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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 11-30-2004, 09:18 PM
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20 ga.

we can all relax. j.w. harris has emailed me back & said they have no plans of dropping the wire, thank you for your interest in this material & so on............

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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2004, 05:31 PM
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Found a supplier here in Van. and picked up 2 rolls today
($38.00 ) will try it out soon as I pick up a bottle of gas and post
results.
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2004, 06:19 PM
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good to hear

bluechevy,

I guess the guy I talked to didn't have good information. Its good to hear the wire will still be available.
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2004, 08:48 PM
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I went to 2 different welding shops before finding someone who knew what I was talking about. Then they proceeded to tell me I didn't want that wire cause the old guy in the back said it didn't work good. I finally called JW Harris and told them that none of the companies listed on their web page knew anything about 20 Gauge. They directed me to another shop about 30 minutes from here. That shop didn't have it but they ordered it for me. I have tried it some and do like it. Oh I paid $31 for a 10 pound roll.
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Old 12-10-2004, 09:05 AM
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That "old guy in the back" should check out the local voc. school as they probably have a welding class, if he cant produce a good weld with twenty gauge he just plain cant weld!

Last edited by oldred; 12-10-2004 at 07:59 PM.
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 12-31-2004, 07:47 PM
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I got a roll of this the other day. One supplier promised to order it for me two months ago. Another had it for me one day later. I think Harris has a minimum order for their distributors, so you may need to find one who carries the product at one of their branches. Harris gave a list of several local suppliers of twenty gauge. Just drop them an email.

I tried the twenty gauge out briefly. I'm new to mig so I can't say if it's better or worse than anything else. The mig process seems to go so fast (too fast) compared with gas that it will take a lot of practice. I didn't do well butt welding two 20 gauge panels. I did get nice penetration on some rather crooked test beads in the field of some 20 gauge metal. I don't know what the problem was, but it wanted to burn through on butt welds but ran a nice bead mid-panel. More practice, I guess.

I'm interested in knowing what setting others have found useful for this wire on 18, 19 or 20 gauge metal with a Millermatic 175.

I would also like to know what stickout works best for this wire.

My last question is what is the lightest shade for the eye protection that is safe. A shade of 9 or 10 has the work invisible until the arc is running. It makes it impossible to know where I'm starting. Even with the light from the arc, it's difficult to see what is going on.
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  #67 (permalink)  
Old 12-31-2004, 08:06 PM
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firstgenbird :


Quote:
I didn't do well butt welding two 20 gauge panels. I did get nice penetration on some rather crooked test beads in the field of some 20 gauge metal. I don't know what the problem was, but it wanted to burn through on butt welds but ran a nice bead mid-panel.
I'm having the same problem as you are . I'm using a Century 100 welder that has been doing good with flux wire. Went Mon and got gas ( 25/75 argon,co2) and regulator. Have gas set at 25.
I appear to have a lot of splatter . like you hopefully more practice will help.
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Old 12-31-2004, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Have gas set at 25
Try turning your gas down to about 15-20. Too much gas is as bad as not enough.
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Old 12-31-2004, 08:35 PM
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Ranchero- If your machine is set properly for flux core wire then you need to change the polarity for twenty gauge. Your gas setting sounds ok but too much flow will only waste gas it will not cause spatter. Try changing the polarity as that sounds like your problem.
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Old 12-31-2004, 08:35 PM
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"Try turning your gas down to about 15-20. Too much gas is as bad as not enough."

I had mine set to 20 cf/hr. I'll experiment with other rates.

I forgot to turn the tank back on for the next session. It was awesome how quickly things turned to burn holes and pigeon poop until I remembered to turn the tank back on, lol.

I hope most of the problems are practice and getting the voltage and feed tuned in.

If someone can recommend a web site that helps analyze the bead shape vs settings, I think that would help me a lot.

