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53 Belair conv rust repair

1M views 6K replies 111 participants last post by  Eduramac 
#1 ·
I just brought home a 1953 Chevy convertible Monday that is 100% there. 100% there except for the bottom 6 inches that is. I have always built rusty cars no one else wanted but have tried to do a quality job of repairing them on a budget.

The key wordhere is budget. I admit to being frugal but friends all say I am cheap. Whatever, for me to be able to enjoy this hobby I must be able to build the car and have my money invested, not just spent

The cost of replacement floor pans, floor braces, inner rockers, outer rockers, lower quarter panels, tow boards, trunk pan, rear pan extension, tail pan, and rear splash apron is well over 3000 dollars. That is money that will buy front suspension, rear axle, and good buildable engine. Maybe even a complete parts car.

I have basic sheet metal tools but nothing exotic. Small 3' brake, Shrinker/stretcher jaws, home made slip roll, and a home made english wheel and 110v mig welder.

My purpose here is to show the new hot rodder who is apprehensive about what he can do what is possible with a little time and patience and not much money.

Below is the patient. She has stage four cancer but we are going to try to save her. If we don't who will? :mwink:








So far I have stripped the inside, removed the front fenders and adjusted the doors. If the body shifts or moves during the build process I want to know it before everything gets welded together. Frequently checking door gaps will let me make sure it has not moved.




Tomorrow I plan to cut the toe boards loose from the front floor brace and expose the brace. The first job will be to remove the brace and reproduce it.

I hope you guys follow along and feel free to comment share thoughts, opinions, etc.

 
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#286 ·
I'm not talking "insurance companies" who you do work FOR, I am talking the one you have to pay to protect your work! It's called "Completed Operations" insurance and when you are in business you need things like that to survive.

Brian
 
#288 ·
I normally refer to myself as a hobbyist. In about 1991 I found myself unemployed when Uncle Sam busted up the telephone Co. I had several people ask me to do work for them and I did exactly what you are referring to Henry. I kept my "shop" open about 7 months before I decided to go find a job.

I never had a day that I did not have work in the shop. The work is there.

I never got cheated exept one time and that was by a "friend" and it was only about 125 dollars.

I was absolutely miserable. I would lay awake at night and wonder how I was going to justify the time I had in a gas tank door in a 1955 ford truck cab or something like that. After all I was the one that had to go to the salvedge yard to find a hinge etc.

Also, when tax time rolled around I was going to have some explaining to do because I had no business license, had no way to collect or pay sales tax and had no W2 form to show any form of income. I told my wife I had to get a business license, insurance, etc or a job. It was obvious I could have a full time career or a hobby. I chose hobby.

I can promise you that if you do go on your own the work will be there. You are a true craftsman.

I can also promise you will have more pressure on you than you ever dreamed of. With a wife and children you will either have to go full steam ahead with all the responaibilities of a business owner or be employed at some level. There will be no middle of the road, long term.

These brackets I am making are taking between 5 and 8 hours with the tools I have. Each of them can be bought from EMS for 79.95. You can do the math. The only reason I am making them instead of buying them is I have more time than money and thought there may be some members here that would get a kick out of seeing what could be done on a tight budget with a few tools.

John
 
#292 ·
These brackets I am making are taking between 5 and 8 hours with the tools I have. Each of them can be bought from EMS for 79.95. You can do the math. The only reason I am making them instead of buying them is I have more time than money and thought there may be some members here that would get a kick out of seeing what could be done on a tight budget with a few tools.

John
I am truly glad you decided to make them, and share the process with us John! Every time I open these posts and see the latest piece you've built, I can't help but smile. They really are too nice to paint, or hide under a car!
 
#294 ·
a mobile license is the ticket. Those vultures don't need to know about any warehouse. I did that before and made decent money. Had no problems. They obviously didn't know I was doing more than a parking lot ding but screw em. I paid them and even got fingerprinted as part of the process.
 
#295 ·
That makes sense Henry. I had a friend in Vancouver that made good money with a mobile paintless dent repair business.

