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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2013, 06:22 AM
put up or shut up
 

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the learning never stops. That's what's cool about it.

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2013, 07:44 PM
put up or shut up
 

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Two cars, two second place trophies. Apparently, Martin brought his pink bike and cleaned house on us.

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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2013, 08:04 PM
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Beautiful car Henry. Hopefully your customer understands that 165k is not big money for a show car. More than likely the car that won 1st place was a 300k car. You did your part I am sure. It is beautiful.

John L
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2013, 08:08 PM
put up or shut up
 

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these people are insane with how much they spend on these cars.Unbelievable.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2013, 08:27 PM
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Sure would be nice if some homebuilt got first. I have seen it before, passion prevails.

Brian
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2013, 08:40 PM
put up or shut up
 

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Sure would be nice if some homebuilt got first. I have seen it before, passion prevails.

Brian
Oh Martin.

Last edited by tech69; 01-28-2013 at 08:57 PM.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 01-29-2013, 07:53 PM
put up or shut up
 

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Sure would be nice if some homebuilt got first. I have seen it before, passion prevails.

Brian
says the guy that works in a production shop.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 01-29-2013, 08:53 PM
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says the guy that works in a production shop.
Yeah, and......I root for the home hobbiest not a big deal. I am thrilled there are people who can have cars done where you work so you get to do that cool stuff while getting paid, I really am. But I dig the home hobbiest getting it done too, those two worlds can live in harmony Henry.


Brian
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 06:17 AM
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Yeah, and......I root for the home hobbiest not a big deal. I am thrilled there are people who can have cars done where you work so you get to do that cool stuff while getting paid, I really am. But I dig the home hobbiest getting it done too, those two worlds can live in harmony Henry.


Brian
Brian, you are so right...So often it seems as though the people that spend a large amount of money on a car, house or what ever their heart desires get shunned or even looked down upon. I'm not in a position to own one of those $300K restorations or customs, however, I applaud the people that have the passion and the resources to build or have their dream built for them. These people may not have the ability or even the vision to personally see a project through from start to finish on there own and need the technicians, like Henry, that do. This doesn't take away from their passion and I believe it should add passion to anyone who enjoys the hobby.

For those who feel that a person with deep pockets and has a car built for them isn't a true enthusiast or sincere Ambassador of the car "cult" needs to ask themselves a question...that question being, If they had excess resources to the point where a large investment in anything that they desire wouldn't adversely affect their life style, would they themselves not do it? I know I would.

We've all gone to shows and seen that over the top build that makes us stop and just admire pure craftsmanship, engineering, passion and that intensive attention to detail. Myself, I look at these pieces of art and my first question is "who built it", not how much did it cost and when I ask that question I'm expecting the answer to be "well so and so did the body and I had the drive train done by these guys and the interior was designed and built by...". I respect the owner for giving credit where credit is due, (as the person did who owned the Mustang that "Mr.4speed" built, he publicly thanked Dennis on this forum...I admire that).

On the other side of the coin, what I don't respect (and there are many out there) is the guy that farms out an entire build and tries to take all the credit himself. This person may have had the resources to finance a build but, if he tries to take the glory, I don't believe he is a true car person. This is the guy that I feel doesn't belong, I also believe his passion is for self gratification and not to promote and advance the world of automotive restoration and customization.

To sum it up, if it wasn't for people with deep pockets and the automotive passion, we wouldn't see what's possible. When we in the trenches see what's possible, we can improvise and figure out ways to do it cheaper with the same or sometimes even achieve a better effect. After all, very often, it was a talented technician that built what the person with deep pockets envisioned, or what the technician envisioned and suggested to the person with these deep pockets. Brian, I feel that these two worlds should not only live in harmony but must live in harmony. Without each other, the advancements would be a lot slower. For those people with all these resources please remember, give credit where credit is due...if you don't, your not a car person, your a glory grabber and we have you figured out very quickly.

Ray
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 08:32 AM
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Couldn't have said it better myself Ray.

Brian
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 08:46 AM
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Couldn't have said it better myself Ray.

Brian
Thank You Brian...just my thoughts. These thoughts have come from a life time of dealing with both the grateful and the self absorbed. I've done work for both and have built life long relationships and friendships. The friendships that have been built are with the people that know what it takes to deliver what they want and respect and appreciate every effort, every detail that's gone gone into delivering what they envisioned. I prefer friendships over relationships.

Ray
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 09:20 AM
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First let me say I am not talking about anything or anyone in this thread, we have officially highjacked it for our own pleasure.

I remember being one of those bone heads who snubbed their noses at the cars that were built by a shop. First off, often those cars aren't built by a dozen guys, but by ONE guy or two at some small shop and they deserve credit. In other words SOMEONE built it, so it can get my appreciation. That being said, like the American Idol auditions I love to see the undiscovered, I love to see the car that was done by the non professional or the small shop where the car displays that one guys heart, that is car that I am drawn to.

