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Topic Review (Newest First)
11-26-2005 08:49 PM
Jon
Added to Hotrodders Knowledge Base

This discussion has been added to the Garage - Tools Discussions category of the Hotrodders Knowledge Base.

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05-29-2005 05:26 AM
grouch
re: PVC pipe for compressed air

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin45
This is a topic that has come up numerous times and prety much seems to be a no win on either side. I have ALWAYS heard plastic piping is a no no. I have read where plastic has shattered sending sharp fragments in every direction. Now whether the temperature has anything to do with it I don't know but would thing it a factor. Especially considering that you are going from inside to outside back to inside. If you do not want to bite the bullet and replace everything right now, I would at least replace your drops with something more substantial. That way if it (and it may not) decides to go it will be shielded from human contact. Then you could replace what went bad. But what you have running up one wall and down the other I would replace just for the safety aspect.

Kevin
I think you heard right. From http://www.osha.gov/dts/hib/hib_data/hib19880520.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by OSHA
SUBJECT: Safety Hazard Information Bulletin on
the Use of Polyvinyl Chloride (PVC) Pipe
in Above ground Installations


The Dallas Regional Office has brought to our attention a potential serious hazard existing with the use of polyvinyl chloride (PVC) plastic pipes for transporting compressed gases in above ground installations. An employee in a Texas plant was injured recently by a rupture in a PVC compressed air line. Plastic projectiles from the point of rupture caused lacerations of the employee's hand. This is noteworthy because the Plastic Pipe Institute, in its Recommendation B dated January 19, 1972, recommends against the use of thermoplastic pipe to transport compressed air or other compressed gases in exposed plant piping. (See attachment.)

Furthermore, sections 842.32, 842.43 and 849.52(b) of the American National Standards Institute/American Society of Mechanical Engineers (ANSI/ASME) B31.8-1986, Gas Transmission and Distribution Piping Systems Standard, limit the operating pressure of plastic piping distribution systems to 100 pounds per inch (psi) and prohibit the installation of such systems above ground except where ". . . the above ground portion of the plastic service line is completely enclosed in a conduit or casing of sufficient strength to provide protection from external damage and deterioration." (Excerpts attached.)

Additional consensus standards applicable to PVC compressed gas systems include American Society for Testing Materials (ASTM) D1785-86, Standard Specification for Polyvinyl Chloride Plastic Pipe, Schedules 40, 80, and 120, and ASTM D2513-86a, Standard Specification for Thermoplastic Gas Pressure Piping Systems.
There is a lot more information at that URL. It all boils down to "prohibited", though.

BTW, shouldn't this thread be a "sticky" in the Garage forum?
03-17-2005 02:42 PM
Rob Keller
safety

well technically i don't have a garage yet but Ive got more safety proceedures than i could possibly list being tuff could cost you big time!!!
the right tool for the job always . think the job all the way through (or as far as you can) organization and procedures will help (a place for every thing & every things in a place) time don't rush .
well i pretty much work alone because i have so many procedures but im not superman i cant to everything by my self (although i try to)
be safe & good luck
slowride 66
03-12-2005 10:35 AM
ChevelleSS_LS6
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldred
428- Believe me I know what you are talking about and these guys who think they are superman had better listen now as they may not be able to "listen" to ANYTHING a lot sooner than they think. Guys just try and imagine a terrible ringing in your ears that you will take to your grave. If you hear even a slight ringing or a sound sort of like crickets now when you are in in a quite room then you are already well on your way. You may think my description is funny right now but when you start to hear these sounds over top of everyday noise and find that you have trouble understanding what people are saying to you it will become VERY serious to you but you wont be able to do a damn thing to cure it. THE TIME IS NOW! A loud stereo may seem "cool" to you but I guarantee a hearing aid wont!
Just as oldschoolrods said, thank you. I don't have a boom-boom bling-bling system in my car, just a factory cd player... but when I took classes in auto body we didn't use earplugs, that noise drove me seriously nuts. EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEWWW!!!!!!!!!! the grinding was like... most of the other guys didn't use gloves, I didn't want to kill my hand so I used gloves, but, dang it, they needed face shields too. I think the only thing where they were really as safe as possible was regarding paint.

In the autobody class, I had a habit of also wearing a face mask; the kind that look like a white bowl that covers the nose/mouth whenever I was out in the shop area to keep bondo dust out of my system , and I was teased that "the mask kept me from sucking their (I cannot fininsh this but you guys get the point)" . Oddly enough I had a girlfriend at the time . I showed them pics and they were like "oh man that's your sister".

When I went to the teachers about it, they'd just talk to the offending peoples, and do nothing about it. After a semester of encountering these people every day, I ended up getting into a fight with one of those jerks who shot me "accidentally" with a power washer. They transferred me to accounting.

A couple of guys in that class were pretty cool though.
03-12-2005 09:07 AM
OneMoreTime
H'mm

I have on occasion recommended steel pipe for compressor piping and got yelled at because of that..as far as I know it is a code requirement for compressed air lines..It is kinda interesting as to how some try to do something else and get into trouble with it..

Anyway I am sticking with the tried and true in my shop..

I am also usign the industrial type full face shield for grinding and such..I have found the real industrial shields to be comfortable and EZ to use..

