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Topic Review (Newest First)
12-05-2012 07:49 AM
Stanlyf cobalt327, no I don't.
12-04-2012 02:10 PM
cobalt327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stanlyf View Post
I would choose 64-65 Falcon.
I'm just curious- do you have any connection w/them?
12-04-2012 11:50 AM
Stanlyf I would choose 64-65 Falcon. You may also look for project cars for sale here, when I was searching for I car I came across this website and there is a big choice here
10-18-2012 12:21 PM
farna That Crown Vic should get better mileage than the Tempest/LeMans would. The CV should get around 23 mpg highway/16 city, and average around 19 mpg (according to Fuel Economy).

I was going by the price guide when stating there wasn't a LeMans four door. I just looked at a few other sources and yes, there should be a LeMans four door model for 65. It's the top trim for the Tempest body (Pontiac GM A-body). That might add another $300-500 to the pricing, but no where near the LeMans two door models.
10-18-2012 08:49 AM
benmoo According to Old Ride there was a Lemans 4dr Sedan:
1965 PONTIAC TEMPEST Information Specifications Resources Pictures
I guess I'll know soon enough when I see the VIN.

Thanks for the link to that market pricing website, very useful!

As for the horrible mileage, I'm already used to that with my Crown Vic. I appreciate the continued input as I search and search. Looking at old cars is completely foreign to me so this is helping me be more patient.
10-17-2012 07:10 PM
farna A lot of car of that era rust around the lip that holds the rear window in. I don't think it's a deal breaker, but it might be a way to negotiate the price down a bit.

Go to Collector Car Market Review Pricing and check out the suggested value. Value is really what you can get it for and how bad you want it, collector car values aren't like newer car blue book pricing. Pricing in guides is partially based on auction and other reportable sales results, but there is some estimating as well.

From what I can see and the description that is somewhere between a #2 and #3 car (IMHO). It's also a Tempest -- there were no LeMans four doors, at least not in 65. That would put it in the $4000-$5000 range, not $6000. Top value for a #2 (remember, most show cars you see are #2 -- a #1 car is a top pro resto trailered to shows, or a museum quality resto) is $5500-$5600.

Would $6K be too much to pay for it? Not if you really like/want it. Print the value and condition guide pages out and take them with you when you look at it though. $5K would be a more fair price, but it really depends on how much you like it and what your other options are. On the plus side it looks ready to roll. If you plan on using it as a daily driver that 326 is going to get old fast, but it will put a smile on your face -- until you hit the gas pumps. You're probably looking at 18 mpg on a good day of interstate travel, keeping it no more than 65 mph (MAYBE 70... but no more!), an average of 15-16 mpg. If more fun is better than more mileage that won't matter...

I'd pay $6K for that one before I'd go for a cheap car that needs a lot of work.
10-17-2012 02:42 PM
benmoo OK, now I've got two Pontiacs on my radar. Aside from that black one in Stockton, this one just popped up and is much closer to me:

1965 Pontiac Lemans

Both are about $6000. This one is a two owner, recently restored. I'm going to go look at it this Saturday. He said the rear window seal is leaking moisture (not streams of water) and as a result the rear parcel tray has some rust. Is this a red flag? I usually wouldn't consider this a deal breaker.
10-11-2012 11:21 AM
TWX I vote for the Chrysler A-body. The same basic car was built from '67-'76, and the upgrades of the later years like the brakes fit on the early years. The V8-equipped cars can support EFI 318/5.2 and 360/5.9 engines through 2003 in the vans and Dakota, and parts are plentiful.
10-11-2012 07:37 AM
AutoGear My Aunt had a Tempest Sprint with the 4bbl OHC 6er. Several people in my family have said that car with a wide ratio manual trans (deep 1st gear) would run with just about any street car from stoplight to stoplight. Here in the Northeast; the OHC 6 was banned from competing against the Chevy 6's and flathead 8's in the dirt short track days. Mickey Thompson loved that motor as well. Incidentally Ive seen a few show up at cruise-nights. If the engine is detailed nicely, it usually draws a crowd, compared to a similar GTO or Firebird with a stock looking V8.
10-10-2012 06:23 PM
farna For a nice cruiser/driver as you you stated you wanted, I'd leave the six in there. There are a few parts for it, but might be hard to find. The block is essentially a Chevy 230 six block (66-67, 260 for 68-69), but there were some changes to the casting in the front. IIRC it only uses the crank and rods from a Chevy six (and associated parts like bearings). I'm not sure about the pistons, probably specific to the OHC configuration. Find a 4V intake if you want to pep it up a little. Standard was rated 165 hp, the "Sprint" 4V version was rated 207 hp. There is a forum specifically for these engines (Pontiac Overhead Cam SIX Forum Forums)!! Yeah, I'd say it's a darn nice car, and would be a shame to do a lot of mods that can't be returned back to stock if desired later. The four door hardtop is a cool style. You could shave the outside door handles on the rear doors to really trick people! Okay, shaving the door handles is a bit more than "easily returned to stock" since welding is involved, but door handle holes can be drilled back easy enough... You just wouldn't be able to get in the back seats from outside, use electric door poppers on the inside.

