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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2014, 04:24 AM
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X2 on getting rid of the amp gauge

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Old 02-10-2014, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by EOD Guy View Post
I like the 12SI series because they are cheap and avail anywhere.
That's pretty much why I chose a 12SI. That and the ease of installing an indicator light which I prefer over a voltmeter (and especially over an ammeter).

I also installed a battery monitor (a small LED that changes when voltage drops or when the battery is charging.
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Old 02-10-2014, 12:17 PM
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Bulb burns out----it will stop charging like it is supposed to.
With the resistor added (And I have seen this in a lot of early GM drawings) the alternator
will still get a signal to charge when it is supposed to----also prevents enough voltage backfeeding
to run the car.

I have a resistor wire in my 59 running from the fusebox to the alternator
On my 66---I have a voltmeter & light ---but there is a resitor wire in the harness (American Autowire) that is about 10" long and tied in.

Both of those cars have CS130D alternators.

Now---the little Ford ----Everything I have seen on that one is that the resistor is optional.
(my interpretation of the drawings) But is also suggests a 510 ohm.
Since I did not find a 510 at Radio Shack----I wired in a 470 near a harness connector
where it can be found if needed.---------Oh---later model 3-G alternator
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Old 02-10-2014, 01:07 PM
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Bulb burns out----it will stop charging like it is supposed to.
Bryan, I asked earlier but I'm not sure it was answered. Can you run a bulb and resistor in parallel in case the bulb burns out it will continue to charge?

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Old 02-10-2014, 01:38 PM
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Have voltmeter under hood. will move to dash and replace amp meter. Can gnd from voltmeter (currently grounded to alt. bracket) be used as source to alternator instread of light? Extra (white) wire from that alternator bracket is another ground to the body.
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Old 02-10-2014, 01:45 PM
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Have voltmeter under hood. will move to dash and replace amp meter. Can gnd from voltmeter (currently grounded to alt. bracket) be used as source to alternator instread of light? Extra (white) wire from that alternator bracket is another ground to the body.
If I'm following you correctly not sure that would work because once the alternator is charging the exciter wire coming from the alternator has 12v and your voltmeter will read "0".

Switched 12v >>>> VM <<<< 12v from Alternator

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Old 02-10-2014, 03:47 PM
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I see. Same reason light goes out when charging. OK, got it. Light isn't that hard and have spot for it in dash. This something been wanting to do for years, so will study the solutions and draw some diag's, and get to rewiring (as soon as it warms up a tad). I thank everybody for the help on this and I appologize for jumping in in the middle of the coversation. Just knew people out there had the answers. Thank you all again!
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:09 PM
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X2 with Y on the voltmeter instead of a light. You will not hurt anything by putting a resistor in parallel with the bulb, but it isn't needed. I'm not saying not use a light, I think you should.

Try this...... measure the battery post voltage without the vehicle not running, should get 12-13 volts. Hook a wire from a switched 12v source, without a light or a resistor, to the #1 terminal on the alt, start the vehicle and re-measure battery post voltage should get 14+ volts. Put a light/resistor in the circuit and re-measure the battery post voltage........ same reading as with out the bulb/resistor.

Depending on how it's wired, hack job, the resistor on the #1 terminal won't prevent run on (depending on the resistor). I have found most cases of run-on are caused by someone tapping into the IGN side of the ignition switch instead of the ACCY side of the switch.

Some older vehicles didn't have a ACCY terminal on the ignition switch so folks tied into the ign side.....a diode cured this. A better solution would be to replace the ignition switch with one that has a ACCY terminal and run the #1 terminal wire from there which would isolate the IGN circuit from the charging circuit.

You can hook the voltage meter into the POS side of the electrical system at any point...... ground the other side etc.....
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2014, 04:09 PM
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Hope nobody minds I just printed the whole thread. Some great info/recommendations here. Eod guy is right: pretty easy after I looked at my current config and diagrams. Proof is in the pudding. When it stops raining, and can drag myself away from the '38 2-door am playing with, will jump in and see. Thank you all again. : )
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:36 PM
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Some of you following this post may think I'm crazy for carrying on about this........Here is my thought.

