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Nitrogen to spray with?

31K views 106 replies 33 participants last post by  powerrodsmike 
#1 ·
Anyone noticed any diference using nitrogen to shoot their paint with? I can get a 230 bottle(biggest) for $16, so it's cheap enough if it makes a difference. I know I wouldn't have a water problem.
 
#2 ·
It seems to me that the sear volume that you would need to do any major painting would steer you from that. I realize 16 is cheap for a 230 bottle but when a good gun sata or similar need 11cfm or better you would go through a lot. I personally have never in 6 years a a single problem with water in the lines. All I've ever used to paint is a 5 horse 60 gal compressor with a desicant dryer and a motorgaurd filter on the gun. Though I could see portability being good when say airbrushing on site or t-shirts or something. It would be interesting to here from somone with expriences with that process.

Kris,
 
#3 ·
I have no experience paint whatsoever but the one thing I would be concerned with is the fact that you'd only have a finite supply. I'd imagine you'd have to closely monitor the pressure in the bottle and stop before you run out otherwise you might problems with consistency. I dunno, just my thoughts.
 
#4 ·
Not even considering the supply capacity, nitrogen can be deadly. The industrial community is very aware of the dangers associated with workers entering vessels that have had nitrogen purges on them. OSHA has even gone so far as mandating different line connectors for oxygen and nitrogen so that they cannot be interchanged. The only way I could think of it being used would be with a forced breathing air supply.

Vince
 
#6 ·
This is a very bad idea.
Paint companies use nitrogen to purge the air out of their hardeners because nitrogen is heaver then air. (nitrogen blanket)
Even the paint companies are smart enough that the majority of them do not package their own hardeners and there is one company that is all they do is package hardeners for the paint companies with automated equipment.

Ist problem is the nitrogen will cover the floor like a blanket because of its weight, so dropping a hammer or a piece of metal on the cement can cause a spark and that would be the end of that.

Next, it is highly unlikely you have explosion proof lights and outlets in your garage.
Also unlikely you have an explosion proof exhaust fan that circulates the air four times an hour.
Also unlikely you have proper grounding wire straps for you and the tank.

Just a very unsafe and bad idea to avoid a few drops of water, in my book.
 
#7 ·
BarryK said:
This is a very bad idea.

Ist problem is the nitrogen will cover the floor like a blanket because of its weight, so dropping a hammer or a piece of metal on the cement can cause a spark and that would be the end of that.

Next, it is highly unlikely you have explosion proof lights and outlets in your garage.
Also unlikely you have an explosion proof exhaust fan that circulates the air four times an hour.
Also unlikely you have proper grounding wire straps for you and the tank.

Just a very unsafe and bad idea to avoid a few drops of water, in my book.
aaahhhh...Barry.....Nitrogen is an inert gas..nonflammable. :thumbup:
 
#10 ·
Airbrushing would be the only usable way for it. Trying to paint a vehicle or even parts would not be feasable,not enough volume for the job. Using the necessary regulator is a MUST as nitrogen is extreamly high pressure,around 3000 psi in the cylinder and can literaly blow your head off or the hose beat you to death.I use it almost daily and have seen first hand the results of misuse. NOT pretty. It can displace oxygen in an enclosed or sealed area,so proper ventilation IS required. Nitrogen regulators have a male fitting adapter,Oxygen is female so it's not easy to connect the wrong regulator.
Nitrogen IS a safe and usable propellent source but the proper regulator and ventilation IS required.
 
#12 ·
Don is right on the money. It is used to displace oxygen to reduce the chance of explosion and fires. That same oxygen that you need to breathe. Since such a large percentage of the air is already nitrogen, it doesn't take a whole lot to make the percentage of oxygen in the air so low it is useless for breathing.

Aaron
 
#14 ·
61 chevy said:
aaahhhh...Barry.....Nitrogen is an inert gas..nonflammable. :thumbup:
Nitrogen is very easy to find,If I recall correctly,75% of the air we breathe is made up of Nitrogen.

I'm not a chemist,but I believe that Nitogen does not react with many things,if anything.

But who wants to be a guinea pig? Couldn't you get a cylinder filled with regular air at 3000 psi ? I'm also curious as to how far it would go,could be used for off-site painting,with no access to a compressor,and you know it would be clean and oil free.
 
#15 ·
JR66Ford said:
I can get a 230 bottle(biggest) for $16, .
I would venture to say the 260 + 260 cubic feet. ...So 260/12 ( my uneducated guess on cfm of hvlp gun )=21.666. So I would guess that you would have no more than 21 minutes of supply available at this rate. Although the actual time would be less if you figure in the effect of flow verses presure. It is a holiday weekend and I refuse to embark on such mathmatical formulations. :thumbup:
 
#16 ·
61 chevy said:
I would venture to say the 260 + 260 cubic feet. ...So 260/12 ( my uneducated guess on cfm of hvlp gun )=21.666. So I would guess that you would have no more than 21 minutes of supply available at this rate. Although the actual time would be less if you figure in the effect of flow verses presure. It is a holiday weekend and I refuse to embark on such mathmatical formulations. :thumbup:
I don't think that the formula is quite that simple,but then again I haven't started driking yet,LOL!