I knew the cowl mount had some rust in it but did not realize it is as bad as it is. I intended to fix it when I took the body off the frame but I am afraid to wait. I can't take a chance of it sagging so I have started to repair it.

The mount has to be trimmed to put a V8 in the car anyway. I am going to make it a little oversize so I can move the inside bolt and run it through the frame rail. That will open up some room for exhaust. I am also making it out of 12 gauge so we don't loose any strength.

John







 
#296 ·
Just a idea for you... When you remake the cowl mount.. Make one that run's straite down from the cowl to the frame.. It doesn't have to stick way forward like it does.. It just needs to support the cowl weight... I took the cowl mounts off my 57 chevy... I would just make a nice smaller one running straite down... Your car, You do what you want too,, It's just a idea for you to think about.. Plus it will clean it up a little..;)

I also cut a lot off this 57 cowl mount and boxed the front in for a better look.. this mount went all the way up the firewall,,,Made a hole in the back side to get to the bolt..

The black one was my 57 I ran without cowl mount's..
 

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#297 ·
That really does look great Randy. One thing I have to consider is this being a convertible the front mount actually tries to lift up when you open the door. Since there is no top to reinforce it the mount behind the A Pillar and this one support the entire cowl. There has to be a front cowl mount and it has to be pretty stout. The alignment of the doors depend on these 2 mounts.

John.
 
#301 ·
Today I finally got back to the basement and was able to finish the driver's side cowl mount. Next I need to finish the toe board, floor board, A pillar mount assembly like I did the passenger side and build the inner rocker.

It is good to be back to work on the old girl.

John



I narrowed the mount to make room for the V8 engine. I am going to run a bolt through the frame rail. You can see I have provided a hole in the new mount for it.



 
#302 ·
John, you are a true craftsman, it is truly amazing the work you do...I remember your post when you mentioned to Kelly from "Carolinacustoms" that you wouldn't want a shop to pay you by the hour, they couldn't afford it...or something to that effect. Well, let me tell you, I would sooner pay more to get things done the way you do it than pay less and have something that looks like it doesn't belong there. Thank God, the owners of the 2 vehicles I'm working on now agree

If you say your not fast, I can appreciate that, I'm not the quickest either...if your anything like myself, you spend as much time, or more thinking it through as you do making the piece. Maybe we should get Randy to give us lessons on how to pick up our speed, the guy is fast and in talking to him, I know he does a lot of thinking as well...LOL. I'd sign up.

Great build John, I'm not always posting but I'm always watching...with eyes wide open.

Ray
 
#303 ·
Thanks a lot Ray. A friend told me a few days ago I could use his rotiserie. That is exciting because this thing will sure have to come off the frame.

It is a real motivator to work on the car knowing there are a few guys who are really interested and watching.

So far I have spent 75 dollars for metal, 24 dollars for Argon and about 40 dollars for bolts and abrasives. That makes it pretty cheap recreation. That does not include my plasma cutter though. Tools don't count do they? :mwink:

John
 
#304 ·
Made the bottom of the drivers toe board today. I only need about 1 1/4 inches above the crease. When I trim it to install It I will be able to do the final tweaking.

I hope someone is interested in how this piece was done.

First the flange has to be gently formed. Since it is a curved flange it can be done with a tipping die in a bead roller or with a flat anvil in an English Wheel as I did. Since this is a floor board you could get away using pliers and/or a vice and just take your time but it would not come out as nice.

Any time you tip a flange on a curve it will distort the metal so you must shrink or stretch the flange to keep the piece straight.



Once you have the flange worked into a 90 degree brake you will have to use a vice to form the backward bend. There is no way this piece is going ti fit in a straight brake.



Here is a view that clearly shows the purpose for this offset. It matches the curve of the body mount so the floor board will fit tightly and curve down and around the body mount at the A pillar.

I believe these pieces will fit nicely.

John



 
#305 ·
Made the bottom of the drivers toe board today. I only need about 1 1/4 inches above the crease. When I trim it to install It I will be able to do the final tweaking.