Though like I said, a nice car is a nice car, SOMEONE built it, so I can dig it and don't ask questions.

But I remember doing this work and thinking how odd it was that I was doing a job that I couldn't afford to have done on my salary. I remember at 20 years old working in a full on resto shop thinking this. I couldn't afford to buy one of these cars, I couldn't afford (oh dear God, not even close) to have a car painted here, I remember how odd that was to me. I damn near hated those people! I didn't, as I had met them and they seemed nice enough, but I was so jealous of them I could have choked them.

I was doing it damn it, me and Chuck and Jim and Nick, WE were building that car, but he gets the trophy? That just didn't seem fair to me at all. I was going to about every rod run within a couple hundred miles at that time and I remember being at a run and there was a STUNNING 34 Ford sedan (the shop I worked at specialized in the Model 40, I knew them well) and the other guys I was with just about jumped me when I said I was voting for it for Peoples Choice, "That guy HAD that car built, you can't give it to him" and I didn't. I felt the same way but didn't ask, but when I was told about it this heck no I'm not going to give him that trophy, the guy who built it deserves it. (Insert smug smily face here). But at the NSRA Nats I was in a hotel and out parked next to my truck was this 34. And another T speedster that the guy "Had built" and both of these guys were such damn nice guys, I spent the weekend seeing them often and they were such nice guys. They had built cars over the years, now they had big bucks and no time and they had their cars built, they were still "car guys" and knowledgable ones at that. It totally changed how I looked at the guy who has his car built. Funny thing is I ran into that T later here locally and though the guy didn't claim building it, he certainly never said he didn't.

I have a photo that I couldn't find right now of a friend of mine who passed away at 37 years old of cancer. This photo is of him getting his trophy up on the stage at the Grand Nationals. He literally didn't turn one single bolt, my brother and I built the car. I don't believe he even washed it for the show, I prepped it. I remember him hanging around in my shop watching what I was doing the day before the show! He was a wrench illiterate but that didn't make him less of a car nut, I think of him whenever I see someone make a big deal out of the guy who "Had his car built". He deserved to have that trophy as much as the guys who built it.

RIP Danny.

Brian
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 09:36 AM
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It's either the owner or the painter who gets all the credit but it's the body tech who REALLY did the most challenging work. Turning a body man into a painter is a whole lot easier than turning a painter into a body man. I don't really mind not getting the credit. I document my work as my resume.

Last edited by tech69; 01-30-2013 at 10:03 AM.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 09:47 AM
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Thank You Brian...just my thoughts. These thoughts have come from a life time of dealing with both the grateful and the self absorbed. I've done work for both and have built life long relationships and friendships. The friendships that have been built are with the people that know what it takes to deliver what they want and respect and appreciate every effort, every detail that's gone gone into delivering what they envisioned. I prefer friendships over relationships.

Ray
then you get that one guy you have literally given work away for when you were in a bind earlier on and now he thinks he can get a full frame off resto for 10k. This one guy is getting just that in our shop and the latest inquiry was about fixing some hack work on a frame. "Oh, just weld it up, it should only take a few minutes." REALLY? Then why don't YOU do it then!?!? But doesn't want to spend a dime more on it. Buys all this aftermarket junk and just expects everything to fit fine and dandy but doesn't want to pay extra cause the parts he gets are soo cheap.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2013, 10:48 AM
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I know those guys all to well and they are out there....I 'd love to find the rock that they crawled out from underneath and seal it up permanently...I was between restoration jobs a while back and this guy called me, (I'd done work for him in the past and he's the guy your talking about). He asked what I was doing and I told him I was getting organized for my next job. He asked id I could come over and take a look at a small job he needed done. I looked at the job and gave him a more than fair quote, (probably discounted the job by 30% because I had done work for him in the past and it wasn't that big a job) he thought it was way to high...he ranted, raved, screamed and told me I thought you where my friend, why are you trying to take advantage of me...on and on. I waited for him to take a breath, and I told him that if he felt we where friends, he wouldn't blow up like that and now the price was going up. He screamed and yelled again...so I walked away. When I got home he had left 2 messages on my phone saying he needed to talk to me. I phoned him and calmly asked "what's up". He said he would be happy to pay my original price and that he was sorry...I told him that the price had gone up and that in future if he wanted to be my friend to call me after 6PM.

I haven't heard from him in several years...and I'm so good with that because these guys never stop, they'll grind you until your out of business. As far as the friendship goes, No call after 6PM so I guess we weren't friends to start off with.LOL

When you work for yourself you can do it, you still need to manage your responses to these characters but it is possible.

Ray
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