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rebelbill1972 04-19-2007 12:53 AM

Paint does not match
 
My wife was recently involved in an accident and after getting the call that her Jeep was ready we went to look at it. Well, the paint does not match. The shop foreman told us that the only way to match it perfectly is to paint all of the vehicle.

Yesterday after speaking with the insurance company everyone at the body shop now insists it to be a perfect match.

The color is cactus green.

The shop foreman said this is the only shade available for that paint code. But after doing some research we found that there were two different clears available, metallic, and pearl.

Can anyone tell me which of these would give the paint a gold/tan tone in direct sunlight?

Thanks in advance for any help...

RB

MARTINSR 04-19-2007 01:28 AM

Rb, you are getting the run around by a poor repair shop, period. There is no reason a professional painter who paints collision repair for a living couldn't match ANY color to within reason. If this was a bumper or something that has to be "butt" up against the original color, then it is YOU who may be asking too much. Most of those colors are going to be off a little. I work where we do brand new never yet sold Toyotas and some of the bumpers are WAY different in color. This is the norm, but with most other repairs where a fender is replaced or something like that, you really should see very little to no difference. Between blending out the color to simply hand matchnig it, be damned what "versions" of the color are available. If you are a pro, you make it work.

Just what was replaced or repaired on the car?

Brian

rebelbill1972 04-19-2007 01:52 AM

re: Paint does not match
 
1 Attachment(s)
The entire front clip, hood, bumper, grill, both fenders, as well as painting the rear half of the passenger side.

When you look at the drivers door and the left fender you can see an obvious difference in the paint. The new paint has a gold or tan-ish tint to it.

RB

milo 04-19-2007 03:16 AM

It's true it will never match all the way unless evrything gets painted again at the same time (including what was just been painted this time)..... In some cases you are entitled to whats called DV since it will never be a uncrashed car and might be the recourse your looking for kinda depending on whos fault it was since insurance companies can be tricky if you let them ...
http://www.diminishedvalue.com/

jcclark 04-19-2007 05:51 AM

Did the new paint stop at the limits of the new repair?
Sounds like the new paint wasn't blended into the old paint.
It usually doesn't match if the new color was stopped at a body line,
like the end of the fender where it meets the door.
In that case the new paint has to be feathered throughout the door and the
door completely clearcoated.
If done right it should be undetectable.
It means painting additional panels for the shop, but the good shops
plan on it.
You should demand a better match. :pimp:

302 Z28 04-19-2007 07:23 AM

I agree with the consensus, the shop is blowing smoke up your %$##^&*%. A competent painter should be able to make a decent match. Stand your ground and do not accept a sub standard repair, it's your right.

Vince

jcclark 04-19-2007 07:40 AM

I'd rather paint the entire side of a car than have a customer of mine
out there with a door or fender a different color.
I don't need that type of advertisement. :pimp:

MARTINSR 04-19-2007 09:19 AM

So, it looks like they replaced the hood, but there was no (or little) damage on the left front fender? They likely blended the color from the hood onto the left front fender and did a poor job so the blend went to far, meeting the door. How is the match on the passenger side? There, it looks like the fender was replaced and the front passenger door had no damage (or very little at the leading edge) and the color would have been blended back on the door. At the rear of the door there would be no paint, only clear over the whole thing to protect it. This is the norm, and simply called a "Blend panel" (if there was no damage on it). But even if there was a little damage on the front of the door, the color would have been applied just there, then blended back.

What does the color look like at the passenger door to rear door (or quarter panel if this is a two door)?

Brian

F-BIRD'88 04-19-2007 10:09 AM

This happens all the time. its a game between the insurance adjusters and shop estimate writers. The bodyman and painter are stuck in the middle.
The insurance companies many times won't pay for the panels to be blended. Under the flat rate estimating system they are supposed to and the painter gets paid for the work required.
But the insurance companies just refuse to pay for these operations.(They will pull it right off a estimate)
If the shop does not play along, they will get the run around from the insurance co. (won't get paid or pay delayed etc).
Future jobs "written off" etc etc.
So they dump it on the painter. He either has to do the prep and bend for free or "cut the panel". (Don't do the blend and hope you won't notice it or won't care)
The only one more powerfull than the insurance companies is YOU! The customer. Stand your ground. Contact your insurance company and insist on seeing the job repair order/invoice and crash estimate.
Look for the paint time and see if the estimate and or job order lists for blend time. Wether it does or not insist that it should. You did not, do not /and will not agree to a two tone paint job. The insurance co will eventually have no choice but to have the car repainted. Wether that means a complete paint job is not your problem. Stand your ground.
If the collision repair shops had more backbone this would not happen. Take notice next time you're out for a drive at how many cars are two toned cause the "panel was cut".
This is one reason why the insurance companies own all the tall buildings. (They control something like 90% of all wealth) They can afford to fix your car properly.

