much for comfort?

Photo of a lifter that wasn't spinning, looks WAY, WAY worse in the pic than in real life.


Duke
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Old 02-09-2014, 02:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thinwhiteduke View Post
Thanks for your replies..

Yup! ...That's what happened .. I have the all lifters dropping in their respective bores without assistance and now freely spinning in their bores, including the three that were clearly not spinning in operation. Lashed all the rocker gear up and spun the engine over at cranking speed with the inlet manifold still off. All are spinning except those three - still!
They spin a bit but then stop when they get to the point that they were running at for 4000 miles and stay there - won't rotate any further.
I realise I'm up for new cam and lifters, but don't want the same thing to happen again.
Just for giggles, I tried a 'rotating lifter' on a lobe where the lifter 'wasn't spinning' and cranked the engine. The lifter spun a bit then stopped also.
Is it possible that the grinding angle on the camshaft lobe (purposely ground IN to cause the lifter to spin) has now been lost on those three because of the fact they have done so many miles without lifter rotation?
Can I perform this same test (turn engine at cranking speed to check for rotation) for a minimal amount of time , maybe 45 seconds, just enough to get a check on full rotation of the lifters? Or would that be compromising the fresh cam lobe/lifter interface to much for comfort?

Photo of a lifter that wasn't spinning, looks WAY, WAY worse in the pic than in real life.


Duke
new cam and lifters.. nothing will fix that.. I'd double check the bore clearance.. to what tech posted.. to loose is just as bad
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Old 02-09-2014, 08:09 AM
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10 or more years ago a couple of my friends wiped out new cams , these were guys who shouldn't have had problems . I did a bunch of calling around & talked to a lot of guys that I respected.. what the consesus was , was this .. Use a bunch of the grey moly break-in lube [ I use Isky] set the valves using comp cams method .. do not set past zero lash to start... use a cam break-in additive in the oil ..... make sure timing is set so engine fires immediatly... if after the first 20 minutes you're
good , you're more than likely good to go... just an aside ..I love my Brodix IK 200's , you can pull lifters & check them w/o removing the intake !!!

dave

Last edited by 2old2fast; 02-09-2014 at 08:10 AM. Reason: forgot to sign
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