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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 07-18-2011, 06:40 PM
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PPG doesnt make ospho its made by skyco... I have used PPG epoxy over it too back when we were using PPG products but that was about 20-25 yrs ago I think it was DP40,ugly greenish stuff..... using acid is nothing new I agree and Im sure youve used some because you keep saying to neutralize it.but have you ever used the specific product that I'm talking about ?.... Ospho ......because calling Ospho acid is like calling our beloved SPI epoxy,just a primer,theres a little more to it than that...
Am I missing something or is there another way to remove rust without sand blasting? seems to me like theres only two choices,blasting and acid and people have a lot of trouble with acid ,This is the whole reason for this thread....... how to use it without any trouble....But in the end it wont take place of replacing the metal ,it can only get so rusty before it needs replacing. My roof is a good example I could have replaced the rotted section and that would have been better but a compound curve is a challenge and would take more time then I was willing to spend on this rotted out POS.I did replace the whole bottom of the car with new metal but where the body side mouldings were I saved that with Ospho too.finding a roof and 1/4s for this car would be expensive and time consuming but I never planned for it to be a trailer queen,just a cool car I can cut up and drive the tires off it,and if it ever goes to a show it'll be in the parking lot.
I sure would like to meet another pro that would tackle something this far gone and I know how tight money is and the only way to get one done like this is to do it yourself and love doing it...after all "its only steel" dont let the lack of money stop you from riding a cool car ...I'll bet everyone here has a car in the garage or out back so grab some stripper and some Ospho and lets get er done.
.......................Heres some pics to encourage youse guys ...............
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 07-18-2011, 07:49 PM
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Sand off all the Ospho with 180 before you prime it

What I am gathering from all this discussion, is that DBM is sanding all of the Ospho off the metal so there is no acid left. Is there no protection left after you sand it off? I don't know, but if the epoxy is binding and sealing with the freshly sanded metal, there should be no way for it to rust again.
I'm assuming that the job the Ospho was doing was to clean the rust from the pores of the metal and deter it from coming back while you are getting lined up to seal it with epoxy.
The directions on the container state you can spray primer right over it, I haven't tried that. I'm wire brushing all the Ospho off from the places that I can't get to it with 180. I haven't shot my primer yet. Hopefully one day this week. Then I'll let it sit for a few days and check for lifting.
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 07-19-2011, 05:36 AM
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every paint mfgr makes a phosphoric acid metal prep. they are all the same. and they all require it to be neutralized with water. ospho is no different than naval jelly and must be used right for the job. there is a reason barry asks people to not use his product over acid unless you know how to use it.
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 07-19-2011, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dixiedart
I will want to remove every friggin' trace of the stuff then, just to be sure but have yet to read exactly the best method. If someone could post the exact procedure it would be nice. I know DBM doesn't bother, only 180's and W&G remover then sprays. SPI site really doesn't give a step by step (obviously). I only use the stuff after a good 80 grit sanding, metal is clean, and then a fine wipe down with ospho towel in one hand and wet towel in the other, very little is used and laid on light, but does the trick. All panels will sit for days or weeks before I'm ready to shoot epoxy. I feel a red scotchbrite and garden hose would obviously do it - but it'll flash rust instantly here so ......

Do you REALLY want to know how to correclty nuetralize the acid ?

Call 404-307-9740 and ask the proper way to do it. It is that simple, far simpler than this ongoing pissing match is to read.
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 07-19-2011, 04:05 PM
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Here you go,the directions are a little vague http://www.ospho.com/directions.htm

I dont try to sand it off but it would be ez enough..I just breeze over it when its dry with 180 then scuff good with a red pad ,you'll see some whitish dust then wipe down with W&G...In all the years I've used it I've never once used water to neautralize it so I dont know if it would flash rust or not.Also I dont depend on it converting rust I use it to remove the rust ,clean the metal and convert any traces that might be left...
ask skyco a question about using Ospho http://www.ospho.com/contact.htm
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  #111 (permalink)  
Old 07-19-2011, 04:22 PM
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The whole purpose of this thread is to help people use this particular product succesfully.....
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  #112 (permalink)  
Old 07-19-2011, 08:01 PM
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Could it be the "pros" don't use it because they don't have to let parts sit because they don't get the sometime long interruptions or distractions as the hobbyists do? I am as rank an amateur as can be. I have successfully used OSPHO as a rust retardant; HOWEVER, if I could strip and epoxy within 48 hours, I would probably skip the "extra" step of OSPHO. I actually first used OSPHO about 10 years ago at the suggestion of an old paint and body guy, 65 y/o. He suggested it after hearing I had stripped 1/2 the truck and was not going to be priming it right away. I have rinsed the part with water after 24 hours and did not have the flash rusting. Today I stripped my hood latch panel, tomorrow I will epoxy and paint....soooo no need for OSPHO. As far as TREATING existing rust, DEAD has done a great job of documenting a successful way for us "low budget" guys to keep moving on our project. BTW, thanks for your stubborness, I mean perserverance DBM
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  #113 (permalink)  
Old 07-24-2011, 12:26 PM
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Ed Zachary !!!!

