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"NASCAR Talk 2011"

90K views 394 replies 38 participants last post by  dinger 
#1 ·
I don't know how you all felt about todays race, but I didn't like it, except with the winner. I felt like I was watching some kind of automotive roller derby. I wish they would open the restrictions up to where a guy can pass a car, based on how much H.P. he makes, just like the old days. This sucks today. :smash: I watch about 3 NASCAR races a year, I like the long tracks, but I will quit wasting my time.
 
#27 ·
the Daytona 500

Ever since Bill France started NASCAR and racing on the beach.the sport has gone from a bunch of good old boys racing on Sat. night with their moon shine cars to where they could make more money. By building Daytona And racing in Feb. Bill could get the people from up north, that came south in the winter to come to the races. The racing was still in the SE. then came TV, now more people watched the drivers had to have better cars, go faster. It took a long time until it took the next step, moving out of the south east, but it did and a small snowball was started. But it pickup speed and more tracks were built, more drivers were coming into the sport from around the country, people wanted the cars to go faster, NASCAR had to make rules, drivers became hero's, more money was made, it was still a race but it also was show business. In show business things have to change or it goes under. NASCAR still controls it, so they are the ones that change it. They had to make a COD car, TV or the public didn't want to see their hero's killed or hurt bad on TV, not unless we have become so sick that we want to see that.

NASCAR knows that going away from car ID has hurt. They plan on going back to it in 2013, how I don't know. Using the same parts, well that would be great if they had robots working on the cars. People have cheated since day one, if they didn't they wouldn't have to look at the cars before, and after the race.

So those that would like to see it like it was, sorry but you are only dreaming. This is not a sport for just car people, hasn't been for a long time, and if it was it would not be what it is. Even at the home town small mom and pop tracks, most of the cars are Mod. That's what people want to see.

Same at NHRA, it's a traveling show, same drivers, same cars,and rules so no one cheats, not that they don't try.

Bob
 
#29 ·
327NUT said:
Well on March 2 & 3 I'm going to go see some REAL RACIN' with my son-in-law....Las Vegas Motor Speedway dirt track. The World of Outlaw Sprint cars...wings...410 ci....850 hp....sideways.....these things are NUTS!!
I've been to 7or 8 of those, hard to beat!
 
#31 ·
Daytona........

HI,i would rather see racing the way it was 40 years ago,run what ya brung,,,no more restrictor plates,no more France telling you how to make all cars the same,,lets get HOT RODDING back into the high speed tracks,if the drivers cant handle it,LET THEM STAY HOME,no more communications between drivers,or drivers and pit crew.no cubic inch restrictions,if they want to run a jet engine,I DONT CARE,,run everything your pockets can afford.to me the DAYTONA 500,SUCKED...........BUT,glad the new guy won......
 
#32 ·
boatbob2 said:
HI,i would rather see racing the way it was 40 years ago,run what ya brung,,,no more restrictor plates,no more France telling you how to make all cars the same,,lets get HOT RODDING back into the high speed tracks,if the drivers cant handle it,LET THEM STAY HOME,no more communications between drivers,or drivers and pit crew.no cubic inch restrictions,if they want to run a jet engine,I DONT CARE,,run everything your pockets can afford.to me the DAYTONA 500,SUCKED...........BUT,glad the new guy won......
Yeah, it was really cool when they would just fly over the rails, through the air and clean out of sight off the track huh?

While your at it, ask Richard Petty what it was like being a pin ball...!! :sweat:
 
#34 ·
sqzbox said:
Used to be 43 individual racers. I want that back for sure. :mwink:
I completely agree.
It is tough for NASCAR, keeping the cars to a point that they don't become airborne while trying not to regulate every single aspect of the car. The teams in looking for more speed has lead to the current problems and over regulation.
I believe there will never be another track like Daytona or Talladega ever built again.
 
#35 ·
DBM, Dave still wears those wing tips and the same hat. In fact, can't tell that he has changed a bit. He is still a big time family man. His daughter, son-in-law and three grand kids and wife were at our last meeting since we are a family oriented club that encourages younger members. He watches the racing on TV like the most of us.

Trees
 
#36 ·
The problem isn't the motors. If you use a smaller motor you will still have the same problem. The cars simply can handle all the power you give them. You need to take away traction. If the cars had to reduce speed in the corners your problem is solved. Every other track in the cct you need to slow down to turn. Daytona and Talladega you can go flat out. The restrictor plates serve a good purpose, an accident at 220 would be much worse than 200.

My solution is to leave the motors alone and go from a 10 inch wide tire to 9 or even 8. If the guys have to let off the gas in the corners, even for a very brief moment, the draft is out of play.
 
#37 ·
speede5 said:
The problem isn't the motors. If you use a smaller motor you will still have the same problem. The cars simply can handle all the power you give them. You need to take away traction. If the cars had to reduce speed in the corners your problem is solved. Every other track in the cct you need to slow down to turn. Daytona and Talladega you can go flat out. The restrictor plates serve a good purpose, an accident at 220 would be much worse than 200.