I'm guessing:
You start with the volume of the tank (approx 5 cubic feet?)
and multiply by 3000 psi (with some factor)to get the total volume of air in the tank. Once knowing that you could figure out how long you could disperse that air at a rate of 50psi at 12CFM.

Can somebody get their school teacher wife on this? (LOL!)
 
#17 ·
I apologize to everyone on here and most of all to the poster or starter of the thread.

I found out I wrote this this afternoon when a friend sent me an email offering his third grade daughter's science book.
You can't imagine the horror when I saw this post but thats life.

I don't remember writing it or can I offer a reason why other than I was being hateful and why I drove home and got on the computer, I don't know as I don't remember doing the drive home or the computer. If I posted anywhere else, forgive me but I don't want to know about it as this is bad enough.

There is no excuse and I offer none but I did it and all I can say again is I'm sorry and embarrassed.

Barry
 
#18 ·
I have used Nitrogen for years to purge tanks prior to welding on them :) As stated Nitrogen makes up the majority of the gases in the air we breath and the only hazard would be if you confined it in an air tight compartment and displaced the Oxygen which could lead to suffocation but if your paint area is airtight you are going to have bigger problems than Oxygen displacement! Actually using Nitrogen would seem to be safer than compressed air because it would significantly reduce the danger of fire but my concern would be having enough volume on hand to do the job and finding a regulator/flow meter that would flow that kind of volume, might be a problem. You can get liquid Nitrogen in large cryo tanks at most welding/gas suppliers and these will contain as much gas as several pressure tanks and may not be a expensive as you might think. I have for years used these cryogenic tanks and the liquid Nitrogen to freeze steel pins and bushings to shrink them when the fit has to be really tight, this is a common procedure around the mines.
 
#20 ·
The reason I mentioned the mining is that is where I used the liquid form of this gas and I did so to make the point that it is more commonly used and a lot easier to obtain than most people might think. The question was about using Nitrogen to spray paint with and I just thought I would mention one option that no one had talked about yet. This is the second time I know of that this has been asked so apparently some are thinking about doing it for one reason or the other and even though I have never done this it would seem to me that given enough volume it should work just fine. For sure you would have a VERY clean, dry, oil free source of pressure and I am curious as to how well this might work.
 
#21 ·
One thing to remember is that if you take a pressurized gas and release it, the gas will be very cold. I'm not sure exactly what would happen, but I don't think the reducers would react well to sub-zero temperatures. It is entirely possible that the cold spray will take moisture out of the air and freeze it into your paint. Ice crystals in the paint would not be good. Paints are designed to be used with compressed (and therefore warm/hot air). I don't think cold nitrogen will work well.
 
#22 ·
dh, Darn good point you have there and that may very well be a major drawback to doing this. For sure the gas from the the liquid would be incredibly cold, even the gas would be more than -150 deg close to the tank so it would definitely have to be allowed to warm up before entering the spray gun since at that low temperature it would not only freeze the paint it would also freeze the rubber air hose! While I am sure warming the gas would be simple enough it is just one more thing to consider that when combined with other likely problems could make this impractical even if it is possible.
 
#23 ·
Nitrogen to spray with

Hey guys,
Just trying to keep the facts right. Nitrogen is lighter than air and Oxygen. The molecular weight of N2 is 28 air is 29.2 and O2 is around 30. My numbers most like are a little off since I'm using my memory! But the bottom line is they are all very similar. The earths atmosphere is made up of about 80% N2. So adding a tank of N2 to it will have be a very low health risk unless you are working in an air tight compartment. The main advantage of using 100% N2 is O2 can be very reactive with many substances. Get rid of the O2 and you have little chance of corrosion etc.
 
#25 ·
It has been around for a number of years in cars all over the roads. When you see green valve caps, that means those tires have nitrogen (or at least they supposed to. :) ) It doesn't heat up and expand as air does.

Brian
 
#26 ·
Spraying with Nitrogen would add ZERO health risk since most of the air around us is already Nitrogen it would simply mix with the air and would not pool up in high or low places. The only danger would be displacing the Oxygen but this would not be a problem either because the paint area would have to be ventilated, if it is not then the paint over-spray would reach toxic (and blinding) levels long before the Oxygen depletion became a problem. The more I think about this the more practical it seems if someone just needs to do just one job and has only a tiny compressor, it would be kind of like a giant rattle can :). Maybe the Cryo tanks would be a bit of over-kill however two or more pressure tanks connected by a manifold (these are available) and using a regulator capable of enough flow this should work and would eliminate the need for a high volume compressor plus it would provide very clean and dry propellant.
 
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