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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2007, 07:16 PM
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yes they all do have iso's in them

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2007, 07:26 PM
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Guys - you are killing me here (no pun intended w/ regard to the ISO's). This is "Hotrodders.com" right - and not "professional painters with full access to downdraft paintbooths.com". Renting paint booths is almost impossible (as others have said - this ain't 1972 anymore) and with the inevitable mistakes I'm likely to make (i.e. translation: redo's) probably impractical if I could even find one. With the 8 zillion posts in this forum surely someone here has successfully painted their car (using paints with ISO - they have ben around for 20+ years) in the most common of all garage configurations (i.e. 2 car attached) w/o killing everyone in the house or permanently stinking things up. I am planning on using a Hobbyair setup with a full suit for my own protection and will paint when no one else is home (the wife and I could even abandon the house for a day if necessary). This won't be a regular thing for me, but like most of us that end up in this forum - paying someone else to do it is not an option when you start seeing how much it will cost.
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Old 02-09-2007, 08:56 PM
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Guys,
I am planning on doing the same thing as soon as my car is ready for primer coats, then finally with the paint.
This is the situation: 2 1/2 car garage attached to the house via a shared living room wall, the other 3 walls are outside walls (minus the closets). I have a door leading to the back porch and one leading to the driveway on the other end of the garage. There is a window on each side wall as well as the 2 garage doors.
I am planning on making an exhaust fan setup in the window facing into the backyard with a box around it with filters on (similar to a spray booth system). I will also be making a fixture with filters on to fit the opposite window. What I am hoping to do is create a vacuum situation in the garage itself, nothing major, just enough pressure difference to keep drawing air in and hopefully away from the door into the house (of which I will be opening a few windows at the other end of the house... away from the exhaust window).
One of the things I am worried about with this setup is possibly drawing dirt in with the slight vacuum, but I think it's a starting point to keeping the house clean and the neighbors happy / or that the don't notice it.
Any thoughts?
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Old 02-09-2007, 09:19 PM
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Not the smartest thing to do, exposing you and yours to the dangers of modern paint chemicals. That said, I did my first paint job the exact same way! Don't make the same mistakes I did. You have one big advantage over myself 12 years ago, you know the dangers whereas I just did what my ego and ******* told me to. Let me advise you on two items necessary to make it as safe as possible. 1-buy a good gun like the LVH400 IWATA, this gun will minimize the overspray and keep the iso infiltration in your house to a minimum, also will minimize the fumes from escaping into your neighborhood alerting and pissing off your former good neighbors. 2- buy a fresh air breathing system or at least a good charcoal filtered full face mask (consult your local safety rep.) I had intentions of using a box-fan in my garage but quickly figured out when I created a negitive pressure within the garage it stirred up all the crap that I couldnt clean prior. I ended up lifting the garage door up halfway to let the fog out. I'm sure this post will get some neg. response since the smart thing is to find a safe place to do your thing!! We all do stupid s--- , the key is not impact others in our insanity.
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Old 02-09-2007, 10:50 PM
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I know this has been asked before but why couldnt you roll on the primer?
It would keep everything harmful to a minimum. I've seen it discussed in other forums and the only problem seems to be flash time. Couldn't you roll on a coat and let flash over night then roll on another coat let that flash and do your body filler over it. You have to sand it anyway so a little roughness shouldn't be a problem. Just curious if anybody has tried this?
Kim
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 01:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kim57
I know this has been asked before but why couldnt you roll on the primer?
It would keep everything harmful to a minimum. I've seen it discussed in other forums and the only problem seems to be flash time. Couldn't you roll on a coat and let flash over night then roll on another coat let that flash and do your body filler over it. You have to sand it anyway so a little roughness shouldn't be a problem. Just curious if anybody has tried this?
Kim

To someone elses question on primers and iso's...this is a phrase I learned 25 years ago and I haven't forgot it...

If it is catalyzed or can be atomized it can't be good for you!

If you use protective equipment and can get away with it (family and neighbors) why would there be a problem...unless your furnace is in your garage or you have another open ignition source.

You can brush primer on but for topcoat work it's too hard to control the mil thickness and blocking for paint would be nearly impossible...
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 06:52 AM
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First of all, if it had living space above it, I would be a little more concerned. If you have only 1 wall that is connected to the house, that is a big plus. I would also not want the furnace or gas fired water heater in the same garage.

OK... Here is what I would do if I had an attached garage and was going to paint in it. I would seal up the door into the house with tape, as the fumes will go thru there. If there are heating ducts in the garage, seal them up also. If there are electrical outlets on the common wall(s), I would cover them also. If the house is not going to be occupied for a short period, that is better. Make sure that you have plenty of air flow thru the garage to clear out the fumes. I would make sure that the air going out is filtered also. That is to trap the overspray, and hopefully keep it off of other things that you don't want painted.

Basically, these precautions are to prevent the smell and overspray from entering the house. The smell in a house can be very hard to get out, and some people are very sensitive to that. I am not a doctor or chemist, but I understand that the danger from the ISOs is short term, as they settle and are only hazardous when in vapor form. A professional paint booth simply isolates the fumes, filters out the solid particles somewhat, and releases them in the air above the normal breathing level(height).