My solution is to leave the motors alone and go from a 10 inch wide tire to 9 or even 8. If the guys have to let off the gas in the corners, even for a very brief moment, the draft is out of play.
well they have already proven that they can get killed at 180, 220 isnt gonna be any worse. if the motors are restricted of the amount of air. then the amount fuel will be restricted also. to do that without a plate is a 2 barrel 350 cfm. it would also let them get out of the throttle and back on without a wreck. they cant let off the throttle in the turns with a plate or they will be in the stands from the pile up.
 
#38 ·
I watched the race and enjoyed it.

I love the speed so I was disappointed with the last minute rule changes to reduce the speed.

While the other tracks have great racing, tracks like Daytona and Talladega offer something different like drafting. Then there are the road course tracks that offer right turns. Combined they keep the NASCAR season from being one dimensional.

I remember the old days and the first of the TV coverage for NASCAR. It was cool, but nothing compared to the depth of coverage we get today.

I also remember when Fireball Roberts was killed, I was just a kid. I don't miss seeing the drivers die in races.

I am also a great fan of NHRA (and other drag racing). While I don't like the 1000 foot racing (The traditional 1320 is best, I think). It hardly detracts from the excitement of fuel racing, especially live (I want NHRA to come back to Va Motorsports).

The comments on the fact that these are more show than race are at least in part correct. For most fans that is what is needed.
 
#40 ·
The daytona 500

runn141 said:
really, i would like to see them just do away with a restrictor plate and see how fast they would get. Dale Earnhardt always said that, and he done more and knew for the sport than you think. since his death i have noticed it go down hill.
When they didn't have a plate, they went around 220 that was years ago, there would be no way that anyone would be safe with 43 cars going 220MPH or faster, around that track or any other. Sure the IRL cars do it but they are lighter, and less likely to go though the fence if they were air born. I don't know if you have ever been to Daytona for a race but at the speeds they go now you can't see them clear. they are just a blurr and one loud noise. When you watch them on TV they pick out the cars and you can see it pretty good, not so live.
I like speed as well as the next guy, but there is a point where it is fast enough. If you have not been to one of these super speedways and watched a race, you will never know. When one car goes by you and pulls your t-shirt right to the fence and you just see a blurr go by that's fast enough.
When a wreck starts and they stop almost a mile away, those cars are flying. When they crash, don't leave the ground and parts go into the crowd and people end up with broken bones, I don't think they have to go faster. I have seen that all happen and more.IMO everyone that says they should go faster has never been to a live Nascar race, they just watch on TV, where they look slow.

Bob
 
#41 ·
35terraplane said:
When they didn't have a plate, they went around 220 that was years ago, there would be no way that anyone would be safe with 43 cars going 220MPH or faster, around that track or any other. Sure the IRL cars do it but they are lighter, and less likely to go though the fence if they were air born. I don't know if you have ever been to Daytona for a race but at the speeds they go now you can't see them clear. they are just a blurr and one loud noise. When you watch them on TV they pick out the cars and you can see it pretty good, not so live.
I like speed as well as the next guy, but there is a point where it is fast enough. If you have not been to one of these super speedways and watched a race, you will never know. When one car goes by you and pulls your t-shirt right to the fence and you just see a blurr go by that's fast enough.
When a wreck starts and they stop almost a mile away, those cars are flying. When they crash, don't leave the ground and parts go into the crowd and people end up with broken bones, I don't think they have to go faster. I have seen that all happen and more.IMO everyone that says they should go faster has never been to a live Nascar race, they just watch on TV, where they look slow.

Bob
i think your wrong, the fastest they ever got without a plate was 212. and that was bill elliot qualifying at talladega. but the entire field qualified over 200, thats what brought the plate on. these cars are wrecking now because they cant get out of the throttle and back on quick enough to avoid a wreck. their only gonna get so fast on a track due to handling. otherwise they could run 220 at bristol for example. the IRL cars cannot run at daytona and talladega due to the suspensions not holding up. so much downforce that they literally twist.
 
#42 ·
Until Daytona got the new surface, it wasn't the fastest track on the circuit, anyway. Texas, Atlanta, Michigan and Charlotte have been faster than both Talladega and Daytona in the past. And as far as qualifying goes, they're still faster than the restrictor plate tracks.

NASCAR will do whatever it takes to keep the speeds in the 190's, IMO.
 
#43 ·
The shape of the car, by definition is an aeronautical lifting object. The faster you go, the less weight is going to be on the tires. Spoilers and ground effect add ons are required to keep enough down pressure at the high speeds. The roof flaps are there to open up and destroy the lift when the car gets past 90* and the spoiler is blocked out and ineffective. Failure of a roof flap or both is a sure thing to get the car airborne at the higher speeds. To say let them go faster because it does not matter is to say you do not understand aerodynamics. Airborne cars raise the fatality rate drastically and spreads the kill zone to stands and infields. Nope, don't need more speed. The ideal of smaller tires, front and rear would keep the speeds down and give the power on the straights for passing. Now the driver has to manage the throttle with skill and cunning or he will burn his tires off.