I hope someone is interested in how this piece was done.

First the flange has to be gently formed. Since it is a curved flange it can be done with a tipping die in a bead roller or with a flat anvil in an English Wheel as I did. Since this is a floor board you could get away using pliers and/or a vice and just take your time but it would not come out as nice.

Any time you tip a flange on a curve it will distort the metal so you must shrink or stretch the flange to keep the piece straight.

Once you have the flange worked into a 90 degree brake you will have to use a vice to form the backward bend. There is no way this piece is going ti fit in a straight brake.

Here is a view that clearly shows the purpose for this offset. It matches the curve of the body mount so the floor board will fit tightly and curve down and around the body mount at the A pillar.

I believe these pieces will fit nicely.

John

As I mentioned John, there is a lot of thought that needs to go into making parts/pieces for a job such as this. Knowing how metal reacts when using different pieces of equipment is also key.

I always learn things when I read your posts and see what the parts look like when your done.

I Thank You for that.

Ray
 
#308 ·
Cost of tools is NEVER included in the cost of restoration. In fact, it can be easily justified and written off; if you had paid a shop to do the work, you would be looking at 25-30k. The cost of the plasma is minuscule compared to that...:cool: Heck, with that example to show your wife, you've got many thousands more to use on parts and tools...:D

You just keep doing what you're doing and I'll keep watching and learning. I REALLY need a pair of stretchers...:drool:
 
#310 ·
This really is a great thread Brian. As I said before, I may not be posting a lot, but I'm still following very closely. There's all kind of tips that I've picked up from John and this build and here's a lot to be said for a person like John that takes the time to explain in vivid yet humble detail.

John mentioned earlier how great a site this is, this thread and the person that started it are examples why.

Ray
 
#311 ·
John, not been on here much as I have 1000 of hours trying to change MSDS sheets to the new required GHS format due by Jan 1.
Over the years I have seen the best metal fabricators in the world at the annual "Metal Meet" but none of them have anything on you, I agree as posted this is one of the best threads on here and you make it look so simple, I almost think I could do it but then I come to my senses.

GREAT job
Barry
 
#312 ·
this is all amazing work. John is entirely too humble, almost to the point of selling himself short. Some of you may remember my thread quite a while ago with the horribly puckered quarter skin butt weld going down the entire quarter on my car. I had good intentions that were executed poorly and it was in a bad state. I talked with John quite a bit on that one and he helped me form the plan and gave me the motivation and encouragement that I could get it corrected, and I'll be damned if I didn't get it fixed. He's kind of like the kind old grandpa who you wish was your neighbor, though he'd never get his own projects done because he'd always be over helping you with yours.
 
#314 ·
Kindly Old Grandpa?......:) Josh, as with most things from Eastwood, the quality looks like it would work but the price is not a bargain. The wheel at 500 dollars is high when you realize it only comes with one lower anvil wheel. The other 4 you need come as a set and are 139 dollars. Now you have almost 650 dollars in a machine that is still a hobbyist quality. I think you would enjoy having one but would shop around to see where you could get the most value for you buck.

In the video the fellow says it will shrink metal. Not true. That is the problem with most metal working equipment. It stretches but doesn't shrink. The problem is who has 10,000 dollars for a power hammer that will shrink.

John
 
#315 ·
OK then! I'm just going to go back into my little mouse hole now :D

I don't think the world needs to see anything I'd attempt with an English wheel. However, I will say my MIG welder from Eastwood was $299, comparable on every level to similar Lincoln and Miller 110V welders...same warranty, it does have infinitely adjustable controls. THAT was a really great buy for me, it's been such a great piece of equipment. Most of Eastwood's stuff...no thanks. I kid you not, it's the SAME stuff Harbor Freight sells, but at 3 times the price. Compare their welder carts, for instance.

