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Topic Review (Newest First)
12-23-2004 07:24 PM
HemmiGremmie Thanks for the link Turbo.
It will be a few months before I can buy, but I'll keep this guy in mind when I do. HG
12-23-2004 04:22 PM
TurboS10 Okay, thanks tom. I will check them out.

Chris
12-23-2004 09:17 AM
machine shop tom You can check by lapping the valves in. That should have been done by the machinist, anyway. The guides can be checked by cleaning the lube out of them and a clean valve will wriggle a little bit.

tom
12-23-2004 09:08 AM
killerformula I can see how the heads have a good chance of being messed up when some dufus in the dart factory just throws them together. But if they're coming from a machine shop, I think its a different story. They know that its not dart's butt on the line, its theirs. I am absolutely certain that my machine shop checked and did the job right.

K
12-23-2004 08:52 AM
TurboS10 Killer,

I think you make a good point. The heads I have were deburred around chambers and the valves appear to be unshrouded. I think that it is actually where the cutter for the big valves(2.08) got against the chamber, but it is hard for me to tell. The exhaust valves appear the same way.

Tom, you also make a good point. Could I check the valve sets and angles using lapping compound? Seems like it should show any valves that are not seating properly. Gasoline in the chamber always shows if one is leaking as well. I can check the deck easy enough with a straight edge I figure. About the guides being too tight, I have heard of this before. Might sound dumb, but is it just a matter of feel to see if they are too tight?

Chris
12-23-2004 08:48 AM
machine shop tom This is from an earlier post of mine:

The worst aftermarket heads i have seen were a set af Canfield sbc heads. The chambers were 3ccs oversize, the heads were warped .013", and the valves seated so badly light shined into the chamber was visible in the ports. Shortly after those heads I worked on a pair of bbc race heads. These heads were each warped over .014". I have also fixed Dart, AFR, World Products, Brodix, and Ford Motorsports heads. The defects i found were: guides too tight, valve guides not concentric to the seats, valve seats too wide, too narrow, and damaged by chipped cutter blades, seats contacting the valve face too far off the inside or outside, broken keepers, lubricant not present on valve stems, and more. My point is that ALL of these problems somehow got past quality control checks and made it into consumer hands.

The thing is this: Any of these heads would probably made decent power in spite of the problems because of the fact they are horsepower producing heads. A rough idle caused by leaky valve wouldn't be that noticable with a radical cam. But eventually a valve would stick or eventually burn or a head gasket would leak. I have seen each of these happen on heads that were bolted on. One head in particular was a bbc Dart head. The source where the head was bought from was advised that the valve seats didn't look right. The buyer was told to use them anyway. After little use on the drag strip, a valve head broke off from flexing as it tried to seat on an off-center seat. All I am saying is that if you spend $1500-$2000 or more on a set of heads, it would be wise to have them checked out by a good machinist. We do that for our
customers (while they watch) and they are more than happy to see that we found a problem before it cost them a lot more money in the long run.


After your previous experience, I'm sure you would rather check things our first............



tom
12-23-2004 08:37 AM
killerformula Tom, chris-

I think clarification is needed here. I bought my iron eagles the same way chris did and just bolted them right on. I found the machine work to be way above and beyond what I expected. Here's the difference. Tom, the problems you've had are probably people who buy the "fully assembled" heads from dart or other warehouses, am I wrong? The difference is, the people who chris and I bought our heads from independent machine shops (much like yours, tom) who sell these heads on ebay for a reduced rate, because they buy pallets of bare casting heads and then do all the machine work in-house. The 200cc runner, fully assembled angle plug, 2.05 heads like I got are something like just shy of 1000 dollars in summit. I got them for 700. (maybe its 900 in summit, dunno).

They guy who did my heads put in manley valves, threw in a set of com cams guide plates and actually (get this) UNSHROWDED MY EXHAUST VALVES!!!! Can you believe it?!

Some of these guys really know what it means to be cool with your customers and go the extra step for a quality product. As soon as I saw the work I was so confident I just tossed them right on the motor, and I was right, everything was in order.

K
12-22-2004 10:09 PM
TurboS10 Hemmie,

You can get whatever springs you want, but the heads set up with roller springs are a bit more expensive. The heads I got are #110 on the seat. The guy I got them from recommends them for .525 lift, but he said that is just to be on the safe side and they will handle .550 without issues.

Like I said, I will check them over before installing them.

Here is a link to the heads he is selling, but he has raised the price $25 since I ordered mine.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=33617

Chris

Edit:

I just got an email back from another guy who bought the heads from Yoder. He said he had no problems and they made 550HP on a 390ish cid small block and ran them this whole season on a drag car without issue.
12-22-2004 09:13 PM
HemmiGremmie Turbo.
I dont think anyones trying to bust your happiness, but rather just have you check everything carefully. You know what they say about checking others work.
I think it sounds like a heck of a deal to me and Id be interested in seeing the Ebay listing they were on.
Do they look like pretty thick decks on em? Can you order them with the size springs you need?
Let me know some info on em. Tnx and good luck with em. HG
12-22-2004 09:13 PM
68Velle I've seen some pretty out of wack stuff that was brand new. I think he meant just to make sure everything was on the up and up, thats all.
12-22-2004 06:59 PM
TurboS10
Quote:
Originally posted by coldknock
It's the peace of mind that comes with actually knowing it was done right. Don't forget why the engine had to come apart after only 500 miles.

Larry
Yes, but it does not make sense to mill a set of brand new heads unless they are not flat and it can be measured....which I will check. It also makes no sense to me to put a new valve job on a new set of heads that just got a valve job. No matter who I have do it, there is always a chance it can be wrong. I plan on disassembling the heads to check the valve job and will do the gas in the chamber test to make sure they seal. I will look for any nicks in the valve stems, but this guy was pretty particular about being sure that everything was right. He said he will fix any problem that I might find.

If I am missing something..........this is my first set of aftermarket heads. You all make it sound like they are junk out of the box.

Chris
12-22-2004 05:18 PM
coldknock It's the peace of mind that comes with actually knowing it was done right. Don't forget why the engine had to come apart after only 500 miles.

Larry
12-22-2004 04:20 PM
TurboS10
Quote:
Originally posted by machine shop tom
Now all you have to do is have a good valve job done, CC check and resurface the heads. Check the valve springs, polish the nicks off the valve stems, clean the heads and reassemble them.


Been there, done that!

tom
Huh?!

The guy who does the heads assembles them and does the valve job in his machine shop. Why on earth would I have them surfaced? Are you saying that they are not flat when you get them from Dart? Why would the valve stems have nicks?

Chris
12-22-2004 04:07 PM
machine shop tom Now all you have to do is have a good valve job done, CC check and resurface the heads. Check the valve springs, polish the nicks off the valve stems, clean the heads and reassemble them.


Been there, done that!

tom
12-22-2004 03:44 PM
killerformula sounds like it could be running in a week.

K
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