I need advice on what to do about seeing the work. I see nothing until the arc is burning... 1/2 inch away from were I intended welding. Maybe an auto-darken helmet is the way to go. Comments?
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 12-31-2004, 08:43 PM
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Firstgen-Your problem may be the same as Ranchero that is polarity. What is your machine set for? Polarity setting will make a big difference but gas flow will not as long as it is sufficient to shield the weld puddle.
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  #72 (permalink)  
Old 12-31-2004, 08:58 PM
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Burn through

If you are having trouble with burn through on butt welds try cutting the heat down a bit..may also need to slow down the wire feed as well..I try for about 1/4" or so of stickout..

The new auto-darkening helmets are real nice and can be sdjusted for the proper darkness..

Miller site has online schooling and tips the last I looked..

OMT
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I have tried most all of it and now do what is known to work..
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old 12-31-2004, 09:29 PM
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My setup is configured for DC electrode positive. This is how my gas shielded system came configured. I think this is the polarity specified by JW Harris for their product. They call it DC reverse polarity and I assume that is the same as DCEP. Your comment might apply to Ranchero's experience though, because I think the flux core machines come with DCEN configured and this needs to be changed when adding a gas kit. I'm not familiar with his unit, so who knows?

Probably it is inexperience on my part. Even with the gap between parts minimal, there is no heat conducted between the halves until a bead is going. I also started my pratice on the joint before running a few beads.

There are so many variables to learn. Voltage, wire speed, pushing vs pulling the torch, stickout etc.

I was getting my best results with 3/8 to 1/2" stickout. This sounds like a lot compared with what I have read about. Maybe practice will help with that. This was my very first time with mig. I am great at soldering, okay at brazing, still need to learn gas welding better and I'm about clueless with the mig. The MIG looks like it can do a lot of work or a lot of damage in no time at all.

I'll have to investigate the auto-dark helmets. Is the Harbor Freight unit satisfactory or is the high priced equipment noticably better?
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old 12-31-2004, 11:59 PM
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firstgen,
your polarity is right & gas at 25 or even 35 if you have a breeze is fine. excessive splatter is caused by too much wire speed or not enough heat. 1/4" is about right for stick-out. the best way to set your machine is to decide about where you want your heat to be & adjust wire speed accordingly. get close enough to the machine that you can throw your hood down & weld with one hand & adjust your wire speed with the other( i know it sounds tough for a novice but you can do it, holding your elbow in tight at your side will help steady your hand. when it's right the splatter will be very fine & relatively easy to scrape off with regular solid core wire & virtually non-existent with 20 gauge.
if your having trouble with burn through you're going too slow or running to hot or both.
i've found the best use for 20 gauge is on light gauge sheet metal. ( 18 gauge & lighter ) you can weld heavier stuff with it but there's no advantage & it's just too slow for me. of course that might be helpful to a beginner.
a #9 shaded lens is the lightest you should ever go, any lighter is bad for your eyes. with .035 & larger wire a 10 or 11 is best. don't screw around with your eyesight!! you aren't supposed to see what you're doing until your arc is going! have your mig gun with the 1/4" stick-out setting where you want it then throw your hood down & go. always have a pair of side-cutting pliers nearby so you can cut off that little ball that forms on the end of the wire when you stop. this makes for a much cleaner re-start.
i'm probably just an old stick in the mud but i've always thought the auto-darkening hoods were a waste of money. their main purpose is to save time for heavy production work. i guess i can see where they might be of help to someone while just learning. when i started i'm not sure they even existed. oh god! a "back in the day" story!!
anyway just keep practicing & you'll get the hang of it. it took me about two years to get very good at it & i'm shaky handed & don't have the best hand to eye coordination in the world. eventually i got pretty good at it & got many certifications on lots of different types of wire in many positions, so i figure if i can do it anybody can. just keep practicing.
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old 01-01-2005, 12:39 AM
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I'm an old fart with over 40 years of welding experience, including 5 yrs. working as a production line welder at Oldsmobile (Fisher Body) retired now.
I thought I was pretty proficient with a mig until I had the opportunity to try out an Auto-Darkening shield, I found I can weld up a replacement floorpan in less than half the time it took me with my old helmet, not so much because of the auto darkening, but because the return to a clear lens can be regulated so that I don't even have to lift the shield between tacks and am able to place every weld with extreme accuracy.
No way would I consider going back to old non adjustable fixed shade shields.
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