|08-24-2008 01:20 PM|
Ro Mcgonegal commented when testing the '98 Camaro that it ran about the same times as his built C1 (can't remember the exact year) Vette with slicks, headers, and 4:56 rear.
That pretty much puts it into perspective for me.
|08-24-2008 12:19 PM|
|08-22-2008 12:26 AM|
In 1968 I bought a 66 GTO..Royal Pontiac modified... I ran it many times on the street where it was quite the beast. Even with the 421 HO tri-carb ram air..headers..4.11 gears I think my best real time was mid/low 13s. The stock 389s were slower certainly..but tires limited these torque monsters.
I dreamed of breaking into 12s..never happened.
Blew the rear end..went 4.56 which made it better as a street racer 'cause we rarely did a real 1/4..especially if you could smoke the other car through mid 3rd gear..
Wheel hop..smoke..howling tires..may slow a car..but it sure was fun..!
All black,,red lines..4 spd..and of course the 421 looked so similar to the 389..
Panty collection in trunk..for better weight distribution of course..
FUN TIMES..not necessarly Fastest times..
|08-21-2008 08:23 PM|
|08-21-2008 04:15 PM|
Most were in the mid 12's from the factory. One of the hot rod shows did a episode on this not to long ago. I have a bunch of old hotrod mags from the 60's and 70's and the tested specs on most were mid 12 range. I had a bone stock 70 Hemi Road Runner that went 12.2 at the track consistently.
|08-21-2008 10:33 AM|
Maybe go back a little farther. In 57 or 58 one of the older guys had a 35 Ford flathead. I think it was a 296 cu in. About as far as you could go with a flathead. 3 carbs, alum heads etc. It ran 105 or so and in the high 13's. It was a pretty good killer but a maintenance nightmare. I saw him totally disintegrate a '39 transmission right in front of the neighbors house. what a mess. A 58 Vette 4 spd gave him a good run.
Funny thing is that a year later my best friend did the same thing including the rear end in a 39Ford with a 54 Olds motor.
a 53 Ford with a 55 Olds 4 carbs and 4.10 gears ran mid 14 s and 95 in 1960. Pretty much the local killer. A 60 Pont 4 spd was a heck of a race.
One of our carclub members had a 61 Pont Bonnevile tripower 4 spd 3.90 ran 15.30 and 96 bone stock thru the mufflers.
The Pont were really good off the line as they all had huge rear overhang and you could slide the spare tire way back for even more.
|08-21-2008 06:42 AM|
|Crazy Mopar Guy||
It was just the one test for sure, I used to have the magazine but it's vanished over the years..... I remember the car being "4555 pounds" with a 3.36 rear gear. Not sure if that's my memory or "facts" either though....
|08-21-2008 03:20 AM|
In the spring of 1969 I was working the oil change rack at the local Chevy dealership. I was driving a 1963 Impala SS 327 4 speed. I bought the first 69 Chevelle SS 396 that came into that dealership. It was a 325hp car, 4-speed 3.55 open rear. The car would get beat by just about anything on the street that could get traction. The 325 hp 396 lost a piston one night when a spring broke and dropped the valve.
Being they had 50000 mile/5 year warranties then I talked the owner of the dealership into letting me put a 375hp 396 back into it. At the time Fred Gibb was getting in 396/375 hp novas and camaros, taking the 396/375 out and putting 427 short blocks under the closed chamber heads and selling them all over central IL. I got one of the short block 396/375s for my Chevelle, found a dealer that had a set of "hi-perf" heads and ended up with a 396/375hp engine in the Chevelle. I ended up putting a posi trac in it, but traction was always a major problem.
The 396/375 would foul a set of plugs in one night of cruising, you had to take it out on the highway to blow the cobs out. Ignition systems were point type and most of the old muscle cars ran around in various states of needing a tune-up.
The 396/375 put out tons of torque and power, but it was hard to utilize on the street with the tires we had. We still raced the tires off every friday and Saturday nights. It pretty much kept me broke buying parts and gas, etc.
For $5 you could get enough gas and Marboros to cruise all night, including a few blasts out on the highway to clean her out. Ethel was $.32/gal.
I paid $3250 for the car.
