|01-10-2013 01:45 PM|
Just to second a previous comment, POR-15 has worded very well for me. I saw a test in Auto Restorer's (?) Magazine, who were as skeptical as I was. They used it (along with some fiberglass matt) on a floor section lacey with rust as a last shot before cutting and welding on a vehicle meant to be a driver. They were amazed afterward that they could bounce on the lacy floor after the POR-15 dried.
I used it on supports on used running boards for my F150 - just wire-brushed the surface rust and applied POR-15 - and it was still shiny with no rust pop-through 3 years later when I sold the truck. I like to prime while the POR-15 is still tacky, beause it dries shiney and is extremely difficult to rough up to offer adhesion for later paint; hard even to scratch with a nail. And, because it is not UV resistant, it should generally be painted. I had a trailer on which I used just POR-15 have the surface deteriorate over 4 years, while the supports under the truck and a brake vacuum booster held up well not exposed to sunlight.
Read the label and follow the warnings. If you close the can without plastic wrap under the cover, you will NOT reopen the can short of destruction. If you keep dipping a brush in the can instead of pouring out what you need, or if you pour left-overs back in the can, the whole can will solidify - looks neat but not useful. Also, I recommend gloves and clothing about which you care little or not at all.
|01-10-2013 07:31 AM|
|funkworx||You'll need to get as much bondo out as possible,ie. all of it. Then you must use a rust converter over the rustout. Use an epoxy primer/sealer, then proceed to finish it.|
|01-10-2013 05:29 AM|
|deadbodyman||SPI epoxy primer is all I use...The best base for any paint..|
|01-09-2013 05:55 PM|
|fasteddy_1947||I like MARTINSR's solution. He is bout right on the leave it along. My 51 was painted 20 years ago. Very good job in that it has basically laste this long, but it is starting to blister on the panel below the trunk lid and at the bottom of the doors. Am in the same situation you are, knee deep into another project. The little blistering of the paint in spots doesn't really distract from it much. I still enjoy driving it everywhere, and still get lots of compliments, even when I point out that it is starting to rust. Its 62 years old and still looking good. When I wash, wax and shine it up I fret over the bad spots, but don't think I'm ever going to get serious about putting any more money into it. Got a tiny ding in the paint years ago, and tried to buff it out, make it disappear. That caused more trouble than if I had just left it alone. If (when) the rust bubbles start to crack and bleed, then I'll have to do something. probably sell it to somebody wants a nice ride and doesn't want to put much work into it.|
|01-09-2013 02:50 PM|
|01-09-2013 08:43 AM|
|RAYFIN||Rust Mort will stop the rust dead in it's tracks. We had a spot on a blazer a year ago that was bare matal and still no rust.|
|01-09-2013 07:54 AM|
[QUOTE=RatPin;1631875]A couple weeks back I picked up a '59 bel air that had a cheap paint job done about 7 years ago (Earl Shieb). It had some blistering at the bottom of the doors and on the rockers. Now keep in mind I bought this car for a driver and I don/t want to dig into it too deep since I am already up to my elbows in another frame up build. I want to do a quick fix on the areas pictures below. Quick fix meaning no cutting or welding, and yes I know it will be just covering it up to a degreea and I'm sure it will rear it's ugly head again at some point down the road, but for now I just want it smooth and protected as best it can be without adding metal and doing it (properly).
Please lend advice as to what you might think would work best to seal this up for as long as possible. I was thinking to just wire it clean from the outside, put some Metal Ready on it and then skim it over with All Metal or similar product.
Again, I know to most and even to me this seems like doing a hack job, but right now I just want to have it smooth and be able to drive it while I finish my other project. I can do it right at a later date when I have the time and shop space to do so.
Just my two cents but once the rust starts, you'll never stiop it.
If I was trying to cover it, I'd indent the area slightly and skim coat it with filler. Because its in the door, you cannot probibly get to the back of it. Sealing the back of it from air and water using undercoating will slow the decay but never stop it.
the key is encapsulating the area from air and moisture. My fix is Not the correct way but will last for a while.
|01-09-2013 05:56 AM|
You really NEED epoxy primer over the bare metal BEFORE any filler I prefer epoxy glue like JB weld to fill the pits....
Ospho does NOT need to be neutralized ,its resistant to water ...
|01-08-2013 09:51 PM|
|RAYFIN||Sand. Apply "Rust-Mort." Bondo. Primer. Paint. (Be careful it's acid and it turn rust to metal.) No kiddin. It works really good.|
|01-08-2013 08:30 PM|
One thing that I believe is better than anything here in the rust belt to keep your car from rusting is to keep it clean. Not just the outside of the body--the underside as well. I run my daily drivers through a car wash that also does the underside about once a week in the winter. I have a 2000 Grand Caravan and the underside looks almost new. My dad never washed his (also a 2000) and the underside was so rusty it was almost unbelievable. He needed to replace his brake lines, rear heat tubes, part of the fuel lines and a gas tank strap. All of mine aren't even rusty.
Keeping the drain holes open is very necessary as well. My first car (1964 GTO) had the rocker panels full of water when I bought it (1975) and when I drained them out it looked like someone filled them with top soil. Fortunately the rockers on those cars were galvanized. (the only part in those days)
|01-08-2013 06:57 PM|
You've gotten a lot of good options. I'll add just one thing that will maybe keep things in check awhile longer. Any place that you can access the area behind those bubble you should take a look and see if you can see any moisture building up or sitting in contact with the metal.
