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Topic Review (Newest First)
06-28-2009 11:20 AM
oldred
Quote:
Originally Posted by robs ss
Most air tools will run a smaller single stage compressor out of air in short order irregardless of the size of the line.

http://www.1969supersport.com


OR the size of the tank!
06-27-2009 09:51 PM
001mustang
Quote:
Originally Posted by robs ss
Most air tools will run a smaller single stage compressor out of air in short order irregardless of the size of the line.

http://www.1969supersport.com
LOL. True true.
06-27-2009 08:00 PM
4 Jaw Chuck I would also recommend at least a 1" galvanized line, but if you can afford it 2" would be even better...100' ft is a long way and the less restriction the better.
06-27-2009 03:30 PM
robs ss
Quote:
Originally Posted by 001mustang
If you run one tool at a time you will be hard pressed to use all the air a 100ft 1/2" line can provide, regardless of compressor size..

http://www.goodyearrubberproducts.co...g1.Page528.pdf

100' 1/2" pipe will flow 54 SCFM at 100 PSI with a 10% DP.
Most air tools will run a smaller single stage compressor out of air in short order irregardless of the size of the line.

http://www.1969supersport.com
06-27-2009 12:11 PM
001mustang
Quote:
Originally Posted by 001mustang
1/2" copper will be sufficient if you use only one tool at a time. You can run a healthy sand blaster or paint gun using the 100' 1/2 Cu line. You can run 3/4" Cu if you have overkill tendencies.
If you run one tool at a time you will be hard pressed to use all the air a 100ft 1/2" line can provide, regardless of compressor size..

http://www.goodyearrubberproducts.co...g1.Page528.pdf

100' 1/2" pipe will flow 54 SCFM at 100 PSI with a 10% DP.
06-27-2009 11:00 AM
Sanctifier
Quote:
Originally Posted by shad9876
My compressor is going to be about a hundred feet from the shop and I am trying to determine the best way to get the air from the compressor to the work area.

I am thinking of running 3/4" black iron pipe underground from the storage shed that houses the air compressor to the shop.

What do you think? Could I get by with 1/2" pipe, or am I undersized with 3/4" for that length?

Any suggestions welcome!!
You didn't say what your compressor rating was... HP &/or CFM. Assuming about 5HP, I'd suggest 1" galvanize pipe minimum.
For less than 5HP, �" minimum. For such a long 100' run, you may need 1" to prevent a severe pressure drop.

Choosing the correct size of air-pipe:


This compilation might help ---> DIY Series ~ Tools: Air-compressor & Piping Installation

Here are some things to keep in mind ---> Air Compressor Piping Diagrams and Tips.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Dickson - OLDSmobility.com
Air Compressor Piping Rules Of Thumb:

After leaving the air compressor, air line pipe goes straight up the shop wall as high as possible.
This helps minimize any water from leaving the compressor and traveling through the pipe.

Slope main lines at least four inches (10 cm) per 50 feet (12.7 m) of pipe away from air compressor so
that condensate travels with the flow of air and away from the compressor.
As warm air leaves the compressor, it cools and thereby condenses as it travels through the pipe.

This water vapor, a problem in itself, can also cause scaling and rusting inside the piping.
Install drop legs for condensate removal.

The first air drop should be at least 25 ft. (6.4 m) from the compressor although 50 feet (12.7 m) is optimum.
This allows the compressed air to cool to room temperature so any condensation can occur before it gets
into the water separator.

Take-off comes from the top of the main air supply line at each air drop.
This reduces the risk of water and other contaminants from traveling down the drop into the water separator.

Use carbon steel pipe as discharge pipe material. Never use PVC or ABS. (PVC is easy to work with, but will not allow the hot air to cool quickly enough to condense the water in the compressed air.
Also, in case of a compressor regulator failure, if the PSI inside the line were to go above the rated safety capacity, the plastic pipe won't just split, but will actually explode, producing razor-sharp projectiles which are sure to damage property and person.)


Consider using Schedule 40 black iron, galvanized, copper, stainless steel, or anodized aluminum.

Size the pipe for maximum CFM required. This will equal full load production plus future expansion plans.
(See chart above)
My $0.02
06-26-2009 01:09 PM
001mustang I agree Rob.

I have similar setup and found my desiccant dryer and water separator is not needed with proper piping.

I would avoid any horizontal piping near the compressor.

I had one PI that got water inside and lost calibration when it froze. I installed that PI on a vertical nipple and it works perfect. If you are unlucky the PI will get water inside and freeze.
06-26-2009 12:49 PM
robs ss
Quote:
Originally Posted by 001mustang
That is a good drawing. I like the exaggerated slope.

The lines should be sloped as much as practical to assure water is actually drained. I have seen specs of 1/4" per foot which can lead to water build up like previous poster said.

I prefer to slope line to compressor to assure that OIL as well as water drains into compressor tank.

