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Old 09-19-2008, 01:19 PM
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Newbie to paint and body questions...

Hey guys, I need some direction / help here. I've searched and read through the forum and still need some guidance.

I'm in the process of doing bodywork on my bug body for my V8 bug project. My goal is basically to get her back to the original body shape and to get a nice looking paint job applied that's of equal or better quality of a new / modern car. I don't intend on the paint job being of show quality. I'm looking to do a basic bc/cc job in paint code 8T7 Blue Streak Metallic. I'm wanting to paint the car myself and I understand metallic paint is harder to spray / to get the flake even. I'm doing this on a budget which is why I have lots of questions.

I came across this book and it seemed to have lots of good information and I think I'm just going to buy it.



At this point I'm still doing body work. I've been using a 2K bondo and rattle can primer, Rust-o-leum Automotive primer - wet sandable. I was told by a knowledgeable neighbor, I think, that before I spray down any real primer I should sand off all the rattle can primer cause it'll cause the paint to bubble out. Is this true?

My intentions for this primer really has been to cover exposed body work (bondo / bare metal). He also told me I should remove it all and spray a coat of 2K sealer, do the body work on top of that and then put down my coat of primer, base, clear...From my understanding doesn't it go body work (body filler), primer, sealer, base, clear? Isn't the sealer non sandable?

I'm thinking about setting up a temporary spray booth here at my job and plugging into their airline / compressor that powers multiple silkscreening and latex balloon machines. Good or bad idea and what do I look out for? Moisture?

Is there a good HPLV gun I can buy for $50 that'll spray primer, metallic base coat and clear nicely? If not, I'll see what I can do about borrowing my Uncles.

Paints, what's a good brand that'll last and wont break the bank? And how much can I expect to spend if I want to paint the entire exterior, under the trunk and hood, door jams and the inner doors?

Any advice will be of great help! Thanks!

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Old 09-19-2008, 02:47 PM
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you really shoudnt use the rattle can primer it may cause the paint to lift that happened to me on the first car i every did and i had to resand the whole thing to bare metal! and the primers and then it costs more money in materials once you have to sand it all off and reapply real primer i work at johnnys auto body in wisconsin i personally work on air plane parts for Cirrus and we spray epoxy on the bare metal then apply filler without sanding the epoxy then block the filler then primer with a urethane primer but you can just grind down to bare metal then put your filler on then prime and spray the epoxy on right before you paint too,
but on cars that we do there we just grind to bare metal then put on the filler so either way is acceptable spraying epoxy on before applying body filler is just a newer way to do it and is supposed to last longer, just maker sure you use a quality filler i personally use evercoat Z-grip and evercoat polyester finishing filler and my primer is montana high build urethane there not the most expensive and not the cheapest but they are really good for the price just stay away from paints and primers and fillers that are ready to spray or apply without a activator chances are they are laquer based and will cause the paint to lift
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Old 09-19-2008, 02:50 PM
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to make it more clear

bare metal, seal, apply filler, block sand, reapply filler if neccessary or apply primer, then block, epoxy base then clear is the newer way of doing it

the older way is just
bare metal, apply filler, block, reapply if neccesary then primer, block, epoxy base clear
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Old 09-19-2008, 02:55 PM
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Thanks for the advice! Is it OK that a small amount of the cheaper primer stay on? Say for instance pin hole sized areas the primer files in?

So stick with 2K or two part paints, primer, etc...?

I intended to sand almost all the cheap stuff off and I'm using it kinda as a guide coat. It sands off really easy and quick so it shouldn't be too hard getting rid of it.
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Old 09-19-2008, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jarrettandroski
bare metal, seal, apply filler, block sand, reapply filler if neccessary or apply primer, then block, epoxy base then clear is the newer way of doing it

the older way is just
bare metal, apply filler, block, reapply if neccesary then primer, block, epoxy base clear
Got it, thanks! How much can expect to spend on a good quality primer, sealer, epoxy, base and clear.

