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What would it take...

3K views 23 replies 10 participants last post by  53LEDSLED 
#1 ·
Im just wondering what it would take to make a 3500 lb car run a flat 12? currently im a high 13 and im seeing what else i can do. I just put in a new 350 and a built 200-4r. This is my daily driver so no huge cams or anything....the current specs are as follows...

-350 2 bolt main bored .040 (357ci)
-All ARP fasteners
-Holley 600 cfm rejetted (#70 up front, #74 in the back)
-Holley High Flow Fuel Pump (mechanical)
-Edelbrock Performer Air Gap Intake
-Accel High Output Distributor
-MSD 8.5 Race Tailored Plug Wires
-Summit Aluminum 1.5 Roller Rockers
-Dart 64cc Iron Eagle Heads
-Stainless Steel 2.05 intake and 1.60 exhaust valves
-Keith Black Flat Top Pistons
-10.5:1 Compression Ratio
-Cast Crank and Rods
-Comp 274XE Cam (.490 lift 236 duration)
-Clevite Bearings
-Double Roller Timing Chain
-Hedman Headers
-2.5" Dual Exhaust with no catalytic converters and Flowmaster 40 Series mufflers.
-Richmond 3.73 Rear end ratio
-Eaton Posi Differential
-Built 200-4R Transmission
-2500 stall
-Griffin 4 Core Aluminum Radiator
-B&M Transmission Cooler
-B&M Ratchet Shifter
-Front and Rear Sway bars

I know for sure that carb is killin me, so i want to throw a 750 edelbrock on it...im just really wondering how much of a difference it will make

Today i put 1.6 rockers on my intake, so now its a .520 on the intake side.

I dont want to use slicks, i want to be able to drive to the track and drive home w/out changin n e thing. Currently i have 255 BF goodrich radial TAs...they hook really good surprisingly

If anyone has ideas for anything that would really help. My main curiosity though is just how much of a difference that 750 will make.

Thanks a lot
 
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#2 ·
assuming a 20% driveline loss, about 529 horse at the crank and about 430 at the rear rollers. That also assumes a medium sized, light-beer drinking, 200lb dude behind the wheel. Get your girl to drive it, it might go faster.

Tall order for your setup man, slicks will get you closer, as will a higher stall (I'm told), but I don't see 12.0 in that motor's future, not for that car anyway... IMO (Maybe Conservative... but I'd be happy to get in the 12's in any capacity)

K
 
#3 ·
Your carb is a major restriction. You should run at least 750 CFMs. Don't go Edelbrock. A Holley will make more power.

You will need a bigger cam. If you get over the .550" lift and 240 @.050" range it will make a big difference. You have the compression high enough that you could still maintain a decent idle with a cam at those specs.

Find areas that you can lighten the car.
 
#13 ·
How about modifying the seats to make them easily removable? Take them out at the track (except the driver's seat, of course), put them back in again before you leave. I'm sure if you really looked you could find other things that will lighten the load and still keep your car street legal. Of course if you really want to go all out you could look into a tube frame.

Chickie.
 
#14 ·
You're right, this is a car you are going to drive every day there isn't much you should remove or replace to lighten it. Tearing out most of the interior, a/c, heater, inner fenders, stereo, speakers, ect. Would only take off about 200 pounds, .2 of your et. Not the right route to take IMO.

The Performer is isn't much better that an stock 4 barrel intake, the Performer RPM is designed for performance and will give you more all around power. http://www.73-87.com/chp/dyno3.htm look at test 2 and 3, the difference between the test are they went from a Performer to a Performer RPM and switched to a Holley(which probably only added a few horse power, the majority of the increase is because of the intake.
 
#16 ·
if you check out the whole power band it was getting an extra 11-15 hp across most of it. The only problem with that test is it cuts off at 5300 RPM's after 5500 is where the RPM intake will really out do the performer, and your cam makes good power up to about 6000-6200 rpms.
 
#18 ·
I'm telling you man, you push that stock 350 bottom end past 5500, maybe 6000 RPM and you're asking for a stretched rod and a hole in your pan and block. Get a cam that allows you to shift at 55, maybe 5800 or buy a 2000 dollar bottom end for the thing. Sorry man, but those are your options.

The transmission will twist till the cows come home. WOrry about the mill.

K
 
#19 ·
i have heard that, but my mechanic has a 350 with a stock bottom end in his el camino, and he has had it in there for 5 years...It has well over 600 passes on it and...he shifts at 7500! He told me they have been tested to 9200 RPM, but he also said that even with his, he had to have the tolerances damn near perfect to allow the RPMs that he gives it.
 
#20 ·
Well as long as its his money and his motor, that's cool. YOu just have to decide if you're comfortable doing that to your motor. I will tell you I've never in my life heard of a small block with a stock bottom end doing those R's more than once. You'll need performance springs, pushrods and girdles to push those R's. A stock setup simply will not do it.

Just be careful man, its a rough thing to blow up a new motor...

K:thumbup:
 
#23 ·
Check out the following link: http://javascript.internet.com/calculators/horsepower.html

With a 3500 lb. car and a desire to hit 12.0 in the 1/4 mile, you'll need 400 horsepower at the rear tires. This translates to approximately 520 HP at the flywheel.

Based on your engine description, your at least 150 HP shy of your goal. If you want the car to remain streetable, you're not going to get down to 12.0 in the 1/4 mile. You'll need a much more radical cam, taller intake and about an 850 CFM carb. You'll probably want a forged steel crank, too.

Reduce the car's weight to 2600 lbs. and you'll get your 12.0 ET with your current engine setup. Start by removing the back seat. That should get you almost 100 lbs. lighter.
 
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