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initial timing ?

2K views 5 replies 6 participants last post by  RippinRon 
#1 ·
my motor is a 350 sbc, 4 bolt main, running for now 416 58cc heads ,motor is 30 over, edelbrock performer cam, street dominator dual plane intake, edelbrock 600 carb, 1-5/8 headers, 2-1/2 exauast to rear end turn downs, have set at 12 degree before runs good but cranks slow when hot cranks better at 8 degree before, but sluggish off idle, battery is in trunk, pos cable is three times as big as stock cable, have large ground from motor to frame battery is 1000 cca new as well, have solinoid shield, plus have ford solinoid wired as doc vette showed, battery is grounded to rear sub frame, should i run my ground to the motor as well or is my timing wrong, 58cc heads have bumped my compression up to 10 to one or more P.S. starter is new as are all cables and hardware
 
#2 ·
Mr. Wormy said:
my motor is a 350 sbc, 4 bolt main, running for now 416 58cc heads ,motor is 30 over, edelbrock performer cam, street dominator dual plane intake, edelbrock 600 carb, 1-5/8 headers, 2-1/2 exauast to rear end turn downs, have set at 12 degree before runs good but cranks slow when hot cranks better at 8 degree before, but sluggish off idle, battery is in trunk, pos cable is three times as big as stock cable, have large ground from motor to frame battery is 1000 cca new as well, have solinoid shield, plus have ford solinoid wired as doc vette showed, battery is grounded to rear sub frame, should i run my ground to the motor as well or is my timing wrong, 58cc heads have bumped my compression up to 10 to one or more P.S. starter is new as are all cables and hardware
Be sure that all the battery cable connection points are clean bare metal.

Additional ground cables can help.

Have you considered using a gear reduction starter?

12 degrees initial should not be a problem even when the engine is hot.

Using the Ford starter solenoid (mounted well away from the exhaust manifold) should have elliminated the need for a starter solenoid shield.
 
#5 ·
Doc Here, :pimp:

First of All, your Cables MUST be 0/0 or 0/1 For a run of that length..

You Can't just short run a ground cable to the rear and call it good..IT MUST go from the engine block to the Battery NON STOP..your dealing with a transference of a LOT of Current over 25 feet..

Your Timing sounds a bit shallow at 8 degrees, Which might account for it's canine like performance off the line..12 is a good starting point.

Have the Starter Tested..If it is GOOD and your Compression IN FACT is 10.1, think Gear reduction..

Set up a Good Ground buss system First..It probably will cure the problem.

For your Ground Buss, Set it up as follows:

BE sure First, You have A 4 gauge Cable (for stock battery location, OR , 0/0 or 0/1 Cable for a trunk location) from the battery, to any handy bolt at or NEAR the starter on the block .

Using a short run to something like a seat belt bolt, or body bolt just adds resistance, the body is insulated..(has road paint and sits on rubber mounts) this , makes for a "Poor or no" Bonding situation..
  • that makes resistance..
  • Resistance makes Heat..
  • heat melts things and further insulates the bond,
  • which makes more heat..and so on..until you no longer have a good bond..

To install a proper ground buss system, This MUST be done:
  • 1 ) Run a properly gauged (0/0 or 0/1) Ground cable from the battery in the trunk, Or A 4 Gauge cable for a stock located battery, to any handy bolt at or near the starter on the block. From that same bolt get a 4 gauge Battery cable at the parts store, that has two 3/8 ring terminals on each end and attach it there and to the Frame. Make this run as short as possible.

  • 2 ) Next get some 10 gauge wire and ring terminals, run two wires from your bolt on the block, to the Firewall, Burnish off all the paint, grease or oil or dirt from the area, Install a sheetmetal or Self Drilling Tech screw using a star washer as well as a lock washer.. and the other 10 gauge wire to the Alternator ground lug, bracket or mount bolt and attach with star and lock washers.
  • 3 ) Next get some Wire Braid, (expensive! about $10 for 5 - 6 inch pieces! ) Check Radio Shack for this, OR cheaper yet, get some RG 8 Coax cable, about 10 feet. Should run you about 15 cents a foot.

HOW TO MAKE WAY DURABLE CHEAP GROUND BRAID:
--------------------------------------------------
  • 1 ) carefully Slit the insulation from the cable with a Talaban Boarding pass (box knife) .


  • 2 ) Peel away the insulation until you just have the center dielectric and braid left, then carefully press the ends of the coax cable BRAID together like a Chinese "Finger puzzle"


  • 3 ) Slide the dielectric and center conductor out. remove it and toss it..


  • 4 ) On a work bench, Flatten the Braided shield out, use a round weight like a full paint can to roll over it.
------------------------------------------------------

This will be your braid cable, just Cut to smaller length's as needed, and tuck the cut ends into a crimp terminal and crimp the ends on..

IF you can Solder, Tin the ends before you tuck the ends of the cable into the terminals, then Tin the barrel of the terminals, then insert the cable and crimp..

Then heat the terminal and braid, feed some solder into the opposite end as the heat is being applied, let it melt and FLOW or WICK toward the heat..until the terminal barrel is filled and is smooth and shiny..

that is a good joint..gray and rough is a "Cold Joint" and you'll have to start over..
  • 4 ) NEXT, install braid from the radiator support to the frame, Fenderwells to frame , hood to firewall, Doors to door posts, gas flap to body, tailgate / Trunk to body. Install a cable or Braid From the Fuel tank Ground lug where the sender, Fuel line is to the frame..burnish the frame, use star washers and sheetmetal or Tech (self Drilling screws) on the frame.

  • 5 ) At each point the wire is grounded, Burnish ALL the paint and grease off to bare metal. Use a proper star-washer and lock. Use sheetmetal or Tech screws where no screws are available.


It sounds like a lot of work, but after you assemble all the parts, it's only a few hours to do..and you'll end up with a system that will work reliably for many years to come..and can eliminate that from your troubleshooting list.

Remember: GROUND is the other Half of your 12 volt circuit AND is equally as important as having POWER to the device!

Doc :pimp:
 
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