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Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Transmission - Rearend> Help choosing Transmision and Converter
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Topic Review (Newest First)
02-21-2013 10:18 AM
rick 427 Vinnie...ya have to admit that this initial thread did kinda shift gears at about half track.
02-21-2013 10:04 AM
vinniekq2 Looks like we scared the O P away?Thats not good!
Just to clarify,when I weighed my 1980Z I drove it across the scale and it had a 454 in it with all the factory equipment working.Up here in Canada,especially back in the 70s,almost every car got dealer installed under coating.It was a thick tar.Most racers,especially the super stock and stock guys,spent many hours removing the crap. Another thing not often mentioned,repainted cars that just get a scratch and blast,usuallt gain 40 pounds plus or minus.
02-21-2013 07:12 AM
gearheadslife
Quote:
Originally Posted by painted jester View Post
Im stating they weren't pigs!

I'd like to see a 40 Lb. console

In the 70s optional class rules were you couldn't run a car older then 3 yrs so we bought base line no option cars every 3 yrs. not even radios and put the drive trains and engines in from our older race cars!

Anyway your statment "2nd gens are pigs" you didn't state with all options or if they were 6s or 8s and you rolled all 2nd generation into one big bag

The consoles are 10LBS for a stick 14 auto

RPO Description Weight Factor
C08 Exterior vinyl roof +8
C60 Air Conditioning +112
D55 Floor Console (+10 /w 4speed, +14 w/Automatic)
J50 Power Brakes +10 g.m. boosteers are 15 lb + related junk just put my 71 booster on the scale)
N40 Power Steering +29 the power box/lines/pump + fluid is more than 29 lbs maybe 29 dry
U63 Radio AM Pushbutton +8
U69 Radio AM/FM Pushbutton +8
Z87 Deluxe Interior +28
Z22 Rally Sport Package +27

These are the only additions to delivered curb weight about 200 lbs ad that to base v8 weight of 3172 including full gas tank and all fluids it still only comes to around 3400 # ,


350 V8 engine +56 (+68 w/automatic)Available as "Z28" equipment only - includes additional body and chassis equipment.
But subtract the 27 from above rally pac and its +41
inpact laws added tons of weight between your 70's b/s numbers and the real cars weight, nevermind the extra's like frame connectors, caltracts(spabber bars) later cars interior lighting/etc) I've raced 3 2nd gens I know what they lb at.. at dragways with legal scales.. those are the #'s that count
Jester
my 1980 firebird.. was 3900 lb's stock
after removing the console/ carpet/side crash door reinforcements/rear seat/mini spare/jack/ a/c/radio/ ligher than stock wheels (centerline convo pros)/ 400/th350/ ten bolt/
new england dragway and the local metal scale said 3378 lb
the 77 camaro isn't any lighter
to get to 3200 I had to remover factory tank and add a 5gal cell. remove inner bumper supports front/rear...
to get to 3045 lb the door glass and rear window left the building..
real world is different than paper #'s

then add 250-300 lb for cage as you now are fast enough to require it and more.. chromemoly will be a tad less, but today they require more bars so it be a wash
02-21-2013 01:15 AM
painted jester
Quote:
Originally Posted by gearheadslife View Post
ya, base 6cyl no ac no nothing

add console 40lb
add v8 add p/s
add p/b
add a/c add tilt etc etc most are 3800 +

Im stating they weren't pigs!

I'd like to see a 40 Lb. console

In the 70s optional class rules were you couldn't run a car older then 3 yrs so we bought base line no option cars every 3 yrs. not even radios and put the drive trains and engines in from our older race cars!

Anyway your statment "2nd gens are pigs" you didn't state with all options or if they were 6s or 8s and you rolled all 2nd generation into one big bag

The consoles are 10LBS for a stick 14 auto

RPO Description Weight Factor
C08 Exterior vinyl roof +8
C60 Air Conditioning +112
D55 Floor Console (+10 /w 4speed, +14 w/Automatic)
J50 Power Brakes +10
N40 Power Steering +29
U63 Radio AM Pushbutton +8
U69 Radio AM/FM Pushbutton +8
Z87 Deluxe Interior +28
Z22 Rally Sport Package +27

These are the only additions to delivered curb weight about 200 lbs ad that to base v8 weight of 3172 including full gas tank and all fluids it still only comes to around 3400 # ,


350 V8 engine +56 (+68 w/automatic)Available as "Z28" equipment only - includes additional body and chassis equipment.
But subtract the 27 from above rally pac and its +41

Jester
02-21-2013 12:46 AM
F-BIRD'88 If it don't make you go, stop or steer, remove it.

