|07-09-2009 01:47 PM|
|deadbodyman||this roof is as bad as I've ever seen....oops this is what happens when you touch bare metal with bare hands (done on porpose)so use gloves and the primer on the side still sticks to bare untreated metal as you can see but just much better treated.the last two pics posted previously are before and after working the roof,(very rusty)the paint for this car runs just under $1,000 if it doesn't last I'm screwed.....but I'm not worried in the least,I've donethis before,(many,many times) the first pic below is a hand print this car is done now,without ospho or epoxy as an experiment.Conclusion:even if you dont treat,etch or use epoxy the job will still be done but will have trouble hitting the five year mark,with ospho and epoxy?who knows twenty years?more?15.00 for ospho 90.00 for SPI epoxy.....for 100.00 who wants to take a chance? Not me......|
|07-09-2009 01:09 PM|
|deadbodyman||Now we ARE off topic Pm me for any additional info but Ospho is phospheric acid,that cleans metal extremly well it dries with a protective coating that wont start rusting inside not even surface rust for media blasting.....bondo wont stick to it!!!!! you must epoxy prime then bondo.....before you epoxy you sand with 80 or 180 just like you would any other coating to assure adheasion.....theres a little more to it but thats basicly it...it also disolves surface rust without any sanding at all and treats rust,neutralizing it.its great for etching bare metal.If enough people want to try it I'll explain my whole proceedure in detail including pics just pm me and I'll start a thread.BE fore warned :its no mirical cure and its a lot of work but in my opinion and with 35 yrs experiance its hands down THE best way to start a major resto project.You guys got nothing to loose and I have everything to loose if its not completely true ........sooooooo.....who wants to give it a go? Get an old hood and PM me.heres some pics to help you make up your minds|
|07-09-2009 12:39 PM|
|AntnyL||What is "ospho" and where does one get it/info on it?|
|07-04-2009 06:36 PM|
|cjperotti||You wouldn't happen to have a link to their tech sheet would you? I had a bad experience with directions on a can. It failed to inform me what the product was not compatible with.|
|07-04-2009 06:20 PM|
|deadbodyman||read the directions first some have trouble|
|07-04-2009 02:27 PM|
|07-04-2009 01:46 PM|
|07-04-2009 01:33 PM|
|07-04-2009 01:25 PM|
|deadbodyman||I dont like etching primer ether its a waste of money as far as I'm concerned,I etch with ospho and scrub it in with a red scotch brite,once you try it you'll feel the same way....but like I say they all work.just some are better.I think Ive done it every possible way there is|
|07-04-2009 08:12 AM|
Great info, thanks guys. I hadn't planned on the EZ Sand step, I thought the high-build primer would take of the 80-grit scratches. Am I wrong to think this? If so, I'll do the EZ Sand. A little more info: I basically skim-coated the entire truck with filler. It had 50+ years work of little dings, dents and deep scratches in the metal. So between that, and all the little body mods I made (rounded the door corners, re-shaped the drip rails, pancaked the hood, etc), I skimmed the entire thing. So does "high build" primer fill 80-grit scratches? I've never used this stuff and am willing to learn. Thanks again guys, you guys are great!
|07-04-2009 02:01 AM|
I guess everyone does things different. I canít stand etching primer. My process is to clean any bare metal by sand blasting it then use PPG metal prep to bring out any impurities. I will follow that with PPG zinc chromate. Two restorations I did in 88 are still in the same condition as when they left my shop 21 years ago. I live in Upstate NY.
I agree with your follow-up in sanding. However, I donít use a DA for feathering glasswork or primer. Feathering old paintwork, yes. As far as putty, I use good old Nitro Stan. Yes, Iím a relic of the past. My methods are old but my career and success has been built on my experience. Itís hard for me to abandon whatís worked best for me over the years.
|07-04-2009 01:21 AM|
|deadbodyman||first I gotta say I'm originaly from saratoga springs,NY and still have family there.This might be the wrong place for this and be conciderd off topic but I'll give ita shot.....I gotta assume you know a little and everything I tell you will be for people just like you.usualy I treat and etch the metal then epoxy prime THEN bodywork but I've done some experiments and know the best way first hand,BUT the only differance is in the jobs longevity so the differances of priming first etching are very minor and ALL procedures work.even 2k primer sticks to unetched metal very well,not that I'd do it but if you did its not that big a deal for you the job will still get done and look good for a few years then you'll find something else and sell it so getting the best materials and useing the best procedures will only cost more and take you more time but since your not a pro the out come will be the same...,Ok? since your there I'll start from there the easiest way to do this is break that big a zz job down to bite size pieces...stand at the drivers headlite you need a system ..walk down the driver side to your first bondo spot...you start here and walk around the truck till you end up in the same spot again...start with polyester finishing putty its like a thin soupy bondo..I like ez sand by evercoat it sands ez and dont clog the paper.. use it for 36-40 & 80 grit scratches use it just like bondo but just a thin coat,cover the whole spot over lapping two or three inches.go down to the next spot,etc ,till you end up back at the lite,again..get a can of semi or flat black spray paint (the cheap stuff)lightly mist a fog coat over the putty(this also works for the bondo)block it lightly with 80 to knock down the high spots till its flat and all the black is sanded off we call this a guide coat it lets you use your eyes to sand since rubbing your hands over it will mostly confuse you but I do this because it makes it faster...then sand everything with 180 da then resand the metal to shine it up .80 is faster..then I 180 the metal but 80 is good enough,the epoxy will easily fill 80 since I've filled 36 grit scratches with it in one of my experiments I can only recomend SPI because its the best (but very inexpencive)the other epoxies I used dont even come close,so if you use something else I dont know if this will work.and the epoxy does stick to bare unetched metal well enough to not worry about adheation. spray a couple very wet coats and let it sit 24 hrs.you can leave it just like that or sand it down again with 180 da and reshoot two or three more coats for a real nice sheen..it'll take time to cure completely but its no concern, its done.Now...if I missed anything or if anyone wants to know why I told you to do something a certain way do speak up, a discussion is good it'll help clairify some foggy points.pros,your input will help too, I dont know ALL the tricks and I can learn something too,plus it'll give my finger a rest. At first I thought this might be off topic but it might be spot on for an example of what we all want to accomplish (a love of the work) I can post some pics if it'll help|
|07-03-2009 08:59 PM|
|cjperotti||I start with 40 grit, then move to 80 grit. then finish with 120 prior to priming.|
|07-03-2009 08:52 PM|
|07-03-2009 08:43 PM|
Nicely done Dbm. I was trying to follow along a few threads looking for tips, but got discouraged after the threads went off on weird tangents. So hopefully this thread will help. I have a question, but first a little background on the subject vehicle; I've stripped my 55.5 Chevy truck down to bare metal, repaired the sheetmetal with welded patch panels, and filled all the areas of known highs/lows with a little filler. I rough sanded everything with 80-grit, and that's where it sits now. I plan to shoot it with epoxy primer, followed by coats of high-build primer to fill the sanding scratches. I do NOT plan, nor want a shiney final finish, just a flat "primer look" since this is a hot rod truck. My simple question is: should I sand with 40-grit prior to shooting the epoxy? Or will the 80-grit be a better base for these primers?
Thanks in advance for your time and advice.
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