Is epoxy a type of sealer?
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Old 09-20-2008, 08:32 AM
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epoxy primer is the industrys standard for sealing the epoxy resin makes it waterproof really good epoxy sealer like ppg dplf series will cost you about 200-250 a gallon with activator or for some cheaper stuff like autobody master or omni about 100$ with activator, for a gallon of the montana high build urethane primer about 80$ for a gallon, i would recommend you with montana clear also its cheap and really good its around 80$ for a gallon with activator if you used lets say a omni base coat about $100 or a little more for a gallon but if you used ppg about 200-250 but with the base i dont think its all that important to buy a expensive one because the clear is going over it to protect it i like to use autobody master trim black as my guide coat or you can spend a couple dollars more and get real guide coat which i would recommend if its you first paint job and you want it to be straight then block the primer with a sanding block and the longer the block the straighter it will be, and if black still remains after sanding the primer you have low spots or pinholes and it will need to be reprimed if you have a Harbor Freight around i bought a hlvp spray gun from them for 10$ and have sprayed stuff with them i would recommend not using the same one of the cheap guns for priming and painting because they go to hell if you do that really fast for some reason and as long as you never use that 10$ gun till you paint it will work just fine and layout really good for a 10$ gun and a trick i use when spraying metallics is to spray on a coat or 2 just normal making sure i overlap about 1/2 to 3/4
each coat then before i spray the clear on i go all over about 2 ft away just sraying a mist coat on all the areas painted to make the metallics even then it isnt blotchy
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Old 09-23-2008, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jarrettandroski
epoxy primer is the industrys standard for sealing the epoxy resin makes it waterproof really good epoxy sealer like ppg dplf series will cost you about 200-250 a gallon with activator or for some cheaper stuff like autobody master or omni about 100$ with activator, for a gallon of the montana high build urethane primer about 80$ for a gallon, i would recommend you with montana clear also its cheap and really good its around 80$ for a gallon with activator if you used lets say a omni base coat about $100 or a little more for a gallon but if you used ppg about 200-250 but with the base i dont think its all that important to buy a expensive one because the clear is going over it to protect it i like to use autobody master trim black as my guide coat or you can spend a couple dollars more and get real guide coat which i would recommend if its you first paint job and you want it to be straight then block the primer with a sanding block and the longer the block the straighter it will be, and if black still remains after sanding the primer you have low spots or pinholes and it will need to be reprimed if you have a Harbor Freight around i bought a hlvp spray gun from them for 10$ and have sprayed stuff with them i would recommend not using the same one of the cheap guns for priming and painting because they go to hell if you do that really fast for some reason and as long as you never use that 10$ gun till you paint it will work just fine and layout really good for a 10$ gun and a trick i use when spraying metallics is to spray on a coat or 2 just normal making sure i overlap about 1/2 to 3/4
each coat then before i spray the clear on i go all over about 2 ft away just sraying a mist coat on all the areas painted to make the metallics even then it isnt blotchy
Thanks for all the advice, you've been a big help!
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:20 PM
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You might want to consider SPI primers and clears. Their prices are about the best you will find for a quality product.

http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/Pricing%20Info.htm

The epoxy mixes 1:1 giving you 2 gallons of sprayable for about $150.

Keep in mind that a cheap gun will cost you in wasted materials and a lot of additional work. If you can borrow a Good gun, it will be well worth it. A $10 gun may be OK for primer, but I wouldn't bet some base or clear on it.

Aaron
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Old 09-25-2008, 08:29 AM
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Thanks for the reply and help!

I see that 302 Z28 has gotten great results with the HVLP gun from HF (#43430). So I think I'll just grab one of those up.

Sounds like a good product for a reasonable price, and should be enough for my purposes.

Thanks again,
Matt
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Old 09-25-2008, 10:35 AM
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The gun works good but is a real air hog.
Make sure your air compressor will put out 15 CFM at 50 PSI or you will run into problems.
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