Keep your cool, but stand your ground. Let them both (Ins Co and repair shop) know you will not let it go.

If nessessary get a lawyer to help you.
Can you post a picture that shows the panel mismatch?
I was a automotive painter for many many years. Some days its very challenging to say the least. Some times you jsut have to bite the bullet and paint the whole side.
Some times you have to create your own alternate paint formula by creating test spray out cards and work it till you get a good match. The light coloured metallics with pearl are especially challanging. But it can be done. Yes it takes extra time.
The paint companies that supply to that shop, will help.
They release new alternate formulas all the time.
I used to have quite a library of custom match paint formulas I made up my self over the years for Chryslers .... :sweat:

bourne51 04-19-2007 10:51 AM

stand your ground!!!!!!!!!
 
f-bird 88 is right stand your ground,but know they are going to re-paint 70-80% of the car before it will be liked by you.your getting only !/2 a paint job they are not doing the right thing and it shows, if the painter is worth his salt (painter wise),the painter would have blended the right paint and that should have been it,but it didnot happen so you have to tell them your going to the press and the all the other law people you must to get this right,so stand your ground.....................(bourne51)........

jcclark 04-19-2007 02:00 PM

I agree.
A lot of body shops get away with substandard work just because
most people accept it.
Most will wait to see if a customer accepts it before redoing it,
that way they end up redoing less.
Stand your ground and be firm and I bet you'll get it fixed right. :pimp:

Bob C 04-19-2007 02:37 PM

I understand both sides of this. The painter doesn't want to work for nothing and the ins.co. won't pay him to do it right. 25 years ago the body shop and the mechanical rate was the same and now the body shop rate is less than half. They keep taking away from the body shop and thats why I don't play their games. When I give an estimate I stand my ground and don't give into the ins. co. I would rather loose a job than do it their way.
ins. adjuster>>>> :spank:

Bob

rebelbill1972 04-19-2007 09:03 PM

re: Paint does not match
 
Thanks to everyone for the info...

To answer a few questions:

Yes we have already discussed diminished value(the other guy backed out of his driveway and pushed her across two lanes).

Yes the new paint stopped at the limits of the repairs,from the drivers door back and around the back, the tailgate, and the roof were not painted.The biggest noticeable difference is between the left front fender and the drivers door. The fender is slightly darker and has a very glittery gold tone where the original paint does not. Inside the passenger rear door you can see where they taped it off and now there is a ridge at the point where old meets new and it does not match there either, so I don't think they can really get away with the faded paint argument.

Talking to my wife on the phone she said the paperwork she was given lists only parts cost, paint cost, material cost, and labor cost totaling $4700.00. There is no detailed breakdown and I know this is not right...

We have made arrangements to meet with the insurance man tomorrow. Surprisingly enough he suggested that we meet away from the body shop to discuss this and then pending the result of that conversation go back and try to settle this with them.

MARTINSR 04-20-2007 12:38 AM

In California you would have a complaint for the Bureau Of Automotive Repair for an improper repair order. EVERY item should be listed.

You know what cracks me up is when everyone blames the insurance company. The insurance company didn't repair this car, and insurance company did not paint this car. Yes, they are a pain in the ars. But the PAINTER is the one who didn't match the color.

I don't know the rules in your state. But here, you could "reopen" the claim being it wasn't repaired properly. And, if the color doesn't match, there is a good posibility that the repairs them selves were done improperly as well.

You REALLY need to have a shop who comes with some recommendations to look it over. You had some structual damage, the rad support was pushed over pretty good. Have the thing looked at by another shop. But DON'T TELL THEM WHERE IT WAS REPAIRED. Tell them it was out of state while you were on vaction or something. You may get another shop who knows the guy or something and that whole thing will mean nothing.

Brian

rebelbill1972 04-20-2007 02:18 AM

re: Paint does not match
 
Believe it or not after only about 3 calls from me and 3 from my wife I think the insurance company figured out that I was not going to just go away. Ever since the supervisors got involved they have been very co-operative...

As for the claim, it has not been settled yet. We will not sign off on anything until we are 100% satisfied and we have made that very clear to the body shop and the insurance company.

And now for the part you will just love...The shop in question(who I will not name because at this point I still think that would be unprofessional)is probably one of if not the most respected and most recommended in the Hampton Roads/Tidewater area. They have done work for us in the past with no problems...

Depending on what happens after the meeting today, and definitely before we sign a settlement release I will be taking it to have it inspected by another shop...I'll keep you posted and again thanks for the help!!!

Bill


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