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The Roofus Special

151K views 425 replies 50 participants last post by  MARTINSR 
#1 ·
What is the best thing you can do with a rotted out 1954 four door Caddillac?

Build a boat tail speedster!!!

First you gotta cut the roof off!



Then cut the skin free. ....and slice that down the middle



Then cut apart some old porch posts to recycle the free 1x1 tubing. Bend that into a shape that follows the curve of the roof. What the heck bend it so it makes the shape of a 30's Indy car.



Prop up half a roof and see what it looks like. Looks like the ROOFus Special to me.

 
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#102 ·
Flipper_1938 said:
......On the subject of curves, do you guys think that the top of the hood and cowl should be peaked, curved, or flat down the center?

I'm kinda up in the air over this one.
I would put a curve in it for two reasons. First a large flat surface will tend to look concave on a car. Second a flat sheet of metal will tend to 'drum' when there is vibration unless you stiffen it on the back. Great work, thanks for posting.
 
#103 ·
Great build!

As for the hood I would suggest either no hood or one shaped like an MGA where it is rounded in front, radiused slightly over the top and curved forward across the rear.

A two piece butterfly hood set up might be simpler though with a center support going from the cowl forward to the radiator shell support frame. You could use a piano hinge on the tops and slick leather buckles on the side to tie back into the 20-30's style.

Hell you are doing great on your own. Don't listen to anything I say.

Looking forward to more.

:thumbup:
 
#104 ·
Flipper_1938 said:
... do you guys think that the top of the hood and cowl should be peaked, curved, or flat down the center?
Scrim is right. Virtually every body panel needs to have some sort of crown or curve to it. Our eyes can play funny tricks on us. An absolutely flat panel will actually appear concave once it is painted...just as Scrim has noted. Also, a panel which might appear absolutely flat to you and me on any factory vehicle, will no doubt have some crown or curve to it. You can test this quite easily be just laying a 3 or 4 foot straight edge over the surface of any panel on a car. There are crowns all over the place that might totally go undetected by the human eye.

And has already been pointed out, curved or crowned panels also resist wind deflection and oil canning better than flat panels as well as being a bit stronger than flat panels. And, well, they just look more "professional" than flat panels. So wherever you can, I would incorporate a crown or curve in your metal work.

Keep up the progress reports. I really appreciate the fact that you are showing us all the "struggle" that goes into building something from scratch like this...and how you have to sort of go in fits and starts. Fabricating one piece only to discover that another completed piece now needs to be altered or totally rebuilt in order make the overall look just right. Or at least just right in the builder's eyes. It can be a frustrating yet exhilarating experience all at the same time and you seem to have the right mental (and metal) attitude for the project.
 
#105 ·
I quickly took a few shots of mine that might give you a few ideas. I think this is what Houston was thinking about.

Notice I have curved both sides of the hood and put a peak in the middle. There is also a curve front to back that is barely noticeable. To give you an idea of the total length the stainless steel hinge that connects the two sides of the hood is 48 inches long. Both sides of the hood and hinge are removable to give good access to the engine bay by undoing one bolt at the front of the hinge.
 

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#106 ·
scrimshaw said:
I quickly took a few shots of mine that might give you a few ideas. I think this is what Houston was thinking about.

Notice I have curved both sides of the hood and put a peak in the middle. There is also a curve front to back that is barely noticeable. To give you an idea of the total length the stainless steel hinge that connects the two sides of the hood is 48 inches long. Both sides of the hood and hinge are removable to give good access to the engine bay by undoing one bolt at the front of the hinge.
It looks like my current cowl shape is close to yours.

Where did you get the BEEFY hinge?
 
#108 ·
Houston54 said:
Hell you are doing great on your own. Don't listen to anything I say.

Looking forward to more.

:thumbup:
I appreciate the ideas and comments. It is hard to find anybody local that I can carry on an actual conversation with about this car. I loose most people with "I cut the roof off of a 1954 Cadillac to build a.....".