I wouldn't go with a roll bar. Those cars have a full frame. This site has a good photo of the frame with a tubular brace in the center (scroll down): Frame strengthening needed? - Chevelle Tech

Most sites say do nothing to the frame unless you're running over 500 hp. Same frame was used whether the car got a Pontiac 400 (389 in 67?) or OHC six. No extra bracing is needed.
10-10-2012 05:18 PM
Trucknut You're going to have to spend $400-500 on the rear bumper. If you're swapping out engines, there should be some sort of market for the low image OCH six. The interior looks good. Check the lower rear section of the quarter panel back behind the wheels. You may find rust or evidence of repair. Be sure and look at the floor pans in the trunk. A three speed set up would attract me if I was thinking four speed.
10-10-2012 05:03 PM
Trucknut You might want to do your homework/research. Look all over the internet and get some sort of average asking price. I have a 1966 Lemans 2DR with a 1967 GTO 400 in it. Lots of parts out there. Most can be found at Original Parts Group.

That sure looks to be a nice 4DR HDT!

Good luck!
10-10-2012 04:34 PM
benmoo OK guys, I've got a live one! Need some opinions if you got 'em.

1967 PONTIAC LEMANS

Dude is asking $6500, but he's willing to negotiate. I'm aiming for $4000. It's all original, rust free, originally an Ohio car. He restores/flips cars for a living and says that he hasn't had to do anything to this car and that it runs/drives perfectly.

I know that the 4 door hardtops aren't ideal but I figure a roll cage would solve any rigidity issues.
Or, is this car too nice/original to be modified by yours truly?
10-04-2012 04:32 PM
benmoo I think I'm leaning towards an El Camino. It has a lot of the styling and structural goodness of the Chevelle, and looks like it has a fairly practical bed size. Plus, there's a LOT of them on craigslist!
10-04-2012 04:24 PM
farna If you're looking for gas mileage and a truck, there's not much in the 60s -- 60-65 Falcon Ranchero is about it. The 60-63 has that funky early 60s look and is roomy enough. 66-67 is a good size too. The 68-71 is a bit bigger, Torino based, but still not too big, like the 72-79. 64-77 El Caminos are Chevelle based, the 78-87 Malibu based. All are a good size to work with and easy to hot-rod.

All the US trucks were big full sized jobs. You could lightly hop up a six in one ad might get as high as 20-22 mpg on the highway, keep it under 65 mph though. Anything over and aerodynamic drag jumps way up and kills mileage. I was getting 21-22 mpg under 65 with a Jeep J-10 with a six and 4 speed, but when I took a trip in a hurry and cruised at 74 mileage dropped to 10-11 mpg!! The hopped-up six would do it without struggle or complaint though.

Speaking of Jeep... the 47-65 Willys/Kaiser Jeep pickup is small and economical. About the size of the early Courier/Toyota pickups, but definitely 50s styling. They used a small four or six. I've seen them with small blocks, but it's a tight fit. A modern big four or mid size V-6 would motivate it well. 2.5L Jeep Cherokee/Dodge Dakota EFI four or the 2.5L Ranger EFI four would be great in one of those -- good power and decent gas mileage.

If you want Ford/Chevy you'll have to go late 40s/early 50s to get a small to medium sized truck. My brother's 52 Ford F-1 is a good medium size, as are other 48-56 Fords. 47-55 Chevys are a bit bigger looking, may not be much bigger or heavier.

Another great overlooked 60s truck is the 60-64 Studebaker Lark based "Champ" pickup. Basically it's a 60-64 Lark body (the Stude compact car... which would be a great hot-rod itself!) that's been cut off a bit behind the front doors and used as the cab for a pickup. Older Studebaker trucks are interesting too -- similar in size to the 40s and 50s Fords.

You could always hot-rod an early 70s Courier, Toyota, or Datsun truck. One of those with a mild small block or even a V-6 (especially a 4.3L Chevy or 4.0L Ford) would be a fun ride and do some hauling too. Look to the high teens/mid twenties for gas mileage.
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