You know, 60's is the new 50's though. 60's sounds older to me, but my father in law is 65...he doesn't seem that old to me at all. So now I just have to think of John like my father in law and that means you're not quite at kindly old Grandpa just yet....sorry to disappoint ;)
 
#316 ·
Today was the day I was going to install the drivers side toe board but that is not how it worked out. I hot wrenched the bolt out for the accelerator pedal and here is what I found.

Not a big deal but another 2-3 hours fooling with a little patch that doesn't really amount to much. It is ready to tack in but I had to make a decision.....Go ahead and tack it in or take a shower and drive the roadster over to the cruise in at the Sonic. Yea, the shower felt good. :D:):mwink::thumbup:

John




 
#318 ·
Yesterday I did just the opposite. I was all ready to go to a show with the Gran Sport and decided not to and got a little done. But damn it's hard, relaxing is really what we should be doing but I had Saturday so I went ahead and put a little time in on the truck.

It's looking good John!

Brian
 
#321 ·
Got back to the shop for a very short time this evening. The three pieces that make up the front corner of the drivers side floorboard and body mount are now one assembly.

I plug welded everything together to hide the welds.





You can see how much this will look like they are spot welded when the car is painted.



This assembly is almost ready to weld in but still needs to be tweaked a bit to fit correctly. I don't think it is going to be a big deal though.

 
#322 ·
John, you need to take back what you said about not getting much done...compared to me, well I laid two more coats of primmer in a hood...took me almost 6 hours...LOL. Well at least I gave plenty of flash time. That's what happens when you watch TV, answer a few PM's and answer a few questions on the forum. I like watching early morning TV on Saturday, even though it was repeats and not very motivational...I'm a sucker for old TV Series Westerns, two of my favorite episodes and well there's your flash time...LOL

Things you did today was again, amazing...I'm sure anyone that will see your Chevy when your done John, no one will ever know it had any rust repair, your quality speaks for itself.

Ray
 
#323 ·
STILL NO PRIMER?????LOL......
John your at a point where I might be able to save you some time and money..If you already know this then disregaurd...
I noticed you used a weld thru primer on the inside of your mount before welding ,well it looks like weld thru but That stuff is super expensive and you'll need a lot of it so when I need a weld thru primer I use cold galvivizing compound from krylon you can get it for around 6.00 a can and its a BIG can insted of paying about 20.00 a can..One of the bodymen I hired told me it was the same stuff and to get some and try it (in one ear and out the other)
well...he brought some of his own in and showed me and I couldnt believe it.it works good.
.ok, theres the saving money part and this may save you some time and agravation...
When I did this on my car, which wasnt a vert, btw... my cowl had dropped when it did of coarese the front A pillars spread apart a bit and the B pillars spread also spread out from each other alsonot onlt That the A& B pillar on both sides spread ,requiring me to pull them closer together. When I shut the door to ckeck the gaps the bottom of the door stuck out about a 1/2" with everything adjusted as far in as possable and about a 1/2" gap at the bottom,I was half expecting this so I had used drill screws to hold everythig in place...I had to jack up the cowl to get the door aligned what saved a lot of time is all I had to do was remove a couple screws, jack it up and in ;and tweak it and put the screws in they're new posistion and try the fit again.I see a lot of guys skip this check and weld as they go only to find out it was off a bit and have to take all the welds out and do it over or worse live with it. drill screws are a life saver.... I just thought I'd bring that up, if not for you then someone thats doing something similar....
 
#324 ·
Both suggestions are excellent Mike. Thanks for sharing. You are correct about the weld-thru primer. I really wanted to prime the inner pieces with Epoxy but there are just so many things you could do. The line has to be drawn somewhere. I believe the cold galvanizing compound might be the perfect compromize. Thanks again.

One of the advantages a convertible has is the front is not attached to the rear so I can raise or lower the cowl without effecting the rear body shell. I do wish I had temp screwed the toe board patch to this assembly. Once I had just where I wanted it I could have tack welded it, taken it back out, permenantly welded and installed it. Again your suggestion would have worked for me. down the road, as the project continues I will do that.

Ain't this site cool?:thumbup:

John
 
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