"I cut up a 1960 Jaguar..." goes over really well too.

Even die hard car people have problems with not starting with the cowl off of a real car....or a "real frame"

Dad likes what I have done so far, but doesn't make suggestions for the next step. ...and the wife could care less.
 
#115 ·
boatbob2 said:
Hi,theres only one rule that applies when you clean up your garage,anything that you put away today,you will need tommorrow,and you will have to go on a long search for it.because you wont remember where you put it !!! :)

Yep, there are pieces and parts hidden in firetrucks from the last time the shop was cleaned up. The problem is that dad put them there. I don't have a clue which cubby-hole stuff ended up in.

GM stuff is in one, european stuff in one, toyota stuff in one and I don't remember what kind of stuff is in the 38...maybe more GM.

But looking for a single part can be a nightmare.
 
#117 ·
Flipper_1938 said:
It is hard to find anybody local that I can carry on an actual conversation with about this car..... Even die hard car people have problems with not starting with the cowl off of a real car....or a "real frame"
Judging by the number of "looks" this thread has gotten, it appears LOTS of folks are interested in carrying on a conversation about your project. So you are in the right place. And guys like Scrim and New Interiors, with their scratch building experience, can be invaluable when you run into problems or roadblocks. (BTW Scrim, GREAT fitment work on the hood and side panels meeting the grill shell in the pictures above.)

And Flipper is right about even hard core rodders expressing disbelief that a body can actually be built from a pile of rubble. I think a part of that has to do with the long standing misconception that metal fabrication is a mysterious and exotic art form that requires hugely expensive tools and years of training and skills. While there is no doubt that good metal fabricators are in a category all their own, I am convinced that the average hot rodder, using some very basic tools and a little ingenuity, can create a perfectly respectable looking body. And do it within a reasonable period of time and with a reasonable impact on their checkbook.

It may not win a Riddler Award. And if may not even take home a trophy from their little local car show. But it can be a fun, safe, eye catching hoot to own and drive.

And the more examples we have of body fabrication (like this very thread), the more we will see other hot rodders pick up a hammer to take a shot at it themselves. And the more rodders we have experimenting with body fabrication, the more great creations we are going to see emerge.

You will probably never know the exact number of rodders you have influenced and encouraged just by posting up this thread and showing us the real nitty gritty of your work. A dozen. Two dozen. Perhaps even 30 or 40 over time. But just imagine each of them now fabricating the dream car that has been bouncing around in THEIR head. And then THAT car being seen by another 30 or 40 who might pick up the hammer themselves. And on and on it goes.

So keep up your efforts. You're in the right place.
 
#118 ·
Thanks cboy, I know I don’t have to tell you how long that took me and how many tools went flying across the garage in the process! I never would of thought something that looked so straightforward could be so time consuming.

I regret not reading up about how that should be done (if there is such info out there, Ron Covell might be able to help you but for me I wasn't able to find anything about FG hoods)) as it probably cost me a lot of wasted time so for flipper’s sake will write about how I would do it next time. I have no idea if this is the ‘right’ way to do it, I only know it would be better than my first muddled attempt. Hope you can make sense of it all and use some of the info. I wrote this to go in my journal so won’t be offended if you think it’s wrong. You probably know a lot more about this than I do so if you have another way I would be interested in reading about it.

I will write it as I constructed it i.e. using 2 separate pieces and fitting them separately. I know it seems more sensible to make the hood out of 1 piece then cut them out later. The hoods I have seen built in the 20’s and 30’s I do not think were made from one piece (they might even of been made from 4 pieces) – I do not know why, maybe they were too big and unwieldy. Maybe someone else reading this can add something.