Bristol is an interesting example of a great race without a lot of speed and it probably separates the more skillful from the less skillful. The old track was wild with the older cars. The new track with the COT is tame and attendance is reflecting that. I was there for the last race on the old surface and for the first race of the COT and new surface. Have not bothered to go back since. BORING.

Trees
 
#44 ·
In 2004 Rusty Wallace took a cup car to Talladega, unrestricted he averaged 221, on the straights it was in excess of 228. That was seven years ago, horsepower has increased, and tricks to run faster have surfaced, today they will be considerably faster than in 04. There is no way NASCAR or their insurance companies will ever allow them to run that fast.
 
#46 ·
I used try to listen to the race on the radio but the last couple years have been depressing!!! :(

The 5 liter limit w/a 2 barrel carb. would help as well as running a true "stock body".

And above all would someone put the "RED-NECK" back in racing, all these "sissies" are killing it. What happened to "we got wrecked that's racing" all the while thinking...... :p I'll get em next week.

Just my twisted thoughts,
Tony
 
#47 ·
Speed restrictions

OR - since NASCAR mandates every single part & piece anyway - how about NASCAR allows them to run without a plate, existing engine, etc (better acceleration) BUT - mandate a taller rear gear (get RPMs up even more per mph) and thus limit top speed as no-one seems to be able to get a pushrod engine to turn 9,000 plus and live for a full 500 miles. If speeds still stay too high, NASCAR can then insist on rev lmiters

just a thot or two....
 
#48 ·
Dave57210 said:
OR - since NASCAR mandates every single part & piece anyway - how about NASCAR allows them to run without a plate, existing engine, etc (better acceleration) BUT - mandate a taller rear gear (get RPMs up even more per mph) and thus limit top speed as no-one seems to be able to get a pushrod engine to turn 9,000 plus and live for a full 500 miles. If speeds still stay too high, NASCAR can then insist on rev lmiters

just a thot or two....
I think you mean a shorter gear, as in lower gear/higher numerically. But anyway, good idea- except they're already turning mid 9000 RPM for the entire race now. I will say right here that before year's end, there will be cars turning 10K RPM. BTW, there are already gear ratio limits they have to adhere to at some tracks. Maybe they could broaden this to all tracks...

I'd like to see NASCAR mandate that more of the OEM sheet metal has to be used. In past years, if the OM design sucked that year- that car lost. If they wanted to compete, the next year saw aero improvements. Recently (IDK how this relates to the COT), part of the roof, the hood and trunk lid was about all there is of the original vehicle. If they had to run the same nose, tail and front fenders/rear quarters for example, the street cars would get better aero designs- or lose on the track.
 
#49 ·
cobalt327 said:
I'd like to see NASCAR mandate that more of the OEM sheet metal has to be used. In past years, if the OM design sucked that year- that car lost. If they wanted to compete, the next year saw aero improvements. Recently (IDK how this relates to the COT), part of the roof, the hood and trunk lid was about all there is of the original vehicle. If they had to run the same nose, tail and front fenders/rear quarters for example, the street cars would get better aero designs- or lose on the track.
That surely would bring the playing field back around again. Equality ain't all it's cracked up to be. This Daytona race is supposed to be NASCAR's Super Bowl, it was terribly boring for the viewer. The old days when the T-birds were a little quicker than the Montes, Bill Elliot, Dale, Darrel, all the rest of them fighting it out for a slim margin of victory, it was fun to watch. You really don't see a lot of Ford vs. Chev vs. Dodge anymore, none of the cars have any stock parts. It's just flat out boring on many of the tracks. I did watch most of the Phoenix race, it wasn't bad. I would also like to see a few dirt tracks thrown in there, now that would show who has mad skills!
 
#51 ·
the daytona 500

I had Four seats at Daytona for about 12 years When they got to the long line racing it would put you to sleep. This year I must have watched a different race than everyone else, that watch on TV. This was one of the best races I have seen in 10 years. A lot of the guys that I hang around with are or were stock car racers, they all thought the same. Like I said before if you had never been to a super speedway, You have no clue about what it is like.
Gears, the reason they pick the gears they do is for reaction, the cars are to slow to react when you let up on it, they would go too slow.
The speed, they don't have to go any faster, watching on TV you can read the numbers on the car when they are in a group, at the track those same cars are one big bunch of colors, and look like one big car. When they are across the track you can look at them with glasses and see them, up close no way.
When they crash they start in one spot and stop 3/4 of a mile away.
With this new points system I think you will see more guys spinning others out, as you can move a bunch if you get knocked out.

Just go to one of these fast tracks, I think most would change their mind, about going faster, you are only going to see the two car racing at two tracks, But when the lead changes over 70 times how can you not like it.

Bob
 
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