Ed Zachary !!!! (thats Chinese for exactly) ....... this is the same scenario for me, now on my third restoration. It's even tougher now with my new job in that I have ONLY weekends and often find myself in situations with bare steel for quite some time. I also have to be selective regarding days to spray primers (subdivision life) as well, so acid treatments have been a God-send for me. My restorations run 2-2 1/2 years or so. Some of you have been very helpful, but may not understand how some of us weekend warriors go at it ( SLOWLY) and some just don't have the luxury of working on a car daily so ...... I will continue to use it until joining the "OLDE PHARTTE" club and have the luxury of time (but by then I still may move too slow !) Still learning.
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  #114 (permalink)  
Old 07-25-2011, 02:04 PM
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One last Ospho question

If I have Ospho'd panels that have sat for weeks/months - I gather the best way to remove is to re-wet with Ospho and then rinse well with water, correcto mundo ?
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  #115 (permalink)  
Old 07-26-2011, 05:43 AM
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I'd sand it off with a DA just before I primed.
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  #116 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2011, 02:06 PM
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I used ospho on my project car 3 years ago and shot two coats of PPG omni epoxy over it. And havent had any signs of problems. I stripped the car to bare metal first. I Scrubbed it into the pitted areas. I did wipe most of it off after it sat for a few minutes. Then the next day or so sanded the panels again before i sprayed the epoxy on.

Ive had to sand down into the epoxy to bare metal during the metal and filler work. And saw no signs of problems. Ive never used this product before but was told to use it by a friend. Dont know if i would again after reading all this. But so far it seems to have worked well for me.


Mike
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  #117 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2011, 08:19 AM
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Epoxy Primers are great on clean unrusted metal all by themselves,However when you strip a car thats over 20 yrs old a lot of the time it'll have little freckle like spots all over it ,mainly due to lacquer primers and paints allowing moisture in..this kind of work is perfect for ospho..when I did that hood in the video there wasnt any rust and I only treated half the hood there was NO difference in the adhesion between treated and untreated so it really is an unnecessary step...
Just for the record,I'm an every day guy just like most of you trying the build cars on a tight budget whether its a customers car or my own but,I am a pro with 35 yrs exp.,with my own shop I specialize in rust repairs and I also guarantee my rust repair work. All the cars I do are driven and most of the work I do would send your normal everyday bodyman screaming and running away,and I like it that way...I dont do trailer queens (mainly because I cant stand the type of people that own them) At my shop I simply cant blast anything and I would never trust something like that to ANYONE (very few blasters are bodymen) so I chem strip and use Ospho on my rust that isnt bad enough or cost effective to replace the panel.Ospho works and its NOT the same as all other acid products,its the only one I use and I completely understand anyone being skeptical so buy a quart (15.00) and try it on some old junk fender or something the way I do and see for yourself ,if anybody has any trouble what so ever come on back and let us know the price is small compared to what you'll learn...This is one of very few products I swear by...I've been using Ospho for over 25yrs And the man that showed me (RIP) has used it since the fifties..
That said,
Acid products and their misuse are the number 1 cause for a paint failure so read the directions and use my tips and you wont have any trouble but if you just pick up some rust stuff at auto zone or the like you can expect trouble ,for that matter buying any auto body products (even bondo) from those places would be a big mistake.
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  #118 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2011, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadbodyman
I chem strip
What brand of chemical strip do you recomend?

By the way, thanks for all the information. I have used Ospho in marine applications for years. Will use it exactly as you taught here. I know all the skeptics are a bother sometimes, however, they do serve to bring out the best in what you presented. Any DIYer that makes a mistake using Ospho after reading all of this, should really be hiring someone to do the work.
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  #119 (permalink)  
Old 09-30-2011, 07:16 AM
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Thanks Guy, I gotta admit though I did start doubting myself a little but the skepticism just made me try even harder to prove my point and even made me better. I never did any kind of tests on this stuff before or a "how to" video,I just knew it worked.Plus I cant even tell you how many times I reread the directions thinking maybe I missed the part about neutralizing it with water.but with every doubt I might have had I was reassured and even more confident in the product and my own way of using it..
As for stripper I always liked aircraft stripper by Kleen Strip but I tried some called Jassco (or something like that) that might be even better ,both are available at Lowes...
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  #120 (permalink)  
Old 09-30-2011, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadbodyman
for stripper I always liked aircraft stripper by Kleen Strip but I tried some called Jasco that might be even better, both are available at Lowes...
Looked them up and curiously both are manufactured by W.M. Barr & Co., Inc., Memphis TN
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