Aaron
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 07:20 AM
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A good friend of mine ran a full time bodyshop within a residential area for years, houses were only 15 feet from both sides of his shop. He built a tall chimney for the exhaust on his booth and the vapors went up well above the height of all the houses in the area. No problems with the neighborhood. The shop has changed ownership but is still in business to this day. People have been shooting paint without a booth for years, play it smart and the health risks are minimal, build a temporary booth out of plastic if need be, have good airflow, wear a good mask or supplied air, keep the kids, wife, and neighbors away from any exposure. With a good setup the results will be equal to those found in a high dollar booth-setup time will be more but worth it.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Houston54
A friend painted his car in an attached garage and the smell got into everything in the house and evidently caused everything in his aquarium to go belly up. He was a bit pissed.
THIS says it all!!!!! The fish in the guys aquarium all died! I painted more than a few cars in the lacquer days in my garage, that was bad enough. But when I sprayed one in enamel, holy crap. I had one wall seperating the garage from the kitchen and living room. One door going into the kitchen. I TAPED the door shut. After painting the car there was over spray on the dishes IN the cabinets!!!!

And the ISOs are only part of it. The VAPORS are VERY strong. They will be there HOURS AND HOURS afterwards. You will have to open all the windows in the house and air it out for hours.

As I have said before I painted some shelves that went into store one time and after a full day in the summer to cure, I put them in the store and the whole place got sick! I went by there and all the doors were open airing it out and a few ladies had went home sick!!

YES it "can" be done, with enough preparation it can be done. But do your homework and keep your family away for HOURS AND HOURS.

Brian
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Old 02-10-2007, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by MARTINSR
YES it "can" be done, with enough preparation it can be done. But do your homework and keep your family away for HOURS AND HOURS.

Brian
Which is why I'm sending my wife on a 10 day trip to England to visit daughter and family.

Dave
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Houston54
A friend painted his car in an attached garage and the smell got into everything in the house and evidently caused everything in his aquarium to go belly up. He was a bit pissed.
__________________________________________________ _________
About fell out of chair laughing.

Never forget in 1977 left work at four to go to first day of a class, sat there for 3 hours listening to the typical first day BS of what were going to do.
Then the professor says, homework due Thursday:
If a swimming pool is 17x34 and holds 17,500 gallons of water and there are four people in the pool and they all piss a pint and a half.
How many parts per million of piss will you have?
Extra credit: How much water would you need to drink to consume one gram of piss?
I thought this is the stupidest MF I have herd.
Turned out is was the best homework I ever had to do.

My question is, was it 15 gallon tank, 30 gallon tank and how many lbs of fumes would it take to kill them?

Just curious.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 03:01 PM
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My question about all these cases would have to be...
What kind of ventilation did each case have? Apparently none of them were efficient enough to exchange the air fast enough to make it safe for even a person to be in there.

I also have another related question...
I have one of the old furnace fans (squirrel cage motor i believe some people call them) and it is attached via belt and pulleys to pull / push enough air to evacuate my garage that I don't see clouds of atomized paint when doing things.
Oh yeah the question... Is it better to put the fan to push air out the room and let the draft pull air in, or is is better to have the fan pressurize the room and let the fumes be pushed out the other end?
Anyone have experience with either or both?
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2007, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nhrafan26
My question about all these cases would have to be...
What kind of ventilation did each case have? Apparently none of them were efficient enough to exchange the air fast enough to make it safe for even a person to be in there.

I also have another related question...
I have one of the old furnace fans (squirrel cage motor i believe some people call them) and it is attached via belt and pulleys to pull / push enough air to evacuate my garage that I don't see clouds of atomized paint when doing things.
Oh yeah the question... Is it better to put the fan to push air out the room and let the draft pull air in, or is is better to have the fan pressurize the room and let the fumes be pushed out the other end?
Anyone have experience with either or both?
Both is best...but suction to clear the air at a min. because positive pressure alone is not enough to clear and exhange the air.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 02-12-2007, 05:29 PM
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OK, it sounds like adequate ventilation is REALLY key here. At one time I was considering buying a two or three hundred dollar "disposable" canopy setup which I could set up in the driveway - I might have to look into that a bit more (one challenge is most are either a very tight "1 car" size or a huge two car).

Martin - if paint managed to travel far enough to get on those dishes, I hate to see what the interior of the car looked like! ;>
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 02-12-2007, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cab
OK, it sounds like adequate ventilation is REALLY key here. At one time I was considering buying a two or three hundred dollar "disposable" canopy setup which I could set up in the driveway - I might have to look into that a bit more (one challenge is most are either a very tight "1 car" size or a huge two car).

Martin - if paint managed to travel far enough to get on those dishes, I hate to see what the interior of the car looked like! ;>
Unless you are talking anti-static fabric style portable garages...I'd be concerned about static being an ignition source...but that's me!
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