Depending on your budget, you only have so much to spend on your ride........ a modern alternator conversion/upgrade is a very good thing to do for your ride. No one wants to do it wrong and melt your ride so, this whole resistor/diode thing comes up on a board and you feel you need to do the modification in order to do it correctly and not melt it to the ground, genuine fear of doing this.

Now if you modify you wiring correctly to accommodate the new charging system you don't need resistors or diodes. In some cases a more modern ignition switch is required to accommodate the new charging system but you don't want to lose the original ignition switch, so a diode may be required to prevent run-on and allow you to keep the OEM ign switch.

In some cases you don't want to add a idiot light, and some cases there is no provision for the light as in Dakota Digital VHX gauge pods, they use LEDs for indicators. In those cases I would still use a light secured under the dash so the floorboard glows when the alt isn't working etc......

When using the 12SI series of Alternators a resistor isn't needed and a waste of money and if you want to install one then go ahead. I understand it's your money and you can spend it as you wish..... but enticing someone else to spend their money when it isn't necessary, bothers me.

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Old 02-10-2014, 05:03 PM
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Fasteddy, I'd recommend you move the neg battery cable from the alt bracket and reattach it to a head bolt hole, or any engine block hole, that should be just behind the alt making sure it's connected to bare metal. From the same connection run a ground wire to the body and a separate one to the frame. If your alt isn't charging after you move wires, then add a ground strap from the engine block to the alt bracket. You should make sure your electrical system is protected with a fusible link or a Maxi fuse. I use maxi-fuses for just about all my re-wire jobs instead of fusible link because I like the cleanliness and ease of installation.

As far as you voltmeter..... mount it anywhere you like, hook the pos lead to switched +12v wire/fuse block and the neg lead to any ground. It's important it's a switched 12v and not an always hot 12v or the voltmeter would always draw juice even if the key was off.

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Old 02-10-2014, 07:22 PM
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Thank you EOD guy. (Does that EOD stand for what I think is service connected?) Anyway I got too many projects running at once and tend to try to take advantage of convenient attachments. I have grnd straps all around the car, mostly cause had so much trouble getting good gnd so gas gauge would work. there is another one (original) from the firewall seam to the frame behind where the starter is, and another in the rear from gas gauge sender to frame. Never had any trouble with this system til lately when had to change regulator, then alternator and rewire amp meter, and never did like the look of that configuration. What is the trip amperage on the maxi-fuse, or can you get them any size? I appreciate time and effort that you have invested into this. I will let clean it up and let you know how it turns out. Thank you again.
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Old 02-11-2014, 03:37 AM
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You can get them in many values, I run a 70 amp on mine. Everything runs through it except the starter. I ran my #2 wire from the alt to the radiator support across to the other side and then tied into the grid to mimic GMs OEM setup, works very well. On my initial testing My alt was putting out 15+ volts at the battery posts, with everything I could turn on. I did the test to see if the alt would increase production when the system was taxed.
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Old 02-11-2014, 06:16 AM
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OK, thank you again. My technology is from the 50's/60's. Understand the idea here on eliminating the VR, but never fully thought it through. The whole computer/ECM technology in automobiles has thrown me off (I went away for awhile-Navy) When I finally got back into cars, I got back to what I knew, and sort of don't get much past 50's. So terms like "maxi-fuse" are a little foggy, but with this computer and just a little research (and lots of help), am getting back into the swing. Am resketching wiring diagrams now and should be able to actually grab my crescent hammer, screw-chisel and bolt cutters and start the project this week. You have been most helpful, and I thank you again. Will let you know how it works. : )
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Old 02-11-2014, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EOD Guy View Post
You will not hurt anything by putting a resistor in parallel with the bulb,
Actually, putting two resistors in parallel results in a lower total resistance (just like putting two small pipes in parallel - the flow resistance goes down). Also, with a resistor in parallel with the bulb, the bulb will never glow as brightly as it would without the resistor, as part of the current bypasses the bulb through the resistor. I agree, don't bother. How often does this bulb really burn out? It only illuminates at startup (as part of the "lamp test" function in the ignition switch) and if the alternator stops charging. I think a burned out charging bulb is waaaay down on my list of things to worry about on the car.
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