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  #526 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 08:25 AM
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so all I have to do is go to post #23 to get the gest of it all? Thanks for doing all the work guys, see y'all in post #23.

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  #527 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 08:29 AM
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One other thing mike, you pointed out about stopping the metal from rusting by leaving the coating.

Here is another chemical FACT. If there is ANY product that will prevent corrosion from starting on metal after ANY coating is applied, that product should be patented and that person will never work again in his life.

This is not my statement but was told to me years ago (about 20) by one of my best friends, who is PHD and is head of development of additives that go in epoxies and paint for the largest supplier in the world, he was just here again yesterday and if you want oil rig or car or bridge coatings he has the answer how to make, learned a lot from him over the years.
So in-tune he has a book with every bridge in the country and what coating were used on it.
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  #528 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 08:40 AM
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Your right there... you cant stop rust, mother nature wont alow that all you can do is slow it down. So any product that claims to :"stop rust dead" should be passed on by as a gimmic...
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  #529 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 08:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARTINSR View Post
Mike, I just realized that my roof is coated with ospho and it's all clamped up ready to weld! Are there any issues with contaminating the weld?

Brian
Brian you can weld it without doing anything but you'll get better welds if you breeze over the edges to be welded with your rol-loc first. If your anything like me having beautiful ,consistant welds is part of the process.and one more reason its so hard to get primer on anything you do I hate covering up my work with primer....it took so long to get there...
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  #530 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 09:06 AM
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Barry you can BS all you like, like priming over flash rust, zinc rich epoxy can't work on a car, my people have developed epoxies that combine with urethane resins and they work anywhere.You keep saying you're epoxy has UV stabilizers and extenders when you should just use a urethane for your hot rod black that will go 20 years outside without chalking. You can't take a dog and turn it into a cat.as for the hydrochloric acid in the De scaler it's there for a reason to dissolve the heavier rust and it can be neutralized.Every time you make on your statements I always would check with the lab guys to see if I missed something. We have epoxies that can be applied is low is 50° without any problem so maybe you can work on that.
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  #531 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Pats55 View Post
Barry you can BS all you like, like priming over flash rust, zinc rich epoxy can't work on a car, my people have developed epoxies that combine with urethane resins and they work anywhere.You keep saying you're epoxy has UV stabilizers and extenders when you should just use a urethane for your hot rod black that will go 20 years outside without chalking. You can't take a dog and turn it into a cat.as for the hydrochloric acid in the De scaler it's there for a reason to dissolve the heavier rust and it can be neutralized.Every time you make on your statements I always would check with the lab guys to see if I missed something. We have epoxies that can be applied is low is 50° without any problem so maybe you can work on that.
You need lab guys then!
Hell there are epoxies that work at 25-30 degrees but they don't work on cars, so I don't want one, if the best your guys can do is 50, for $75,000 I will write them a formula.

Car paints are measured in mils, bridge paint in 1/4 inches.
Are they the ones that told you por 15 was so good and remember you wrote the tech sheet for por and then you show a panel said it was ecoat and it was por, ecoat is not that thick, then you go to the next plan and say por is no good after you get beat up.

You do fit the profile of someone that would slap a label on something and set at flee markets, like you say you have done for 30 years.
I was personally hoping someone would use your procedure on a frame, that is why I stayed away, as I don't care. the results WILL speak for them-self after first chip.
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  #532 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by tech69 View Post
so all I have to do is go to post #23 to get the gest of it all? Thanks for doing all the work guys, see y'all in post #23.
post #23 answers the question of what to do after it has dried . it is also the recommended way of using acid on sheet metal to be painted. most metal prep will be on the low % of phosphoric acid because it's main job is to clean the metal and remove any flash rust.

dissolving rust or removing scale is not part of the refinishing . it usually involves phosphoric acid at the 35-45% level. normally this is done by blasting the rust off then cleaning with metal prep .

the point is once you have removed the rust and done all the metal work you reapply acid then rinse. if you left a coat on for protection while bare this will get rid of it. now you have squeaky clean metal to work with .

far too many people forget there is no " my way " in refinishing. you follow the paint mfg tech or you can forget any warranty or help. you can also look forward to a high possibility of a paint failure. you can do it all 100% right and still have only a 50/50 chance .
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  #533 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 10:45 AM
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Moderator,
RE post I made #531, why not delete it, I don't need to be responding to a total idiot that has lied from the first minute he has gotten on here.
Anyone that can't read through all that crap deserves what they get, so no need for my post mudding up the water as a waste of time.
Thank you
Barry
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  #534 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2013, 11:23 AM
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I agree, delete it. It wasn't even worth responding to.
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  #535 (permalink)  
Old 08-13-2013, 11:24 PM
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I got the impression this was all a bunch of bickering so I didn't read any of it but this stuff sounds awesome! We often strip cars and have to go back over them before primer cause panels will sit in bare metal for too long, but this sounds great. Gonna bring this up to the boss so we can switch to Ospho from rust mort. I never understood the logic of trying to fight rust and then putting water on the panel you just saved-lol Makes no sense if you think about it.

Thanks for taking the time to do this, Deadbodyman. Too bad I'm not able to see the videos. says there's an error.
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  #536 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2013, 05:57 AM
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Even with all the bickering its all good if even one person learns caution using acid for rust removal and panel prep. and has success because of it all.Too many people just throw it on and forget about it because it just looks like clean metal,you cant tell its on there...the main thing is the adheasion of the epoxy I cant stress enough to test your adheasion before moving on to the next step of your build that way if you missed something you'll catch it .....
Since starting this thread I've become much more cautious about the adheasion of my epoxy ,I always try to scrape it off with a razor in a few spots before going on to the next step...If there is a problem thats when you want to catch it....
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  #537 (permalink)  
Old 08-14-2013, 08:58 AM
put up or shut up
 

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when I use rust mort I let it sit overnight, use water to neutralize it, then hit it with 80 to be safe. Not sure if there's a better way but eliminating the water completely is what grabs my attention, and obviously the results of letting it sit. Hopefully we get some Ospho in the shop in the near future.
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  #538 (permalink)  
Old 08-15-2013, 04:47 AM
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I'm having chest pains. Read the directions on Ospho and Rust Mort it's a converter. It turns rust into iron oxide, and leaves a primer.it's not meant for clean steel. Our Metal Prep was developed 25 years ago for the sole purpose that when you strip the car it would remain rust free until its ready for paint and it contains Zinc so paint jobs dont go south in a year or two.

Last edited by Pats55; 08-15-2013 at 04:55 AM.
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  #539 (permalink)  
Old 08-17-2013, 07:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevymon View Post
Ospho rust converter loses strength as it is used, so it may not be a fair test, if the masterseries rust remover is reusable over and over. If it is that type product you could leave a heavily rusted and pitted piece of metal submerged in it until all the rust is gone, even in the deepest pits.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 123pugsy View Post
A fair test is whatever works easiest is the one I want to use.
If the Master series is as you describe, I'll buy that. It's pretty simple really.

Hey Brian, can you do a test for us?
I'm not Brian, but I did get a sample from Pat and I did do the test.





The metal was taken from the solution and directly put under running water and dried off before each picture.



This metal is part of the floor of an old Chevy and the black stuff on the back is some kind of oil/grease/tar, but the masterseries is suppose to work on that also.















The next picture was taken after leaving it set for six hours overnight in the house and you can see that it has started to oxidize. And I also used a pick on the rust to scratch away the heavier part of it.



And I also scratched into the tar like substance on the back.

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  #540 (permalink)  
Old 08-17-2013, 07:59 AM
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Damn impressive.

Brian
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