I've seen door bottoms rust out from the weep holes being blocked. I even had a car once that I kept hearing what I thought was gasoline sloshing around in the tank. I eventually had a look around and discovered the passenger door was about 1/4 full of water! A quick inspection showed thw slotted weep holes were plugged and I ran a hacksaw blade in the slot and water poured out for 10 minutes!
Once any areas that hold water are drained, or weep holes are opened, then you can address the inside. Rust neutralizer on the inside once it's dry, will slow the problem down, and allow whatever patch you do to last longer. After neutralizing, you can paint the area with Rustoleum to keep things from rusting again right away.
|01-08-2013 06:30 PM|
Thanks again for the input, although some of these techniques would require just as much time and effort as cutting and welding in new metal, I still appreciate the input.
I think what I am going to try will be:
Expose and clean affected metal on both sides with wire wheel/brush
Clean metal with Metal Ready (similar to ospho)
Wire brush again
Punch in center of heavily pitted spots
Fill those spots with Everglass or Epoxy cement with fiberglass in it, making sure to fill completely
Nub down any riased spots of the glass filler
Lay Glazecoat over entire area and sand to blend
Lay down primer
Lay down paint and blend as best I can
Spray cavity wax to the door's interior panel
Drive it and smile!
One thing that was suggested to me was to use an enamel primer and paint over the cheap Earl Shieb paint. Something like Rustoleum. Any problems with that.
I also have some of this: Metal-2-Metal. Would this product work as well as the everglass or epoxy? I do know the stuff is as hard as nails and does not sand easily. Any money I can save by using stuff I already have will be a plus.
|01-08-2013 05:53 PM|
the key is to get the metal clean and get adhesion.
Hi,Just to add what i have learned in the great white north and tons of salt on the roads around me,plus my dad was in the car business 50 years as well.I will tell what worked for me and what i found that had lasted when i opened spots like this to repair them...the key to a repair like this is to get the rust out,there are many rust treatments that are very good,(look for phosoric acid on the contents list but the key is to neutralize it properly or the filler wont stick).When i view his photos,i see many dark rust spots,i would first grind the area,then use a stainless wheel on a 4 or 5 inch hand grinder,then neutralize.use the wire wheel again.after you think its clean, take a sharpened centre punch and hammer it thru the weak spot.You need to open a hole for the filler material to push thru and solidify in place,while slightly depressing the metal add thickness to help the barrier.(you will see a small *** form that when solid will hold the filler in place.Once these rusty areas have been filled with whatever water resistant filler you favour(canadian spelling..lol) you can use any bondo.You need to create a water barrier that will keep in place so more filler is better than less pushed thru.I have some 30 year old repairs that have not bubbled on cars that have survived even though done in this used car fashion.Fiberglass matt and resin works best but a fiberglass filler is ok as long as it is not bondo with fiberglas bits added.Most bondo's hold moisture and thats what started the problem.I have had good luck with brazing up a small rust hole(the factories brazed them til the 70's).Most prople who condemn brazing simply havent learned to neutralize the acids in it.The easiest way to do that is to leave it open to our air a few days and the flux residue will react to the air itself,though you could help it with some moisture,all this is in addition to a thorough cleaning of your braze joint or spot.I do like the adhesive idea though i havent tried it but they did replace brazing with adhesives in car roof attachment.I have had cars from all over North America and it amazes me what will stay in place stuffed into a rust spot in the west or the praries but will fall out in 6 months in the east, which is my world..lol.may i suggest that you fellows do what i do to keep rust at bay..spray them inside and out with used oil..its cheap and works really well,though for my everyday wheels i use a service that cant by law use oil anymore and has a commercial spray that is just ok..but if for most of these minor rust issues a good shot of oil will keep it from advancing too much,just repeat every year..all the best p.s...i was just thinking that about this,starting with a clean slate as this chap is,i would clean the metal i suggested the use the adhesive like the waterproof filler to seal the hole and place the steel patch overtop as was suggested,its all about a waterproof barrier and that should be very easy to do for a first attempt. again all the best,mark trafford.Mark Trafford :: pure voice
|01-08-2013 02:45 PM|
I have a suggestion, you could clean out the pits completely and cut a thin piece of sheet metal to cover the area (like 24 ga) then bond it on with 3M 08115 Autobond adhesive. Make certain that you cover the whole piece and get some into the holes. Then skim it with filler. If you do it on clean metal it could last the life of the car.
I've used this stuff quite a bit. (steel to steel; fiberglass to steel) I bonded two pieces of 24 ga together and tried to tear them apart and the metal tore around the bonded area without breaking the bond.
I use this to repair rusted 1/4 pnl edges and door skin edges.
|01-08-2013 11:41 AM|
LOL. I have already admitted to more than I am happy about. I'll bet every one of us made up some of our own rules when we were just starting our love affair with the American Hot Rod. With a 14 dollar a week paycheck a quart of Bondo from the Western Auto was extravagant.
By the way, It takes a good metal man to hammer, dolly, and pick a license plate smooth.
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