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Old 02-21-2010, 02:09 PM
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orange peel woes

Hey guys,

I am having issues with orange peel with my current car. I've painted and color sanded/buffed on of my other cars to a nice glass finish.

This current one ...I color sanded the orange out with a flat rubber block. 1000,1500,2000 I've tried light pressure and medium pressure...sanding in x direction and sanding in straight directions. But after I buff it out and its nice and shiny from direct view...but when you look at the paint along the length of the car you can see waves or the reminsince of orange peel.

After its buffed and shinny I lightly sand it with 2000 and I could see low spots where its still shinny. So I continue to lightly sand it until the whole surface has the same color/texture. I go back and buff that spot but it still shows up as slight peel.

I guide coated my primer and block sanded to insure a flat surface during prep. But do you think these issues could be from the prep work? Or the way the clear settled? I used PPG clear.

Thanks

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Old 02-21-2010, 04:20 PM
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Ya didn't flow the clear properly.
If ya got enuf on it get it flat with 1000,then 1200,1500,2000 and buff the hell outta it.
If ya ain't got enuf clear on it hit it wit 600 and reshoot it.
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Old 02-21-2010, 07:57 PM
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Do a search of past threads about discussions about urethane peel and flow coats.
Could be bodywork, but does sound like urethane peel being as it looks good straight on, but wavy when you look down the side in the light. Urethane peel is hard to totally avoid, but things like a high solids clear, heavy coats, or too large a tip size can really contribute to the amount of urethane peel.
1000 is too fine to effectively flatten out urethane peel.
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Old 02-21-2010, 08:00 PM
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thanks for the reply...so maybe i should test sand it with 800 grit in another area? I just hope there is enough clear..since I've already hit it with 1000,1500,2000 and then back at 1500 lightly trying to knock it off again.
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Old 02-21-2010, 08:21 PM
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orange peel

30 years ago factory paint jobs had a little bit of orange peel to hide minor defects. more allowed in the botton half. I used to hold a trouble light in one hand and the gun in the other to see how the paint was laying down,,, and we rode bikes with out a helmet , and drank water fron the hose.
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Old 02-21-2010, 08:33 PM
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I normally use R-M Diamont Clear, but recently did a job using PPG paint that a customer had already bought.

I blocked and buffed it after an extended dry time of about 4 days, and it later continued to shrink, letting the problems reappear. Apparently this formula holds the reducer a long time, and the paint remains swollen,so if you sand it flat, before it is totally dried, it may come back. It is probably okay if you spary near perfect paint. }:-(

I emailed a friend in Tennessee that uses PPG, who said to let it dry a couple months! My normal clear is good to go in a couple days, but still easy to sand for a week.... and NEVER gives me this problem. The funny part is that I stopped using PPG in the '80s, because it dried TOO fast, and just and overnight dry made it so hard that it would double the manhours to finish it. I won't be using their paints any more.

BTW, that car is coming back a third time....and six months later. We are still chasing the problem.
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Old 02-21-2010, 10:26 PM
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I use PPG 2021 clear if you are looking for a lacquer slick paint job? this is how I get there when you you mix you clear over reduce you clear twice as much as they say and turn up the air presser I use 65 lbs at the gun then after the clear has a good cure time I start with 800 grit wetsanding with a metal block that I made out of flat stock a rubber block will not get the job done been there then move on to wetsanding with 1000 grit ECT
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Old 02-22-2010, 04:38 AM
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Yeah the car has been allowed to dry for about 3 months. I should have used a different clear. I just forgot to mention my other car I used Dupont Chromabase clear.

With a metal block you'd have to be real careful not to scrape anything I bet.


So pretty much I'm screwed here..I don't want to repaint or re-clear. I'll just have to live with it for now until I can't stand it anymore =)
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Old 02-22-2010, 07:16 AM
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Try 1200, 1500, 2000 and 4000. Afterwards buff it out. As you're sanding it with 1200-1500 dry it with squeegee to see amount of orange peel left. When you won't see low spots in clear/orange peel move onto 2000 and 4000 wet sanding. After you sand it with 4000 you will have very little to buff and it will have very high gloss, texture free finish.
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Old 02-22-2010, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitmaks
Try 1200, 1500, 2000 and 4000. Afterwards buff it out. As you're sanding it with 1200-1500 dry it with squeegee to see amount of orange peel left. When you won't see low spots in clear/orange peel move onto 2000 and 4000 wet sanding. After you sand it with 4000 you will have very little to buff and it will have very high gloss, texture free finish.

Thats the thing...I've been doing it that way...I sand it and the dry surface is the same color and texture after squeegee. You don't any lows...usually the lows showing up as being darker.

Other guy just said 1000 is too fine to level the surface
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Old 02-22-2010, 12:10 PM
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That's the thing about clears. Some sand nice and some are hard as a rock and just won't buff out
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Old 02-22-2010, 12:50 PM
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That is why I like the R-M Diamont. It stays soft enough to sand and buff well for a few days. You can also vary the catalyst and reducer to adjust for shop condiditions.

BTW, I have used PPG, Dupont, Marhyde, and other brands of clear, but this one worked so well that I have used it for over 15 years, and will not experiment any more unless I have to!

I usually let it dry 24 hours before I start sanding, but our winter months are a little cooler, so I allow 48 hours. It is also soft enough that I sand with 1200 only, which speeds things up. Usually it takes me a day or two to sand it all out, then it buffs nice. I buff with a white waffle pad and 3M 6031, then polish with a softer gray waffle pad and 5973.

How's this gloss?
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Old 02-25-2010, 01:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TucsonJay
That is why I like the R-M Diamont. It stays soft enough to sand and buff well for a few days. You can also vary the catalyst and reducer to adjust for shop condiditions.

BTW, I have used PPG, Dupont, Marhyde, and other brands of clear, but this one worked so well that I have used it for over 15 years, and will not experiment any more unless I have to!

I usually let it dry 24 hours before I start sanding, but our winter months are a little cooler, so I allow 48 hours. It is also soft enough that I sand with 1200 only, which speeds things up. Usually it takes me a day or two to sand it all out, then it buffs nice. I buff with a white waffle pad and 3M 6031, then polish with a softer gray waffle pad and 5973.

How's this gloss?
nicee! I dont understand..why would a big name company like dupont and ppg with top dollar chemists make an inferior product to companies most never heard of? I guess thats corporate for you
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Old 02-25-2010, 01:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothale
30 years ago factory paint jobs had a little bit of orange peel to hide minor defects. more allowed in the botton half. I used to hold a trouble light in one hand and the gun in the other to see how the paint was laying down,,, and we rode bikes with out a helmet , and drank water fron the hose.
right on man ! thirty ,forty years ago they didn't give a ******* about orange peel
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Old 02-25-2010, 01:54 AM
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and if it was cold it tasted good
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