If its a genuine B&M hole shot 3600 10" converter and not used up, or full of broken trany guts, its a good deal for $100.
if it came out of a broken trans pass on it. (unless you are willing to cut it open and service it)
This is the converter I use in my car 1.60 60ft.

Not all Blue converters are a B&M. This is the most copy cat ed knocked off converter on the market.
There are many cheap imposters sold as a B&M.

I have used this same converter in many cars before. It always works well.
You need some 4.56's for this slug. You can easily buzz that engine past 6000rpm.
Do not use a 3.73 for bracket racing with a 350. Do not combine a 4500 stall with 3.73's.
4.56's minimum for that car with a 350SBC. Make sure the slicks are not too tall.
no taller than 28" a 9x26" slick is fine.
If you do go for the 4500 stall race converter, you can get a bigger camshaft too.
that is a girlie cam. (hyd roller)

That car is about 3650 with a SBC and driver. They are much heavy er than a 1970 Camaro. Get some traction bars too.
every 100 lbs you take out makes it 1/10th second quicker.
02-21-2013 12:31 AM
gearheadslife
Quote:
Originally Posted by painted jester View Post
2nd gens are pigs

1970 Camaro
Base Engine curb Weight 6 cylinder 3058, V8 3172


77 Camaro V8 3600

ya, base 6cyl no ac no nothing

add console 40lb
add v8 add p/s
add p/b
add a/c add tilt etc etc most are 3800 +
02-21-2013 12:27 AM
painted jester 2nd gens are pigs

1970 Camaro
Base Engine curb Weight 6 cylinder 3058, V8 3172


77 Camaro V8 3600
02-20-2013 11:49 PM
vinniekq2
weight

Quote:
Originally Posted by gearheadslife View Post
2nd gens are pigs,, you might (if your lucky and have alot of fiberglass) be at 3200 now..
they stock are normally 3700-4100+ lb curb weight..
my 1980 Z weighed 3915,very heavy.Thats what the track scale at Mission raceway said
02-20-2013 10:40 PM
gearheadslife 2nd gens are pigs,, you might (if your lucky and have alot of fiberglass) be at 3200 now..
they stock are normally 3700-4100+ lb curb weight..
02-20-2013 10:36 PM
vinniekq2 read what I said about redline of engine.not peak torque of engine.You dont want to run out of RPM before converter is as close to locked as you can get. Race converters are more expensive than street converters too. The 3500 would work,its just not a race converter.
you are getting close and I look forward to you posting a video of test and tune
02-20-2013 10:18 PM
Rod Breaker
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinniekq2 View Post
3600 rpm converter is a street converter,not a race converter.
go race a season and learn,next year you will see things differently

Alright well after reviewing as many dyno graphs that are similar to my engine I have the peak torque is right around 4500 and as I have read a converter should be matched to that. So I guess a 4500 would be the best route since it is a bracket car only. The freak show (4500 9.5") and rev max(4500 9.5")are around my price range so I will look into those then
02-20-2013 09:30 PM
vinniekq2 3600 rpm converter is a street converter,not a race converter.
go race a season and learn,next year you will see things differently
02-20-2013 08:54 PM
Rod Breaker Thanks for all the input everyone. So I am going to run the TH350 And I have the opportunity of getting a B&M 3600 converter off a buddy for $100 bucks so I think ill bite on it.

I just said I am going to rev it to 6k because I just rebuilt the bottom end with a GM cast crank and rods and hypereutectic pistons and heard im pushing it going anymore. Don't worry I am budgeting for a better bottom end
02-20-2013 08:13 PM
F-BIRD'88 Use the th350. Forget the trans brake idea. Get a 9" to 10" race converter with not less than a 3500 stall speed. Get some 4.56's. You can rev it higher than 6000rpm.
02-20-2013 05:26 PM
vinniekq2 a "RACE" converter is 2000-2500 rpm under your redline. IE: an engine that peaks at 7k will have a 48-5k converter.
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