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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2013, 10:31 AM
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Narrowed a-arms ?

Simple question....WHY would a guy use narrowed a-arms on a Mustang II equipped street rod ?

Is it only for tire clearance or something else ?

Thanks, guys


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2013, 10:43 AM
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The wider the frame rails are the narrower the arms have to be to keep the track width reasonable. Can't say I'd go there, though...

Russ
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Old 09-13-2013, 10:54 AM
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Personally, I wouldn't do it because it changes the as-designed geometry. I'd be more prone to find an IFS that has the proper track for my application. Same goes for lowering the vehicle. Why do all you fellows wait until you have installed the front clip to start looking for ways to lower the ride height? That's supposed to be figured out ahead of time, before you ever strike an arc to weld the whole mess in. Cutting springs and installing dropped spindles is for those who didn't have enough sense to know how to do it properly in the first place. If you don't know how to do it, for heaven's sake learn how by reading and asking questions.
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Old 09-14-2013, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by techinspector1 View Post
Cutting springs and installing dropped spindles is for those who didn't have enough sense to know how to do it properly in the first place.
You're consistent in condescending folks, I'll give you that.

Unless you are building a kit car, where you pay up front for somebody else to engineer the suspension, you have to figure this all out as you go. That's what Hot Rodding is all about.

Narrowing a-arms, stepping a-arms, using drop spindles, using drop springs, it's all good.
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Old 09-14-2013, 11:10 PM
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I agree with tech... If you plan your build right when clipping or new frame, You can set the ride height or anything else Without having to use any drop stuff.. Or narrow a-arms...Plan it right before even starting the build..
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Old 09-15-2013, 08:58 AM
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Only reason I can see for narrowing A arms (instead of building the suspension right to fit the car) would be if the car used is so narrow that moving the frame rails in would interfere with engine mounting. In very rare cases some small import cars stuffed with American V8 engines can dictate that the frame rails can only go so narrow, so the next thing to do in making the track width fit is to shorten the A arms.
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Old 09-15-2013, 09:40 AM
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Factories put a lot of engineering effort/experience into their suspensions and putting things like pivot points where they do. Like hot rodders, we tend to change things for the sake of some particular desire but you have to ask if what you're doing is improving, making an acceptable compromise, or screwing it all up?

You can narrow a-arms a bit if you have to and your worst trade-offs will be decrease in practical suspension travel and packaging issues such as the things hitting each other.

Re other common mods; drop spindles are generally OK if what you want is to lower ride height on a stock setup or want a crossmember/engine to be lower than what you'd be able to do with stock spindles on a special, somebody did a lot of work to make an aftermarket part that minimized changes to the factory setup while having that lower height. Cutting/changing springs, stepped a-arms etc. all fine IF you also happen to want your roll center changed to where it's going to end up, and actually you probably don't.

Any of these better be strong and right if there was any fabrication involved.

But as the man indicates, beyond the minimal most of these are adjustments we have to make on our way to learning to do it right in the first place.
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Old 09-15-2013, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lakeroadster View Post
You're consistent in condescending folks, I'll give you that.
I'm not in a personality contest. I'm here to answer questions about all things automotive. It is not my intent to be condescending to anyone, but just to tell the truth as best I know it. If a fellow doesn't have the abilities to properly engineer and build a project, then perhaps he/she needs to find another hobby where they can reach a less lofty goal.

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Originally Posted by lakeroadster View Post
Narrowing a-arms, stepping a-arms, using drop spindles, using drop springs, it's all good.
No, actually, it's not all good. It's all fosdick and second class at best. If you think it's all good, you should take a job at your local drag strip doing technical inspection on race cars where it's life and death hanging in the balance. That should open your eyes a little.

Any of you fellows who would like to know the real skinny on suspension and steering should read Carroll Smith's book "Tune To Win". Another good read is Dave Morgan's "Doorslammers".