Today is truly the good ol days as the performance parts are so far supperior than in the 60-70s, and plentiful and cheap. Ignitions sytems are so much better, and when you get into fuel injection and computer control, well there really isn't much to campare with the old cars. Just look at the ZO6 Corvette. 25 miles per gallion, 200 miles per hour, and idles pretty damn smooth. There was nothing in "the day" that would compare.
Yeah, I still love the old muscle cars of back in the day, but I'm sure enjoying all this new technology. I think it may be short lived the way things are looking with the oil prices and alternative means of propulsion being considered.
I know this was long and some of it a bit off topic, but I think some will remember some fond memories.
|08-21-2008 12:24 AM|
and mopar guy, I also found a source claiming Car and Driver got a 0-60 time of 3.9 seconds for the '65 catalina as well so whatever that may be worth I dunno...seems sketchy to me too, especially considering a 1963 model catalina with a higher output 421 was good for a 13.70 1/4 mile did a 0-60 time of 5 seconds
|08-20-2008 11:13 PM|
|Crazy Mopar Guy||
0-60 in 3.9 seconds. STOCK.
I would sure love to see that replicated. LOL
The specs for the car were in the mag, It wasn't steep gears or light weight, it was just "somehow".... QUICKER than every other car of the same specs...
|08-20-2008 11:10 PM|
|Crazy Mopar Guy||
Most "10 second cars" back in the day would have ran a 13 second 1/4 mile.
Most "13 second cars" back in the day would have ran a 15 second 1/4 mile.
Tires did NOT hook back then, cars weren't usually kept in ultimate tunes, and the actual performance of an untouched original musclecar would never rival what these cars claim to run nowadays....
Original (REAL STOCK) musclecars were alot slower than many people pretend. They were cool, had tons of character, but EVERYBODY has a neighbour with a "stock 13 second Duster"....
I think big block musclecars that actually could RUN a 13 second 1/4 mile time, dead stock, were very few and far between.
|08-20-2008 11:03 PM|
Interesting link to the fifty fastest. A couple of questionable numbers jump out at me:
7. 1964 Polara 500 firstname.lastname@example.org 426 4V 365 four-speed 3.23 HC 2/64 - No way a stock 3.23 geared 365hp 4000# car turned this time/speed, but then, Hi-Performance Cars isn't the most authoritative mag, either.
45. 1970 Olds 4-4-2 W-30 email@example.com 455 W-30 370 automatic 3.42 CC 11/69 - Again, the ET is way low for a 3.42 geared car with only a 95 MPH top end. Like to see how Car Craft explained it.
thnx, jack vines
|08-20-2008 08:10 PM|
|DoubleVision||When I was a kid, we had a huge 1969 kingswood estate station wagon, buy no means a muscle car, but under the hood was a factory 300 horsepower 350, I still remember the air cleaner decal. The biggest impression it left on me was the sound when my older brother would kick it, there was nothing like the sound of a Quadrajet howling so loud it sounded like it was going to suck the hood in. We later took the engine out and placed it in a 1974 monte carlo, after we replaced the worn out factory cam. I remember it being a strong running car.|
|08-20-2008 05:39 PM|
CHECK THIS LINK OUT:
it's a list of the 50 quickest stock American cars ever put on the road as tested by magazines when these cars were new, not compiled by a single magazine years later...as you can see the 1966 Cobra with a 427 pulled 12.20 1/4 mile, that was in 1966 it took 31 years for another stock american car to beat it...keep in mind the Cobra was tested in late 1965 and then think of how far tire technology has come since then...not sure when this was compiled because by now there would be quite a few more recent additions to that list but I still find it pretty amazing how quick some of those cars were back then when compared to more modern rigs...imagine how those numbers would change with some modern wrinkle walls...
|08-20-2008 12:39 PM|
Imagine driving a 2 ton car with 400 horsepower on 2 ply-4 ply rated bias ply nylon tires, and drum brakes, that sums up the first GTO, GTA Fairlane, 409 Impala, 421 Pontiac, 406 Ford Galaxie, 413 Max Wedge models from Chrysler and many, many more. Some of these cars couldn't be stopped from the top speed they could attain, the brakes faded to nothing and you still had 80 mph to get rid of. The fact so many of use survived this era is simply amazing.
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