OMT
03-12-2005 04:20 AM
Kevin45 This is a topic that has come up numerous times and prety much seems to be a no win on either side. I have ALWAYS heard plastic piping is a no no. I have read where plastic has shattered sending sharp fragments in every direction. Now whether the temperature has anything to do with it I don't know but would thing it a factor. Especially considering that you are going from inside to outside back to inside. If you do not want to bite the bullet and replace everything right now, I would at least replace your drops with something more substantial. That way if it (and it may not) decides to go it will be shielded from human contact. Then you could replace what went bad. But what you have running up one wall and down the other I would replace just for the safety aspect.

Kevin
03-09-2005 06:57 AM
pontiac owner
air pipe

Bite the bullet, tear out the plastic pipe and use proper steel or copper pipe like you should have used the first time. Whast the heck kind of engineer told you to use PVC? One of the first things they tell you in any engineering curriculum is that different fluids have different requirements for safe transport, storaage, and use.
03-08-2005 07:14 PM
roger1
OK, I screwed up. What do I do now???

I used PVC to for my compressed air distribution. I did it because I didn't know it was a bad thing (and potentially dangerous) at the time. I am kicking myself for not researching the correct products to use before I did the job. I usually research everything thoroughly but I blew it on this one. I trusted advice I got from an unknowing engineer. I wished I had used copper as that seems to be the way to go.

Here's what I did:

I had a detached garage built to house the everyday driver cars and used my already existing garage for my workshop. I had the new garage connected with my workshop via a covered breezeway.

Here's a picture:
http://hotrodders.com/gallery/data/3...rage2.jpg?5305

The new garage is on the right and my workshop is on the left.
To keep the noise and heat out of my workshop, I put my 5 horse 80 gallon compressor in the new garage and routed the 3/4" PVC through the breezeway (during construction) into the attac over the workshop and down 2 opposite walls inside the shop.
Pictures:
http://home.austin.rr.com/lt1/Blaster.jpg
http://home.austin.rr.com/lt1/Bench.jpg

What do I do now?
Just leave it and not worry about it?
Or, should I just replace the downpipes that are in the workshop? I could also replace the pipe from the compressor to the entrance of the breezeway in the new garage. That would have all the exposed areas converted to copper pipe.
It would be major job now to replace the whole line!
Should I bite the bullet and replace all of it?

I am not having much problem with water in the line but I am interested in safety.

Advice will be appreciated.

Roger
02-18-2005 03:36 PM
tyrol-paul i guess, that's a nice one

try to switch off the battery charging unit before you unplug the battery...

if not, it may go *boooom*... then you know that there was some hydrogen.


i've to admit that i've never thought about that, a buddy told me that a few days ago....
02-10-2005 02:08 AM
Kevin45 C'mon people...lets add some safety issues to this thread.
01-25-2005 06:31 PM
oldschoolrods oldred thank you for posting that, I see now that I could stand to change a few of my ways, although I've only ever grinded without ear protection a few times, the time that made me change was when wire wheeling a trailer hitch, from then on I stuffed some cotton balls in my ears to deaden the sound. But thanks for the info to remind me to always protect the ears.
01-24-2005 08:09 AM
oldred 428- Believe me I know what you are talking about and these guys who think they are superman had better listen now as they may not be able to "listen" to ANYTHING a lot sooner than they think. Guys just try and imagine a terrible ringing in your ears that you will take to your grave. If you hear even a slight ringing or a sound sort of like crickets now when you are in in a quite room then you are already well on your way. You may think my description is funny right now but when you start to hear these sounds over top of everyday noise and find that you have trouble understanding what people are saying to you it will become VERY serious to you but you wont be able to do a damn thing to cure it. THE TIME IS NOW! A loud stereo may seem "cool" to you but I guarantee a hearing aid wont!
01-24-2005 07:36 AM
428ho [Also don't forget ear protection as tinnitus(a constant ringing in the ears that will never go away)is the result of exposure to noise.]

Rock concerts, drag racing and working in a weave room fixing looms when I was young did that to me. I have to wonder what will happen to these kids that have the Thump Thump stereos in their cars now.
I now wear plugs AND headphones doing some task's. Especially grinding sheet metal and tubing ends when you get that high pitch. Wish I knew then...

True story, went to see Skynyrd and ZZ Top not long ago, as they were wanding everyone to enter (times have changed) the door guy wanted to know what was in my pockets. "Ear plugs my man, I'm getting old" He just laughed and passed us on in.
01-21-2005 04:58 PM
oldred This is the kind of post that really gets my attention. I have worked in the mining industry for 30+ years and I have unfortunately seen MANY accidents, most of them in the repair shop. Even if we were working on mining equipment the tools are the same and the injuries would be just as bad in a home shop. Always wear a respirator when grinding no matter what the material and eye protection is a no-brainer. Also don't forget ear protection as tinnitus(a constant ringing in the ears that will never go away)is the result of exposure to noise. Eye protection,respirator and ear plugs are the most important tools in your garage. I wish that I had listened 30 years ago but maybe I can convince someone else before it is to late for them. To all you young guys, PLEASE LISTEN YOU ARE NOT SUPERMAN IT CAN HAPPEN TO YOU!
01-21-2005 08:44 AM
Leen Keep your knives, chisels, drills, etc. sharp. You have much better control over your tools when they are sharp.
You must use a lot of arm power when using blunt tools, which means it will also slip away (hope that is correct English ) with a lot of power into......your leg , just finished parts...

Leen
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