Last edited by techinspector1; 09-15-2013 at 03:54 PM.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-15-2013, 07:54 PM
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I'm not in a personality contest. I'm here to answer questions about all things automotive.
Civility... it's a lost concept in the digital age.
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Old 09-15-2013, 08:13 PM
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I can see it both ways. We shouldn't be making suggestions about engineering concepts that can be unsafe when there are reasonable alternatives, or at least without understanding why the OP is forced into that decision.

On the other hand, you shouldn't be talking to people online in a way that would get you knocked on your *** in public. You can say what you need to say without being abrasive.

K
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Old 09-15-2013, 08:25 PM
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if you dont understand S.A.I. then dont be changing things.
I will slightly disagree with Tech in that some of those after market suspension pieces are the ticket for someone that can understand the benefits and consequences
reread my first comment
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:29 PM
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It's OK, you guys can disagree with me all you want. All of us see things a little differently and as Popeye said "I yam what I yam".
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:34 PM
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For one, I am not sure why we got so off topic in such a hurry. A question was asked about a pretty specific thing, and it seems like answering a different question, quite condescendingly, wasn't needed. You can tell the truth without being a ****, the whole "I just tell the truth, not trying to win any popularity contests" crap is just an excuse you think will let you get away with being rude for no reason. That isn't needed, and we see right through it.

Also, when people come here to ask questions, responding by telling people that if they don't have intimate knowledge of engineering, they should get out of the hobby is BS that needs to stop. The whole point of the site is for people to share knowledge with experienced and new hotrodders alike. This is a hobby full of risks. There are lots of things a person with limited knowledge could screw up and cause serious damage to their ride, or themselves. I am all for sharing what the risks are (in a polite manner) with people asking about doing something. What I am not OK with is telling someone that doesn't already know the risks to just give up and go buy something off a lot and leave it alone.
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Old 09-16-2013, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Croz View Post
For one, I am not sure why we got so off topic in such a hurry. A question was asked about a pretty specific thing, and it seems like answering a different question, quite condescendingly, wasn't needed. You can tell the truth without being a ****, the whole "I just tell the truth, not trying to win any popularity contests" crap is just an excuse you think will let you get away with being rude for no reason. That isn't needed, and we see right through it.

Also, when people come here to ask questions, responding by telling people that if they don't have intimate knowledge of engineering, they should get out of the hobby is BS that needs to stop. The whole point of the site is for people to share knowledge with experienced and new hotrodders alike. This is a hobby full of risks. There are lots of things a person with limited knowledge could screw up and cause serious damage to their ride, or themselves. I am all for sharing what the risks are (in a polite manner) with people asking about doing something. What I am not OK with is telling someone that doesn't already know the risks to just give up and go buy something off a lot and leave it alone.
I can't agree more! It's just as easy to be helpful in a nice way, than to try and pass off rudeness as "honesty". It is possible to give an honest opinion and not be rude; dozens of people do it here all the time.
The point of having these forums is to try and help users, and do so in a way that encourages them in the hobby. If our answers drive people away from this site, or the hobby, we've only accomplished something negative.
And I don't believe we should accept someone just being Popeye. You are what you are, because you refuse to be civil and polite. It is something we choose to do, not what we have to do.
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Old 09-16-2013, 08:30 AM
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narrowing A arms isnt quite a normal route for most vehicles.
as many of these people said, there is alot of math already done on one said piece of product..FOR ONE TYPE of application.

changing this application for another is the backbone of hotrodding.
we all strive to do the best thing for the lowest dollar.

most of the time our crazy ideas work, and we roll with it.
other times it really screws us.
hence the phrase.." back to the drawing board"

however there are many reasons people choose to change the geometry on suspension parts. ive ran across this alot on adjustable suspension.

the only time ive shortened A arms were on bagged or vehicles with hydraulics.

the caster camber change can be too great of a change when lifting and lowering a vehicle with said equipment.

its all a part of what works and what does not.

noone i know whats to run around like that guy in a lowered civic or VW with the tires all cadiwompus
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