First thing is to fix solidly in place the cowl and grill shell so it will never move and resign yourself to not moving it again. I say this because I thought it would be ‘clever’ if I kept the grill movable so I could keep my options open and move the grill to match the hood if necessary. This was a big mistake as there is no way you can move the grill to match the one side without it affecting the other or the top and I ended up chasing my tail for days. Mark out where the hinge will run and the cuts for the side panels on both the shell and the cowl once they are fixed in place and never waver from these points!


Then do the side pieces – make sure you leave enough material so the top edges where the hinge will run overlap each other. Once you have the rough curves done on your pieces then match the cowl curve and the grill shell curve at the same time – back and forth, back and forth a little cut at a time – this was the hardest part for me. My bends where already fixed in the piece but I am assuming you will be bending your panel and fitting it at the same time. You might find it easier (hah!) as mine was fiberglass and the curve is fixed at whatever I made the mold at, you will have some room for maneuver with metal. As I said make sure you make the long edge where you will be putting the center hinge at least an inch wider on both panels so both top pieces overlap each other past the point where the hinge will be going. You might also think about doing this on the very bottom of the panel.

Once you have the front and back curved edges fitting to your satisfaction on the cowl and grill shell make sure everything is clamped tight and make your long cuts (I used a jigsaw with a guide) cutting the overlapped edges at the same time, this ensures a nice straight cut on both sides that will match exactly. I wasn’t worried about the gap the cut produced as the hinge fits it nicely.

Or you could scribe a line and bend your overlapped edges at a 90 degree angle to itself as a place to put the hinge, this will also considerably stiffen the whole panel. This is how the original hand-made hoods that I have seen were done.

Leaving the overlaps on the panels frees you from thinking about the top and bottom edges so you can concentrate on the front and back curves, and then enables you to match the edges exactly once everything else is done.

Pretty straight forward right :)
 
#119 ·
scrimshaw said:
Or you could scribe a line and bend your overlapped edges at a 90 degree angle to itself as a place to put the hinge, this will also considerably stiffen the whole panel. This is how the original hand-made hoods that I have seen were done.
That is also a neat way to hide the fasteners that attach the hinge to the hood panels. Thanks for the idea.
 
#120 ·
1956 Bentleys used 1' square tubing to attach the hinge to, they also had 1 bolt holding the front down. The rear was held down by pulling 2 levers inside of the car, to a latch bracket on the lower sides of the hood.

When my hands are cleaner, I will look through a signed hard copy book, about vintage racing, that was given to me. 'Circle Of Impact' about Bob McCoy. I also think that is a old Bugatti, but I will see if I can verify it.

Flipper :thumbup: Awesome build with great picks, and documentary. Keep it coming.
 
#121 ·
Picked up a pair of 16x4 space saver spares at pull-a-part on Saturday.

The plan is to cut the centers out and convert the outers to be used for use with the wire wheels. I will be converting my 15x5.5 wheels to 16x4.

Going to play with forming the dimples for the spoke nipples using a press. Not sure if I will need to add heat or form it cold.

If it works, these will be the front wheels. I want skinny 18's for the rear wheels.
 
#123 · (Edited)
That car is a piece of art. I can spend an afternoon in an art museum, I am a lover of art. That car could hang in a museum with fine art if you ask me. What a stunningly beautiful example of form meeting function.

The trick is proportions, you can change this or that, you can change that nose, wheels, windshield, etc. But if you change the proportions of wheel to body, body height, length, position of the seating, grille in relation to the axle, etc. that is where you loose it.

That is the biggest reason why cars from scratch or "different" cars like highboy Studebakers and stuff don't "work", the proportions are off.

The 32 Ford or Model A highboy on Duece rails WORK, you just can't screw them up if the proportions stay true. But start moving stuff around and you have a placenta.

The placement of the head lights on a "different" car can be moved an inch one way or the other and you loose it, it can blow the whole car.

Mocking up the car and having it outside to look at it, from every angle is very important. Move things back and forth, don't be afraid of doing something over.

Placement of every line is VERY important.

Brian
 
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