One problem I saw with the drawings is the first leg from compressor outlet is not sloped and the pressure gauge (PI) is susceptible to flooding. A flooded PI will surely get freeze damaged if ambient temp drops below freezing. Must mount PI above water level.
A little more here. Up here in N.E. Wisconsin it can get to 20 below, and I have had it below freezing in the garage.

The compressor kicks in around 125 psi and out at 175 psi. I always have 125 or over on it below freezing or not, never a problem.

I don't know how many have looked at the drawing, but it doesn't have any dessicant cannisters or air dryers, its pretty basic and not that expensive to put up, although time consuming, once its in you forget it, clean dry air.

Rob

http://www.1969supersport.com
06-26-2009 12:44 PM
001mustang I understand. Your drawing is very nice.

The only change I would make is to add a vertical nipple for PI to assure PI does not get flooded.
06-26-2009 12:37 PM
robs ss
Quote:
Originally Posted by 001mustang
That is a good drawing. I like the exaggerated slope.

The lines should be sloped as much as practical to assure water is actually drained. I have seen specs of 1/4" per foot which can lead to water build up like previous poster said.

I prefer to slope line to compressor to assure that OIL as well as water drains into compressor tank.

One problem I saw with the drawings is the first leg from compressor outlet is not sloped and the pressure gauge (PI) is susceptible to flooding. A flooded PI will surely get freeze damaged if ambient temp drops below freezing. Must mount PI above water level.
That line drains into the tank itself.


http://www.1969supersport.com
06-26-2009 12:14 PM
001mustang
true true

Quote:
Originally Posted by jaguarxk120
Hey an old propane tank will work as a second tank. Sometimes they can be had for nothing. The plus factor is they should be perfectly clean inside. Easy to flush out with a air lance to take out any gas left.
A second tank down stream of 100ft run would be better than a water separator which will fill up quickly on a poorly designed system.

He could even run 100ft air hose (1/2 id would be nice) followed by a tank to collect condensed water.

Many ways to skin the cat.
06-26-2009 12:05 PM
jaguarxk120 Hey an old propane tank will work as a second tank. Sometimes they can be had for nothing. The plus factor is they should be perfectly clean inside. Easy to flush out with a air lance to take out any gas left.
06-26-2009 11:54 AM
oldred I think the OP said he was going to use a second tank where the line runs into the shop and if so this should greatly reduce any problems with incoming moisture. If the air is routed into the second "thump" tank first and then a line is taken from the TOP of this tank THEN plumbed into the separators he should have a really decent air system without major moisture problems. This tank should not be more than about 10 gallons or so depending on compressor CFM to prevent excessively long recharge times which would not be good for the compressor.


[EDIT] I just checked back and I don't see where he said anything about a second tank, don't know where I got that , but it would help. It certainly would not be necessary however since there are several "right" ways of doing this that should be equally efficient.
06-26-2009 10:33 AM
001mustang
Sloped lines

Quote:
Originally Posted by robs ss
I would stay away from the underground line if you can, heres a drawing of what you need to do to remove moisture generated by your compressor.

http://www.1969supersport.com/draw1.html


Rob
http://www.1969supersport.com
That is a good drawing. I like the exaggerated slope.

The lines should be sloped as much as practical to assure water is actually drained. I have seen specs of 1/4" per foot which can lead to water build up like previous poster said.

I prefer to slope line to compressor to assure that OIL as well as water drains into compressor tank.

One problem I saw with the drawings is the first leg from compressor outlet is not sloped and the pressure gauge (PI) is susceptible to flooding. A flooded PI will surely get freeze damaged if ambient temp drops below freezing. Must mount PI above water level.
06-26-2009 09:49 AM
oldred I think running the line underground is a dandy idea but there must be some provision for draining the water from it where it comes into the shop. If the line reaches the shop at a low point and then must rise up to separator/regulator/outlet this could cause a problem so a drain must located at the lowest point. Also be careful not to allow the line to sag anywhere along it's length which could easily happen even with black or galvanized when using lengths like that. A low spot along the length of the pipe can be especially troublesome since it will allow water to collect that can not be drained, this water will be expelled in spurts when it reaches a certain level in the pipe. What is so annoying about this problem is that the air may seem to be dry most of the time but as the water collects in the low spot it will restrict the air flow until it reaches a point at which it will pick up most of the water and shoot it out of the line almost like a water hose for a few seconds. After this happens all may seem ok for a while but the cycle will start all over again and you never know when the water will come shooting out! Of course this need not be a problem at all since it is simply a matter of keeping that line straight and keeping the slope fairly constant.



BTW, there is arguments both ways as to which direction to slope the pipe but IMO either direction will be just fine as long as the drain can be placed on the low end. In all probability the slope here is going to be determined by the location of the compressor to the shop so just slope it whatever direction is convenient, just place that drain at the lowest point.
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